Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: how to approach this

  1. #1
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Kansas city, Kansas United States
    Posts
    334

    Post imported post

    well i been OC recently i gone from CCW to more OC. and havent ever had a problem till recently.

    here what happened i was eating at a place( no signs of no guns or anything like that. i even talked to the manager and he said it was ok) but then i was eating and the manager came up and asked me to go to my car and leave the gun there then return because a customer complained about me carrying .

    so the question i got is has anyone found a way to kinda talk about that to change their minds on kicking ppl or making them leave for having a gun. i mean i find it easier to approach the subject if they dont allow guns period, i not asking on how you deal with places that dont allow guns at all. i asking has anyone found a way to talk about it when a resteraunt allows gun as long as no other customers send a complaint. i mean this situation was even harder since they were not fluent in english. i mean i not great either, but it wasnt even their native language. i threw that in so ppl knew another side to what made it harder to talk to them about this. i not looking for ppl to diss foreingers. just curious if ppl found a tactic on talking about this or if ppl just pay and leave.

    this was the first time i ever been asked to leave. and it stumped me when it wasnt b/c they dont allow itexcept if a customer complains. and so i just like some imput mabye incase i run into this again.

  2. #2
    Regular Member cash50's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    St. Louis
    Posts
    349

    Post imported post

    Where was this at?

    I would go tell the foreigner to get used to it, he's in America, after all.

    As for the manager, I'd tell him to explain to the other guy it's legal.

    Then if he still wanted you to leave I wouldn't pay.

  3. #3
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Kansas city, Kansas United States
    Posts
    334

    Post imported post

    well i going to pay, i not wanting the police charges for eating and runing:P.

    and as far as your comments. yah i could of done better defending that it is legal.

    i think i didnt make it clear the foreigner was the manager. i don't know if he really tro to get the other customer who complained to understand its legal after i tell him to get use to it and that this is America.

    i don't think it had anything to do with him being a foreigner. the foreigner part vs non foreign difference was that if he wasn't a foreigner i think we could of understood each other better. and i could of made a beter case if i could of gone into more detail without losing him. he understood English but if i got into anything too detailed i could tell he was just lost.

    anyhow, i was wanting to get something that lead to a productive talk, not a disruptive or starting a problem. b/c in my opinion if i just cause a problem he just going to want you out of their and he not even going to try to attempt to see your point of view. especially if you don't pay:P

    but maybe i try that next time trying to state that its legal and if he brings up the fact that he has to look into the well being of other customers complaints. i mention to maybe tell the person that its legal. i

  4. #4
    Accomplished Advocate
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    1,924

    Post imported post

    goalseter88 wrote:
    ( no signs of no guns or anything like that. i even talked to the manager and he said it was ok)

    so i just like some imput mabye incase i run into this again.
    Do you ask when you CCW?

    You really have no idea what sparked it, perhaps it stuck him that you asked and that alarmed his as it had never happened before.

    Your not going to hear me yet promoting open carry, I am still debating it within myself, but I will tell you flat out I won't be asking permission, that is not even part of the debate for me.

    Because of my short and gray hair along with a lack of facial hair, I suspect most are going to label me a LEO.

    Since you did ask and the event got triggered, you lost your element of total surprise. If you had not told you could have presented it a lot differently and expressed how offended you were, by asking you almost alerted the manager that you knew it was going to be a problem.

    No big deal unless you loved the food.

    Never ask a question that you may not like the answer to.

    All things considered, I think you did it right.
    John C. Eastman Associate Dean of Chapman Universityís School of Law "the Second Amendment, like its sister amendments, does not confer a right but rather recognizes a natural right inherent in our humanity."

  5. #5
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Kansas city, Kansas United States
    Posts
    334

    Post imported post

    i didnt ask for me being there, i just happen to be OC while i wasthere to get the name/address for the place and figured i ask so that way i dont get a group their and they dont allow it. which apparently was a good thing since that prob would of been the case. course asking him didnt help but me eating their while OC showed me that they will side with the person who complains.

    yah i agree if it was just me being there to eati never would of asked permission either, especially if i was CCW and they cant even tell i carrying without me telling them i am.

  6. #6
    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Southeast, Missouri, USA
    Posts
    5,974

    Post imported post

    I would probably have politely said something along the lines of:

    Sir, you have a dilemma. You have one paying customer who is peacefully eating in your establishment breaking no laws who happens to be legally armed. You have another customer who objects to my being legally armed and in response you are asking me to leave my firearm unsupervised in my vehicle in your parking lot where any punk can smash a window and steal it and use it to rob or harm me, you or the customer who is complaining.

    Being that I am a law abiding citizen, if you request that I leave because of my firearm, I will peacefully do so, however, returning immediately or tomorrow or any other time will not happen if you have such a policy. So you can ask me to leave, I will do so and tell my numerous friends who also legally carry firearms of your policy. Or you can tell the other customer that what I am doing is perfectly legal and while you appreciate her concern, you are not inclined to ask paying customers to leave if they are not doing anything disruptive or illegal and that you support state and local law which I am following. It is entirely your choice.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

  7. #7
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Kansas city, Kansas United States
    Posts
    334

    Post imported post

    thanks deepdiver, that seems like a very good way to put it.

  8. #8
    Regular Member zekester's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Uvalde, Texas
    Posts
    665

    Post imported post

    I will have to agree with deepdiver....

    But you also have to remember, it is an owners right to ask you to leave, regardless of the circumstances or reasons.

    State your point, make every effort to stay, but do not cause a scene.

    "Note to ALL!!"

    Yes it is our right, but it is also the right of every American to disagree.

    We have to beable to keep our heads on this issuse or it will look like we are a bunch of loonies just trying to be "cowboys" with six shooters on or side.

    Keep a clear head, "deepdiver" has giving great advice, but if the owner decides it is not enough, say "thank you" and go away.
    GOD gave me rights!!!....The Constitutuion just confirms it!!

  9. #9
    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Southeast, Missouri, USA
    Posts
    5,974

    Post imported post

    zekester wrote:
    Keep a clear head, "deepdiver" has giving great advice, but if the owner decides it is not enough, say "thank you" and go away.
    Thanks.

    Leaving was part of my advice: "if you request that I leave because of my firearm, I will peacefully do so," however, stressing that following that by actually leaving without further discussion and certainly without argument if he chooses to go with the anti is a good point to stress.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

  10. #10
    Regular Member zekester's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Uvalde, Texas
    Posts
    665

    Post imported post

    deepdiver wrote:
    zekester wrote:
    Keep a clear head, "deepdiver" has giving great advice, but if the owner decides it is not enough, say "thank you" and go away.
    Thanks.

    Leaving was part of my advice: "if you request that I leave because of my firearm, I will peacefully do so," however, stressing that following that by actually leaving without further discussion and certainly without argument if he chooses to go with the anti is a good point to stress.
    You did give great advice....

    I do see that certain people on this forum seem to think that they have to "press" the issue.

    I guess all I was saying was be polite, respect all other opinons (whether you agree or not), but above all respect the owners of the property in which you decide to visit. I will respect your property and rights, please respect mine. It is your choice to go back, but only under the rules of theowner of the property.

    Don't be pissed, don't even be mad. It is their choice and we should go over and beyond to respect that in order for the OC issueto gain acceptance.

    Just my opinion...

    Zeke


    GOD gave me rights!!!....The Constitutuion just confirms it!!

  11. #11
    Campaign Veteran deepdiver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Southeast, Missouri, USA
    Posts
    5,974

    Post imported post

    zekester wrote:
    You did give great advice....

    I do see that certain people on this forum seem to think that they have to "press" the issue.

    I guess all I was saying was be polite, respect all other opinons (whether you agree or not), but above all respect the owners of the property in which you decide to visit. I will respect your property and rights, please respect mine. It is your choice to go back, but only under the rules of theowner of the property.

    Don't be pissed, don't even be mad. It is their choice and we should go over and beyond to respect that in order for the OC issueto gain acceptance.

    Just my opinion...

    Zeke
    Again thank you and I concur with your comments.
    Bob Owens @ Bearing Arms (paraphrased): "These people aren't against violence; they're very much in favor of violence. They're against armed resistance."

  12. #12
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Jefferson City, Mo., ,
    Posts
    490

    Post imported post

    zekester wrote:
    deepdiver wrote:
    zekester wrote:
    Keep a clear head, "deepdiver" has giving great advice, but if the owner decides it is not enough, say "thank you" and go away.
    Thanks.¬*

    Leaving was part of my advice: "if you request that I leave because of my firearm, I will peacefully do so," however, stressing that following that by actually leaving without further discussion and certainly without argument if he chooses to go with the anti is a good point to stress.
    You did give great advice....

    I do see that certain people on this forum seem to think that they have to "press" the issue.

    I guess all I was saying was be polite, respect all other opinons (whether you agree or not), but above all respect the owners of the property in which you decide to visit. I will respect your property and rights, please respect mine. It is your choice to go back, but only under the rules of the¬*owner of the property.

    Don't be pissed, don't even be mad. It is their choice and we should go over and beyond to respect that in order for the OC issue¬*to gain acceptance.

    Just my opinion...

    Zeke¬*

    ¬*
    Gotta agree , on ALL points.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •