okboomer
Regular Member
imported post
Kimse,
I would also like to point out one other difference between the culture of the USA and all European nations:
We are a nation of individuals in which we believe we personally are responsible for our own personal safety.
In European nations, you are not responsible for anything ... your government gives you the opinions you are supposed to have and they are the one's responsible for your safety ... so they then take from you the tools you would need to exercise any sort of responsibility for your own safety because those same tools could be used to oust them from power. As was pointed out in another post here, you have no recourse to defend yourself from any criminal element, tyrannical government or invasion from an aggressive force. In fact, it is not your government who has kept your country (or any other European nation) safe from invasion, but the deployment of US Troops on the continent.
There was a concept that has been very effective called MADD that has kept the USA and Soviet Union from using a nuclear weapon the past 60 years. This concept was that if one fired the first nuclear weapon, the other would respond with overwhelming destruction. This same concept has been proven to be effective at curtailing criminal behavior. While criminals are still preying upon other criminals in states that have some sort of personal gun carry, they are preying on law abiding citizens less and less. Again, to quote the FBI, who did a survey of convicted felons serving prison sentences, when asked the question of whether they would rob/assault an armed person, they overwhelming answered that they would look for unarmed prey, not armed prey.
Now, as to the question of how criminal's obtain guns, a lot of the guns are obtained through other criminal behavior such as home robbery, warehouse robbery, and what are known as straw purchases. These straw purchases are becoming less common as the enforcement of the laws against it are applied more forcefully.
And, just to clarify the figure that AZkopper (for your information he is law enforcement officer, retired) arrived at concerning the amount of gun violence, he might have neglected to include one more class that inflates the figure: many criminals who commit a crime with a gun is more likely to be a REPEAT offender with a gun, so the final figure might indicate actual gun crimes, but does not reflect the true quanitiy of people committing those crimes.
Finally, you will soon see that the gun violence will begin to sharply decline as criminals who use guns are prosecuted and incarcerated, or, to be brutally honest, are removed permanently from society. Society, whether in US or Europe, operates within a framework of accepted behavior and if a criminal will not modify his behavior to meet the normal civilized behavior accepted by society, then that society will have to remove him one way or another.
Do I, as a citizen who goes armed every day, all day, want to shoot and kill someone? Absolutely not! It would be a tragedy for the dead person's family and for me. Will I shoot if I am confronted with a situation in which I believe I might die at the hands of another? I don't know as I have never been at that point yet. Have I pulled my gun on another? Yes, on more than one occassion and each time, the bad guy decided he had somewhere else to be when he saw my weapon. Did it save my life? According to statistics for that particular metro and my demographics, probably, but more likely it kept me from suffering great bodily harm at the hands of another.
Rather than speak to Americans, perhaps you might gain a better understanding of us if you were to speak to Europeans who are living in the USA. They have seen the differences in the mindsets between the USA and the Continent and should be better able to discuss the differences with you from a point you can better understand.
And my final point of information is that I am a 50 year old woman who stands 62 inches tall and weighs 150 pounds. I am too old, too fat and too out of shape to be able to effectively defend myself from a determined attacker, nor can I outrun any attacker who is most likely to be both younger and more physically fit than I am now. I have also invested in advanced pistol training (same level as police in my state get) and have gained Expert Pistol Marksmanship in the same certifiedtesting as the police. I am not a police officer, nor do I want to be. I simply want to ensure that I am as experienced and disciplined as I can be in the use of this deadly force. I consider this to be part of the responsibility of carrying a gun.
I also hope you continue this discourse and expand your understanding of the citizens of the USA.
Kimse,
I would also like to point out one other difference between the culture of the USA and all European nations:
We are a nation of individuals in which we believe we personally are responsible for our own personal safety.
In European nations, you are not responsible for anything ... your government gives you the opinions you are supposed to have and they are the one's responsible for your safety ... so they then take from you the tools you would need to exercise any sort of responsibility for your own safety because those same tools could be used to oust them from power. As was pointed out in another post here, you have no recourse to defend yourself from any criminal element, tyrannical government or invasion from an aggressive force. In fact, it is not your government who has kept your country (or any other European nation) safe from invasion, but the deployment of US Troops on the continent.
There was a concept that has been very effective called MADD that has kept the USA and Soviet Union from using a nuclear weapon the past 60 years. This concept was that if one fired the first nuclear weapon, the other would respond with overwhelming destruction. This same concept has been proven to be effective at curtailing criminal behavior. While criminals are still preying upon other criminals in states that have some sort of personal gun carry, they are preying on law abiding citizens less and less. Again, to quote the FBI, who did a survey of convicted felons serving prison sentences, when asked the question of whether they would rob/assault an armed person, they overwhelming answered that they would look for unarmed prey, not armed prey.
Now, as to the question of how criminal's obtain guns, a lot of the guns are obtained through other criminal behavior such as home robbery, warehouse robbery, and what are known as straw purchases. These straw purchases are becoming less common as the enforcement of the laws against it are applied more forcefully.
And, just to clarify the figure that AZkopper (for your information he is law enforcement officer, retired) arrived at concerning the amount of gun violence, he might have neglected to include one more class that inflates the figure: many criminals who commit a crime with a gun is more likely to be a REPEAT offender with a gun, so the final figure might indicate actual gun crimes, but does not reflect the true quanitiy of people committing those crimes.
Finally, you will soon see that the gun violence will begin to sharply decline as criminals who use guns are prosecuted and incarcerated, or, to be brutally honest, are removed permanently from society. Society, whether in US or Europe, operates within a framework of accepted behavior and if a criminal will not modify his behavior to meet the normal civilized behavior accepted by society, then that society will have to remove him one way or another.
Do I, as a citizen who goes armed every day, all day, want to shoot and kill someone? Absolutely not! It would be a tragedy for the dead person's family and for me. Will I shoot if I am confronted with a situation in which I believe I might die at the hands of another? I don't know as I have never been at that point yet. Have I pulled my gun on another? Yes, on more than one occassion and each time, the bad guy decided he had somewhere else to be when he saw my weapon. Did it save my life? According to statistics for that particular metro and my demographics, probably, but more likely it kept me from suffering great bodily harm at the hands of another.
Rather than speak to Americans, perhaps you might gain a better understanding of us if you were to speak to Europeans who are living in the USA. They have seen the differences in the mindsets between the USA and the Continent and should be better able to discuss the differences with you from a point you can better understand.
And my final point of information is that I am a 50 year old woman who stands 62 inches tall and weighs 150 pounds. I am too old, too fat and too out of shape to be able to effectively defend myself from a determined attacker, nor can I outrun any attacker who is most likely to be both younger and more physically fit than I am now. I have also invested in advanced pistol training (same level as police in my state get) and have gained Expert Pistol Marksmanship in the same certifiedtesting as the police. I am not a police officer, nor do I want to be. I simply want to ensure that I am as experienced and disciplined as I can be in the use of this deadly force. I consider this to be part of the responsibility of carrying a gun.
I also hope you continue this discourse and expand your understanding of the citizens of the USA.
