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Thread: Audio recording and the cops?

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    Regular Member lance galloway's Avatar
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    I met someone yesterday and was taking about OC heis all for it but when I told him about the voice recorder I carry he said that you can not audio record someone without them knowing. He also said that the cops can take the recorder away from me if they want too. So do you have to tell the cops that you are audio recording them?

    IS ANY OFTHIS TRUE?

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    No.
    A. Gold

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    lance galloway wrote:
    I met someone yesterday and was taking about OC heis all for it but when I told him about the voice recorder I carry he said that you can not audio record someone without them knowing. He also said that the cops can take the recorder away from me if they want too. So do you have to tell the cops that you are audio recording them?

    IS ANY OFTHIS TRUE?
    Wisconsin is a state where only one party needs to know if they are being recorded, (one party consent) so yes it is legal to record a conversation between you and anyone else because you know you are recording.

    Will a cop take the recorder away?
    that depends on how much of a bunghole they are, if they treat you with respect and have nothing to fear with you playing that recording to their superiors or in a courtroom, why would they care?
    But if they are rude and going above their authority, I am sure many would liketo make that evidence go away.

    An honest and fair cop has nothing to fear about being recorded, but if your treat people they wayBrett Darrow( an OCDO member)was treatedin MO a few years back, Some people may find it hard to believe if you did not have the recording to prove it.

    Watch for yourself http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7B_yw...eature=related

    Adult language abounds in the video, so keep the volume down.

    Now imagine being confronted by a cop like this, and not having a recorder!!

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    Wisconsin Carry, Inc. Shotgun's Avatar
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    Read Chapter 968.31 of the Wisconsin statutes, it covers intercepting and recording wire, electronic and oral conversations.

    http://www.legis.state.wi.us/statutes/Stat0968.pdf


    A. Gold

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    The free man is a warrior. - Nietzsche "Twilight of the Idols"

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    968 deals with wire tapping. That is not the same as recording a personal conversation in person. That referrs to intercepting line communications.

    You can legally record any conversation that you are taking part in without the authorization of the other participants.

    You can not legally record someone else phone calls as you would not be a participant. Intercepting their calls and recording them would be wire tapping and would be illegal.

    Recording a personal coversation that you are a part of is not.

    As far as the cops taking your recorder, sure they could. Is it legal? doubtful and I would lean toward no it is not legal. How is taking your recorder any different then taking your firearm? Property is property.

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    Regular Member Canard's Avatar
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    Wisconsin is a one-party state and is the same reason they can record you on their dash-cameras without telling you that you are being recorded and use it as evidence against you.

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    J.Gleason wrote:
    968 deals with wire tapping. That is not the same as recording a personal conversation in person. That referrs to intercepting line communications.
    Take another look at it... it includes "oral communications."
    A. Gold

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    If you couldn't covertly record audio and video, how do these reporters get away with it?
    A commercial for a local news station WITI, shows its investigative reporter attaching a magnetic GPS tracking device to the underside of someone's car- that I have a serious problem with.

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    mr. parker wrote:
    If you couldn't covertly record audio and video, how do these reporters get away with it?
    A commercial for a local news station WITI, shows its investigative reporter attaching a magnetic GPS tracking device to the underside of someone's car- that I have a serious problem with.
    I don't think you're alone having a serious problem with that. I believe recently I saw some legislation proposed in Wisconsin to prohibit covertly attaching tracking devices to vehicles, with the usual exception for law enforcement.
    A. Gold

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    Y'all might consider just what is a 'tracking device' and its capabilities, especially using commercial hardware.

    We all have experience with the failings of cellphones, the hypothetical transmitting aspect of a device.

    I have considerable experience with GPS receivers being blocked by just tree cover, a frame roof, a sheet metal automobile roof or metalized windshield.

    With commercial hardware, a real time tracking device is unlikely.

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    http://www.channel3000.com/politics/...76/detail.html

    I can't share your confidence in the failings of the technology. There is considerable difference in the sensitivity of GPS devices in my experience. My handheld GPS also is easily blocked by trees, but my car device works well indoors, as does my phone GPS.
    A. Gold

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    Shotgun wrote:
    J.Gleason wrote:
    968 deals with wire tapping. That is not the same as recording a personal conversation in person. That referrs to intercepting line communications.
    Take another look at it... it includes "oral communications."
    Talking over the phone is oral communications

    I have asked a Judge on this issue and I have been informed that you can legally tape any conversation that you personally are a participant in. Whether the other participants are knowledgeable of your recording or not.

    These recordings are also admissable in court.

    There is a difference between listening in to two ther peoples phone conversation and recording their conversation. That is wire tapping.

    For example, lets say that Nutczak and I were at his home and he called Shotgun on a three way call that shotgun did not know about. Lets say that I was the person listening in on that three way but never participated in the conversation and Shotgun was not aware that I was listening in. I can not legally record the conversation.

    Now if Shotgun was aware that I was present in the three way and I was an active participant in the conversation then I could legally record the conversation.

    I must disagree on your understanding of 968. I have recorded peoples conversations and successfully used those recordings as evidence in court.



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    mr. parker wrote:
    If you couldn't covertly record audio and video, how do these reporters get away with it?
    A commercial for a local news station WITI, shows its investigative reporter attaching a magnetic GPS tracking device to the underside of someone's car- that I have a serious problem with.
    what about the locator on your cell phone? Don't think big brother could use that any time he wanted? That is the price of technology.

  14. #14
    McX
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    use a cheap, buy airtime phone, no technology other than just being a phone.

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    J.Gleason wrote:
    Shotgun wrote:
    J.Gleason wrote:
    968 deals with wire tapping. That is not the same as recording a personal conversation in person. That referrs to intercepting line communications.
    Take another look at it... it includes "oral communications."
    Talking over the phone is oral communications

    I have asked a Judge on this issue and I have been informed that you can legally tape any conversation that you personally are a participant in. Whether the other participants are knowledgeable of your recording or not.

    These recordings are also admissable in court.

    There is a difference between listening in to two ther peoples phone conversation and recording their conversation. That is wire tapping.

    For example, lets say that Nutczak and I were at his home and he called Shotgun on a three way call that shotgun did not know about. Lets say that I was the person listening in on that three way but never participated in the conversation and Shotgun was not aware that I was listening in. I can not legally record the conversation.

    Now if Shotgun was aware that I was present in the three way and I was an active participant in the conversation then I could legally record the conversation.

    I must disagree on your understanding of 968. I have recorded peoples conversations and successfully used those recordings as evidence in court.
    JG, I'm puzzled by what you perceive the disagreement to be. I completely agree with you that one may record any conversation of which they are a participant or at least one of the participants is aware of the recording. I've never stated anything other than that.

    A face-to-face conversation is also "an oral communication" and I believe it too is covered by 968. Obviously one does not need any sort of mechanical device to have a communication with another person.
    A. Gold

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    McX wrote:
    use a cheap, buy airtime phone, no technology other than just being a phone.
    The location of even the most simple cellphone can be determined to within a certain area by triangulation of it's signal to the various towers in the area. GPS equipped cellphones can be located with greater precision. Sitting inside my house, my own phone normally indicates that I'm in my driveway or neighbor's yard, but it is usually within 3-5 yards of my actual location. One can deactivate the GPS on a phone, but the only practical way to render it completely untraceable as to location is to turn it completely off.

    On the other hand, if someone seriously thought they were being tracked through their cellphone and didn't appreciate it, all they would need to do is tape the phone to a delivery truck or semi, and let them follow it all across the countryside.
    A. Gold

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    Shotgun wrote:
    McX wrote:
    use a cheap, buy airtime phone, no technology other than just being a phone.
    The location of even the most simple cellphone can be determined to within a certain area by triangulation of it's signal to the various towers in the area. GPS equipped cellphones can be located with greater precision. Sitting inside my house, my own phone normally indicates that I'm in my driveway or neighbor's yard, but it is usually within 3-5 yards of my actual location. One can deactivate the GPS on a phone, but the only practical way to render it completely untraceable as to location is to turn it completely off.

    On the other hand, if someone seriously thought they were being tracked through their cellphone and didn't appreciate it, all they would need to do is tape the phone to a delivery truck or semi, and let them follow it all across the countryside.
    The point is "they" won't know the phone is yours to track it with a prepaid cell ....

  18. #18
    Wisconsin Carry, Inc. Shotgun's Avatar
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    That's contingent upon whether your actual identity is important at the time of the tracking. Once they locate, they can ID at leisure.
    A. Gold

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    The free man is a warrior. - Nietzsche "Twilight of the Idols"

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    Shotgun wrote:
    mr. parker wrote:
    If you couldn't covertly record audio and video, how do these reporters get away with it?
    A commercial for a local news station WITI, shows its investigative reporter attaching a magnetic GPS tracking device to the underside of someone's car- that I have a serious problem with.
    I don't think you're alone having a serious problem with that. I believe recently I saw some legislation proposed in Wisconsin to prohibit covertly attaching tracking devices to vehicles, with the usual exception for law enforcement.
    If it keeps us safe, why not? Wasn't there a supreme court decision about this recently?

  20. #20
    McX
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    On the other hand, if someone seriously thought they were being tracked through their cellphone and didn't appreciate it, all they would need to do is tape the phone to a delivery truck or semi, and let them follow it all across the countryside



    *i see you saw the movie Thief too!

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    McX wrote:
    On the other hand, if someone seriously thought they were being tracked through their cellphone and didn't appreciate it, all they would need to do is tape the phone to a delivery truck or semi, and let them follow it all across the countryside



    *i see you saw the movie Thief too!
    Um.... no. Should I?
    A. Gold

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    Shotgun wrote:
    J.Gleason wrote:
    Shotgun wrote:
    J.Gleason wrote:
    968 deals with wire tapping. That is not the same as recording a personal conversation in person. That referrs to intercepting line communications.
    Take another look at it... it includes "oral communications."
    Talking over the phone is oral communications

    I have asked a Judge on this issue and I have been informed that you can legally tape any conversation that you personally are a participant in. Whether the other participants are knowledgeable of your recording or not.

    These recordings are also admissable in court.

    There is a difference between listening in to two ther peoples phone conversation and recording their conversation. That is wire tapping.

    For example, lets say that Nutczak and I were at his home and he called Shotgun on a three way call that shotgun did not know about. Lets say that I was the person listening in on that three way but never participated in the conversation and Shotgun was not aware that I was listening in. I can not legally record the conversation.

    Now if Shotgun was aware that I was present in the three way and I was an active participant in the conversation then I could legally record the conversation.

    I must disagree on your understanding of 968. I have recorded peoples conversations and successfully used those recordings as evidence in court.
    JG, I'm puzzled by what you perceive the disagreement to be. I completely agree with you that one may record any conversation of which they are a participant or at least one of the participants is aware of the recording. I've never stated anything other than that.

    A face-to-face conversation is also "an oral communication" and I believe it too is covered by 968. Obviously one does not need any sort of mechanical device to have a communication with another person.
    I misread your statement, I thought you were arguing that you can not legally tape record. I was wondering why you would argue that. I guess that is what happens when you work to many shifts. Sorry.

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    Not a problem. Confusion cleared up all around. Take some time off and have fun!
    A. Gold

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    The free man is a warrior. - Nietzsche "Twilight of the Idols"

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