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Thread: Officer demeanor change...

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    Regular Member Tomas's Avatar
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    While reading the Search and Seizure Manual linked in the "Stop and Identify" thread, a question struck me. It may seem a little off topic, but...

    Just curious if others have ever run into a sudden change in demeanor of a police officer after a pretext traffic stop where they were initially playing the 'big bad cop' part until they belatedly ask if there is anything in the car they should know about and you indicate there are loaded firearms?

    In my instance, the lane the officer was in ended after ample warning, and he jumped in behind me and pulled me over for not yielding to him early enough to satisfy him. (It was not my lane that ended, but the right traffic lane he was in, and I moved out of the remaining lane to the left turn lane to make my turn when it became available to me.)

    Anyway, when he finally asked, I told him there were two loaded pistols in the car, he got really nervous and agitated and I had to direct him several times to the CPL he was holding in his hand before he even appeared to comprehend what I was saying, at which time he glanced at it, and handed my driver's license, insurance card, registration and CPL back and politely wished me a good day while looking like he wanted to pee himself.

    I found it odd behavior, anyone else? Seemed as though he just wanted to forget the whole stop ever happened.

    (This was Lakewood, evening stop, dark factory tinted windows, Scion xB, and took place recently - since the Forza shootings. Primary carry in Condition One.)


    No tyranny is so irksome as petty tyranny: The officious demands of policemen, government clerks, and electromechanical gadgets. -- Edward Abbey

    • • • Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? Faciémus!• • •

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    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
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    Once, after my car was burglarized in my driveway a few feet below my bedroom window and my GPS was stolen. It was 4am and I called the FWPD. They came out and I gave them my information for a police report. He called in my ID and when they replied back to him (in his earbud, but loud enough my wife and I could both hear) that I had a CPL, a younger officer working with him (I believe he was an FTO) suddenly was a bit nervous. I was carrying at that time concealed because it was cold out. The senior officer was pleasant and never asked if I had a firearm, finished his report and gave me a case number. Afterwards, my wife pointed it out and we had a good chuckle about the junior officers reaction.
    Live Free or Die!

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    69Charger
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    I have told officers on several occasions that I was carrying my weapon and every time they were very appreciative of me telling them and not another word was said about it. I give them a 10 for the way they handled this with me.
    Dave

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    Has only come up twice. The first guy was a bit nervous at first, but started smirking and asked if I was going to shoot him. After I told him, "No" he lightened up and we ended up bs'ing about Glocks, P'mags and everything plastic these days

    Second time I spat out that I was carrying and he asked me "where" I mentioned my front pants pocket. At that point he told me to "keep it in my pants" with a big ol grin and walked back to check my license. We both chuckled a bit, he told me to slow down and that was that.

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    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
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    I was pulled over a few weeks ago. Officer asked me for my information and I handed him my CPL and told him "I am armed right now." He went back to his car, ran me then came back, handed me my information and said "thank you ma'am for letting me know you were armed...I don't like surprises." I said, "I don't like surprising officers."
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

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    I found it odd behavior, anyone else?


    Nope.
    It may seem a little off topic, but...

    Yep, but go ahead and solicit stories of these types of contacts anyway.How is thishelpful for the OC movement though.

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    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
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    erps wrote:
    Yep, but go ahead and solicit stories of these types of contacts anyway.How is thishelpful for the OC movement though.
    I never thought you would ask:

    This thread is helpful because when we engage officers in a respectful, rational way it creates a positive image of law-abiding citizens who own and carry firearms. Also, when people come onto this page, who are not members, they can read how we engage officers in a respectful way as firearm owners and carriers.
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

  8. #8
    Regular Member Tomas's Avatar
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    erps wrote:
    It may seem a little off topic, but...
    Yep, but go ahead and solicit stories of these types of contacts anyway.How is thishelpful for the OC movement though.
    Because it just may shed some light on LEO behavior when they encounter us OC in these or other circumstances.

    My curiosity is mostly about if there is a noticeable change in demeanor before and after discovering a person is armed.

    Next!
    No tyranny is so irksome as petty tyranny: The officious demands of policemen, government clerks, and electromechanical gadgets. -- Edward Abbey

    • • • Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? Faciémus!• • •

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    I have had one encounter that I will remember til the day I die. As I was being questioned about my OC habits, the officer mentioned, "Well if some ninjafied guy sees you have a gun and comes after your gun to take it away, what are you gonna be able to do about it? You have no surprise advantage cause it's not concealed."

    "Well Officer XYZ if I remember right when I went through the academy for reserves it was taught that the goal of anyone trying to forcefully take your firearm from you is that they intend to use it against you. Is that still the school of thought?"

    "Well yes that is what they do teach but..."

    "Well in that case he intends to do me grievous harm or kill me so I would shoot the aggressor as soon as the opportunity came about."

    "Well then you and I would be having a whole different kind of conversation about your judgement and decision..."

    "Ahh but officer that decision is not up to you alone is it? It would be up to the prosecutor and a jury. AND while we're on the subject, I notice you have a Safariland 6380 on your side with your Glock. Same holster I carry in except I have the 6380 with the Sentry locking systems, adding additional levels of retension. Do you find your holster inadequate to fulfil you duties? Oh and while we are in official mode here, what was your original RAS for stopping me again?

    "Have a good day sir"



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    I haven't been pulled over in quite some time (knock on wood) so I haven't really had to deal with this.

    A good friend of mine got pulled over while riding his motorcycle, and he informed the officer that he was carrying. He ended up layed out on the pavement (still armed) until her backup showed up. The backup officer did let him off with a warning because of how the incident went down (doing well over the speed limit) and corrected her on how to handle that situation.

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    It wasn't a traffic stop, but it was a visit from the local PD
    My neighbors had a prowler. They saw his shadowy shape, heard him in the garden shed, and called 911. They saw him go up the drive toward my house. They called me so I got my pistol and checked the windows.
    The cop showed up and checked the neighbor's place. found footprints around the garden shed.
    I was watching from my front porch, pistol in hand, kind of behind my leg, not wanting to seem a threat to the LEO.
    As he came up the drive to my porch and started asking questions, I told him I had the pistol in hand, and lit the laser sight so he'd know the muzzle was down.
    He got kind of hesitant for a bit, but then wanted to check my back yard.
    I told him it was a big mistake for a perp to go back there, as the fence/shrubs were all 8 feet tall, and I had let the dog (shepard/rotty mix) loose back there when this all started. If the perp was back there. we'd know it from the screams.
    Anyway, he didn't want to walk in front of me, so I offered to clear the area in front of him. 'sides, I needed to make sure the dog knew it was OK for a stranger to come in the back gate.
    I led the LEO back to the gate, got the dog, and led back to the shed and cleared the area with the LEO.
    He thanked me for my cooperation, and as he left the property, said not all LEO's might be comfortable with homeowner carrying/clearing in their presence.
    I told him the BG had a lot more to worry about than the homeowner or the cop.

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    I was pulled over a few years back going over the 509 bridge coming back from Seattle around 1 or 2 AM on a Friday or Saturday. I drive a modified honda hatch back. I figured the officer was pulling me over for something car related.

    As I pulled over to the right hand side with my hazards on, I turned on my cabin lights and rolled down my windows so the officer could see inside the car. I had my girlfriend in the car and I told her not to say anything regarding my firearm as I did not want to alarm the officer.

    I took out my drivers license and my CPL and placed them on the dash. The officer approached from the right side of the car carefully and was shinning his flashlight into the car. When he got to the window, I greeted him with a friendly "Good Evening officer." He asked if I knew why he pulled me over and I said I wasn't sure.

    I handed him my CPL which was ontop of the DL (both of which were on top of the dash) and proceeded to say in a loud but friendly tone "Officer, as a courtesy to you I wanted to inform you that I am a WA state CPL holder and am currently armed at the 3 O'clock position. How would you like me to proceed? " This whole time, my hands were on the steering wheel at the 10 and 2 O'clock position. The officer looked at me oddly and I repeated myself again as he looked at my CPL and DL.

    I believe the officer did not hear me the first time due to the noise from passing cars. The officer replied "Oh great! then you are one of the good guys then right? Give me one second so I can call this in and please don't make any sudden movements."

    After the officer called in my CPL his attitude became very friendly and we had a small chat. He mentioned that people often don't pay attention to the speed changes on the 509 bridge and lots of people get tickets for it. He thanked me for informing him about my CPL. As he handed me back my DL and CPL he said "We really need to look out for the bad guys (and points to taxi cabs flying down the street)." He wished me a safe drive home and that was that.

    All in all I was very pleased with my encounter with the officer.

    :celebrate:celebrate:celebrate:celebrate

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    I've never been pulled over while carrying. But I've always planned on not saying anything unless asked. Of course, as a courtesy, I'd put my hands on the steering wheel until they told me to get my license and registration.
    Quote Originally Posted by SayWhat View Post

    Shooters before hooters.

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    G22Paddy wrote:
    I've never been pulled over while carrying. But I've always planned on not saying anything unless asked. Of course, as a courtesy, I'd put my hands on the steering wheel until they told me to get my license and registration.
    Yep, I never volunteer more information than needed. I never tell them that I am armed. Have I been treated differently because I am armed, yes indeed.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    I carry in a small of the back holster so I always tell the officer I have my weapon on me, because when I reach for my wallet my weapon could be easily seen so I dont want to surprise the officer and have him think Im going to draw on him.
    The officers I have gotten pulled over by thank me for informing them and I seem to get alot more warnings than tickets so its working out for me so far

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    Regular Member Aryk45XD's Avatar
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    I have had good and bad experience with LEO before I carried openly. Since then, I have had nothing but polite exchanges with them.

  17. #17
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Hey that reminds me ARyk. Post your story about the convience store in Renton. We need some positive open carry did good stories. It shows we do prevent crime......(that's the teaser) LOL.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Regular Member Aryk45XD's Avatar
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    oh, the non-event. I'll make it short because i'm on my phone. A few weeks ago I was in Renton and looked up at the clerk with a shocked look on her face. I asked what the matter was after taking a quick glance. She thanked me for having my gun in the open. Apparently while my attention was on my change, a guy ran into the store with a gun in hand, looked at my gun, and ran out. Guess he didn't intend on using his. I didn't even know what I did until I was told. I haven't seen her at the store since though.

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    Abut a year ago was driving east on birchwood ave in bellingham and got to the guide meridian it was late, I was late for work I went straight in a left hand turn lane to go up squalicum parkway to the hospital and got pulled over by BPD he came up I had my hands on the steering wheel he asked if I had any fire arms in the vehicle pointed to my right hip and got out of the vehicle so i could open my box next to my hip so he could see the gun gave him my cpl drivers license insurance and got a warning i was scared first time I have got pulled over.

  20. #20
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    My personal opinion is to make it a new thread when you get home. It might be something that get's moved to general boards too. I think it is a great example of why we open carry. And deserves a thread of its own.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  21. #21
    Regular Member Aryk45XD's Avatar
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    sudden valley gunner wrote:
    My personal opinion is to make it a new thread when you get home. It might be something that get's moved to general boards too. I think it is a great example of why we open carry. And deserves a thread of its own.
    right you are. I'll elaborate when I get home.

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    I was pulled over last week in Fircrest. When the officer came to the window, I handed him my license, cpl, etc. I was carrying at the time but didn't tell him so (just handed him the cpl).

    He handed the cpl back to me and said, "I don't need this". He was very friendly the entire time he was writing me a speeding ticket.

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    tacosalad wrote:
    I was pulled over last week in Fircrest. When the officer came to the window, I handed him my license, cpl, etc. I was carrying at the time but didn't tell him so (just handed him the cpl).

    He handed the cpl back to me and said, "I don't need this". He was very friendly the entire time he was writing me a speeding ticket.
    Thankyou for your donation today. Drive Safely and have a nice day.

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    Regular Member 1245A Defender's Avatar
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    why did you give him your CPL??
    license, registration and insurance!
    :what:
    EMNofSeattle wrote: Your idea of freedom terrifies me. So you are actually right. I am perfectly happy with what you call tyranny.....

    “If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”

    Stand up for your Rights,, They have no authority on their own...

    All power is inherent in the people,
    it is their right and duty to be at all times ARMED!

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    1245A Defender wrote:
    why did you give him your CPL??
    license, registration and insurance!
    :what:
    It was a low key way of letting him know I was armed. I figured it would be polite.

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