Aryk45XD
Regular Member
imported post
sudden valley gunner wrote:
sudden valley gunner wrote:
right you are. I'll elaborate when I get home.
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Officer demeanor change...
- Thread starter Tomas
- Start date
tacosalad
Regular Member
imported post
I was pulled over last week in Fircrest. When the officer came to the window, I handed him my license, cpl, etc. I was carrying at the time but didn't tell him so (just handed him the cpl).
He handed the cpl back to me and said, "I don't need this". He was very friendly the entire time he was writing me a speeding ticket.
I was pulled over last week in Fircrest. When the officer came to the window, I handed him my license, cpl, etc. I was carrying at the time but didn't tell him so (just handed him the cpl).
He handed the cpl back to me and said, "I don't need this". He was very friendly the entire time he was writing me a speeding ticket.
Glock17
Regular Member
imported post
tacosalad wrote:
tacosalad wrote:
Thankyou for your donation today. Drive Safely and have a nice day. :uhoh:
1245A Defender
Regular Member
imported post
why did you give him your CPL??
license, registration and insurance!
:cuss::banghead::what::uhoh:
why did you give him your CPL??
license, registration and insurance!
:cuss::banghead::what::uhoh:
tacosalad
Regular Member
imported post
1245A Defender wrote:
1245A Defender wrote:
It was a low key way of letting him know I was armed. I figured it would be polite.
sudden valley gunner
Regular Member
imported post
Uh oh here we go again.
And for the ensuing debate I am on the side of not informing officers you are armed.
Uh oh here we go again.
And for the ensuing debate I am on the side of not informing officers you are armed.
gogodawgs
Campaign Veteran
imported post
tacosalad wrote:
You may give it to him, you are not required to do so as it has nothing to do with driving an automobile.
You will not be viewed as "one of the good guys".
tacosalad wrote:
You may give it to him, you are not required to do so as it has nothing to do with driving an automobile.
You will not be viewed as "one of the good guys".
tacosalad
Regular Member
imported post
sudden valley gunner wrote:
sudden valley gunner wrote:
well... I'm not here to debate. I'm here to share and learn.
Tomas
Regular Member
imported post
tacosalad wrote:
We each make our own choices on how we interact with people and what we are willing or unwilling to do.
For myself, handing over my driver's license and CPL to the officer, before I start rummaging in the glovebox for my other papers, is the simplest, quickest, and safest way to let an officer know I may be better armed than he is. I know I do not need to do it, but it costs me nothing.
(I rarely get stopped, so I thought this trough just to be ready if I was stopped. My last two traffic stops were one in 2010 and one in 1978 or so.)
Even in presenting ID at a bar or whatever when asked for ID, I do not present my driver's license or CPL, but instead my Passport Card which has name, picture, and DOB, but not address. There is no need for a waitress to know my address.
We all have our own idiosyncrasies when it comes to ID. Those are a couple of mine.
tacosalad wrote:
For no reason other than I also feel it is polite to let the officer know to expect a weapon before he suddenly sees one, I agree with tacosalad on this.
We each make our own choices on how we interact with people and what we are willing or unwilling to do.
For myself, handing over my driver's license and CPL to the officer, before I start rummaging in the glovebox for my other papers, is the simplest, quickest, and safest way to let an officer know I may be better armed than he is. I know I do not need to do it, but it costs me nothing.
(I rarely get stopped, so I thought this trough just to be ready if I was stopped. My last two traffic stops were one in 2010 and one in 1978 or so.)
Even in presenting ID at a bar or whatever when asked for ID, I do not present my driver's license or CPL, but instead my Passport Card which has name, picture, and DOB, but not address. There is no need for a waitress to know my address.
We all have our own idiosyncrasies when it comes to ID. Those are a couple of mine.
SaintJacque
Regular Member
imported post
Sylvia Plath wrote:
Sylvia Plath wrote:
An excellent reply to a smart @$$ post lol.
kwiebe
Regular Member
imported post
If you are asked for your CPL, what are everyone's thoughts on just letting the officer look at it, vs. handing it to the officer?
I believe you are only required to show it. If you let go of it, there's at least a chance you won't get it back. And I never like to do anything the State doesn't actually require me to do. Curious.
If you are asked for your CPL, what are everyone's thoughts on just letting the officer look at it, vs. handing it to the officer?
I believe you are only required to show it. If you let go of it, there's at least a chance you won't get it back. And I never like to do anything the State doesn't actually require me to do. Curious.
Tomas
Regular Member
imported post
kwiebe wrote:
kwiebe wrote:
I don't know the legal requirements one way or the other, but I suspect it may be the same as a driver's license - if they ask for you to physically remove it from your wallet and had it to them, that is likely the best thing to do.
gogodawgs
Campaign Veteran
imported post
kwiebe wrote:
Quoted from my CPL:
Interesting observance, as if I handed it to the officer it would no longer be in my immediate possession. Therefore, if I hold it up and he can see my name and the expiration date, it is displayed.
"Sorry officer, I cannot hand it to you otherwise I am in violation"
kwiebe wrote:
Quoted from my CPL:
Interesting observance, as if I handed it to the officer it would no longer be in my immediate possession. Therefore, if I hold it up and he can see my name and the expiration date, it is displayed.
"Sorry officer, I cannot hand it to you otherwise I am in violation"
Tomas
Regular Member
imported post
RCW 46.20.017Immediate possession and displayed on demand.
*** CHANGE IN 2010 *** (SEE 6239-S.SL) ***
Every licensee shall have his driver's license in his immediate possession at all times when operating a motor vehicle and shall display the same upon demand to any police officer or to any other person when and if required by law to do so. The offense described in this section is a nonmoving offense.
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/Rcw/default.aspx?cite=46.20.017
________
RCW 46.61.020Refusal to give information to or cooperate with officer — Penalty.
(1) It is unlawful for any person while operating or in charge of any vehicle to refuse when requested by a police officer to give his or her name and address and the name and address of the owner of such vehicle, or for such person to give a false name and address, and it is likewise unlawful for any such person to refuse or neglect to stop when signaled to stop by any police officer or to refuse upon demand of such police officer to produce his or her certificate of license registration of such vehicle, his or her insurance identification card, or his or her vehicle driver's license or to refuse to permit such officer to take any such license, card, or certificate for the purpose of examination thereof or to refuse to permit the examination of any equipment of such vehicle or the weighing of such vehicle or to refuse or neglect to produce the certificate of license registration of such vehicle, insurance card, or his or her vehicle driver's license when requested by any court. Any police officer shall on request produce evidence of his or her authorization as such.
(2) A violation of this section is a misdemeanor.
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/Rcw/default.aspx?cite=46.61.020
_______
The wording in the first section above is very similar to the wording for a CPL, requiring a drivere's license to be in possession and displayed on demand.
The second section further allows an officer to take and examine the license...
RCW 46.20.017Immediate possession and displayed on demand.
*** CHANGE IN 2010 *** (SEE 6239-S.SL) ***
Every licensee shall have his driver's license in his immediate possession at all times when operating a motor vehicle and shall display the same upon demand to any police officer or to any other person when and if required by law to do so. The offense described in this section is a nonmoving offense.
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/Rcw/default.aspx?cite=46.20.017
________
RCW 46.61.020Refusal to give information to or cooperate with officer — Penalty.
(1) It is unlawful for any person while operating or in charge of any vehicle to refuse when requested by a police officer to give his or her name and address and the name and address of the owner of such vehicle, or for such person to give a false name and address, and it is likewise unlawful for any such person to refuse or neglect to stop when signaled to stop by any police officer or to refuse upon demand of such police officer to produce his or her certificate of license registration of such vehicle, his or her insurance identification card, or his or her vehicle driver's license or to refuse to permit such officer to take any such license, card, or certificate for the purpose of examination thereof or to refuse to permit the examination of any equipment of such vehicle or the weighing of such vehicle or to refuse or neglect to produce the certificate of license registration of such vehicle, insurance card, or his or her vehicle driver's license when requested by any court. Any police officer shall on request produce evidence of his or her authorization as such.
(2) A violation of this section is a misdemeanor.
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/Rcw/default.aspx?cite=46.61.020
_______
The wording in the first section above is very similar to the wording for a CPL, requiring a drivere's license to be in possession and displayed on demand.
The second section further allows an officer to take and examine the license...
gogodawgs
Campaign Veteran
imported post
Tomas wrote:
Tomas wrote:
Interesting, however there is one big difference. One is a crime and one is not! It is a crime (misdemeanor) to refuse your DL. It is only a civil infraction if you do not have your CPL.
kwiebe
Regular Member
imported post
gogodawgs wrote:
This got me thinking what the law says about driver licenses. At first glance, it appears to also only specify "display". But this additional statute requires more, for a driver's license:
RCW 46.61.020
...refuse to permit such officer to take any such license, card, or certificate for the purpose of examination thereof...
There doesn't appear to be any equivalent statute for the CPL.
gogodawgs wrote:
You took it a step further---I like it.
This got me thinking what the law says about driver licenses. At first glance, it appears to also only specify "display". But this additional statute requires more, for a driver's license:
RCW 46.61.020
...refuse to permit such officer to take any such license, card, or certificate for the purpose of examination thereof...
There doesn't appear to be any equivalent statute for the CPL.
geojohn
Regular Member
imported post
FWIW, I seem to recall that the speeding ticket I received indicated somewhere on it that I had a CPL. This means that the LEO had a means to check, based on my drivers license. The point is, the officer can discover whether you've been issued a CPL, so there's probably not much point in supplying it if you're not asked to.
FWIW, I seem to recall that the speeding ticket I received indicated somewhere on it that I had a CPL. This means that the LEO had a means to check, based on my drivers license. The point is, the officer can discover whether you've been issued a CPL, so there's probably not much point in supplying it if you're not asked to.
Tomas
Regular Member
imported post
geojohn wrote:
Once I hand the LEO my driver's license, and they call it in or enter it on his/her computer, the fact that the holder of the license has a CPL should also come back.
HOWEVER if s/he didn't check the plate or license yet, there is that window where the only way they would know is if I told them or if they discover it by seeing or feeling it.
That window is when I personally feel more comfortable with them knowing before they find out on their own.
If they already know to expect a LEGAL weapon, I feel their reaction might be a lot calmer than if they doesn't expect it, and suddenly spot it.
That just my personal feeling, your mileage may vary...
geojohn wrote:
Yes, if I am driving my car and s/he checks the plate, info on the registered owner having a CPL should come back.
Once I hand the LEO my driver's license, and they call it in or enter it on his/her computer, the fact that the holder of the license has a CPL should also come back.
HOWEVER if s/he didn't check the plate or license yet, there is that window where the only way they would know is if I told them or if they discover it by seeing or feeling it.
That window is when I personally feel more comfortable with them knowing before they find out on their own.
If they already know to expect a LEGAL weapon, I feel their reaction might be a lot calmer than if they doesn't expect it, and suddenly spot it.
That just my personal feeling, your mileage may vary...
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sudden valley gunner
Regular Member
imported post
See I new there was going to be a debate.
See I new there was going to be a debate.
geojohn
Regular Member
imported post
sudden valley gunner wrote:
It doesn't bother me if someone wants to inform an officer that they are armed. But if you think that it is helpful to do so, it is probably more helpful to be more direct than simply presenting your CPL. If you feel the need to inform an officer that you are armed, just say so in a friendly and calm manner.
sudden valley gunner wrote:
Just a friendly conversation.
It doesn't bother me if someone wants to inform an officer that they are armed. But if you think that it is helpful to do so, it is probably more helpful to be more direct than simply presenting your CPL. If you feel the need to inform an officer that you are armed, just say so in a friendly and calm manner.