Page 1 of 8 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 189

Thread: '8 yr old killed self with uzi' necropost thread closed

  1. #1
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    306

    Post imported post

    eye95 asked if I would be up for a one-on-one debate. Answer -> Yes!

  2. #2
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Fairborn, Ohio, USA
    Posts
    13,063

    Post imported post

    Great! Let's find someone to represent the other side of the question. Of course, that means we need a question. swine, maybe you could come up with a concise statement that you will argue for.

    Then, we will need a format that you and whoever argues against will agree on. I hope that John or Mike will help us set things up to keep the kibitzers at bay. Possibly, one of them could act as the moderator (in the debate sense of the word; of course they already have moderator powers!) for the discussion or give someone some modest authority to do the job for them.

  3. #3
    Regular Member buster81's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    1,461

    Post imported post

    This should be entertaining.

  4. #4
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    306

    Post imported post

    Hello eye95, how are you today?

    Here are my debating points.

    1. The intersection of guns and children is an unresolved issue preventing greater'open carry'legalization, and rightly so.

    2. Guns are not an essential tool. Guns are a fetish, like a foot fetish.

    3. It is possible to conceive of, design, and mass produce personal protection tools (weapons) that are far superior to guns as we know them, and far safer besides.

  5. #5
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Fairborn, Ohio, USA
    Posts
    13,063

    Post imported post

    I would select one of those three to debate. There could be future debates on other questions.

    On edit: I would also recommend simplifying your assertions. The first assertion, for example, has three parts. To prove the statement logically false, one only need to prove any one of the three parts false. That puts you at a distinct disadvantage.

  6. #6
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    306

    Post imported post

    Good point. I'll go with the first topic since it's the one that brought me here. I think If I drop the, 'and properly so', bit I'll have either two related assertions or one slightly complex one. I don't care to debate just the intersection of guns and children, I imagine if guns are carefully stored this is not such a huge problem for children; somewhat of a problem due to incidents where children 'break into' the proper storage. But that's not too much more of a problem than kids stealing the keys to the family car.



    So:

    1. The intersection of guns and children is an unresolved issue that inhibits further 'open carry' legalization.





  7. #7
    Regular Member Sonora Rebel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Gone
    Posts
    3,958

    Post imported post

    Darwinism will prevail.

  8. #8
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Fairborn, Ohio, USA
    Posts
    13,063

    Post imported post

    swine wrote:
    1. The intersection of guns and children is an unresolved issue that inhibits further 'open carry' legalization.
    So, what is meant by "is an unresolved issue," i.e. what would resolve it? And, what is meant by open carry legislation being inhibited? Is the legislation physically stopped? Or, should it be stopped?

  9. #9
    Regular Member Sonora Rebel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Gone
    Posts
    3,958

    Post imported post

    Open carry is not legal (some places)... because it's an unconstitutionally prohibited right.

    Get it right. RKBA is not 'granted'... it's either recognized or denied.

  10. #10
    Regular Member buster81's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    1,461

    Post imported post

    Oh yeah. I can really see this being productive.

  11. #11
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Whatcom County
    Posts
    17,338

    Post imported post

    I don't want to interject to much into this debate I wrote an essay on the topic and guns and children are not that much of a problem as the media and anti's would have you believe. I did most my research on CDC.gov and another government website and pulled my statistics off of there. Of course all the papers I sent it too would not publish it.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  12. #12
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Fairborn, Ohio, USA
    Posts
    13,063

    Post imported post

    Well, the debate has not started yet. We still need the one person who will oppose swine in the debate. You sound like you have already done quite a bit of research on the topic. Would you care to volunteer to debate swine in a somewhat formal way?

  13. #13
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    306

    Post imported post

    Sorry, but eye95 and I are trying to set up a one-on-one debate about this issue. What you read is my proposal for my side of the debate. If I address your questions, the debate has begun. Let's wait for eye95 to get the other side of the debate set up firs, Ok?

  14. #14
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    306

    Post imported post

    What do you mean by 'get it right'? If you mean that the 2d Amendment doesn't grant gun rights, you're right. What it does is make sure gun rights are not 'infringed'.

  15. #15
    Regular Member Sonora Rebel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Gone
    Posts
    3,958

    Post imported post

    swine wrote:
    What do you mean by 'get it right'? If you mean that the 2d Amendment doesn't grant gun rights, you're right. What it does is make sure gun rights are not 'infringed'.
    No it doesn't. RKBA is 'infringed' all over the place. What 'gun rights'? Arms, dude... ARMS. Guns don't have rights, people do. People would have rights if there was no government at all. The right to bear arms being symbiotic with the right to self defense.The 2A has not yet been incorporated against the states. Check you state Constitution to see if bearing arms is recognized. All that permit and license stuff is government contrivance... the 'infringement' part they 'shall not' do.... But they did.

  16. #16
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    306

    Post imported post

    Everything you said is true except thenon-incorporation of the 2d Amendment intouniversal State law. Check Article IV(secondparagraph) and the 14th Amendment. Each alone doesn't achieve 'incorporation', but together they do.

    HAND! <-(means 'have a nice day').

  17. #17
    Regular Member Sonora Rebel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Gone
    Posts
    3,958

    Post imported post

    swine wrote:
    Everything you said is true except thenon-incorporation of the 2d Amendment intouniversal State law. Check Article IV (secondparagraph) and the 14th Amendment. Each alone doesn't achieve 'incorporation', but together they do.

    HAND! <- (means 'have a nice day').
    SCotUS hasn't ruled on that yet. 'Til they do... 'they' don't.

  18. #18
    Campaign Veteran GLOCK21GB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Green Bay, Wisconsin, USA
    Posts
    4,348

    Post imported post

    like this
    http://youtu.be/xWgVGu3OR4U AACFI, Wisconsin / Minnesota Carry Certified. Action Pistol & Advanced Action pistol concepts + Urban Carbine course. When the entitlement Zombies begin looting, pillaging, raping, burning & killing..remember HEAD SHOTS it's the only way to kill a Zombie. Stockpile food & water now.

    Please support your local,county, state & Federal Law enforcement agencies, right ???

  19. #19
    Regular Member Sonora Rebel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Gone
    Posts
    3,958

    Post imported post

    Glock34 wrote:
    like this
    Yeah... really.

  20. #20
    Regular Member buster81's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    1,461

    Post imported post

    Who's Awesome?

  21. #21
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    306

    Post imported post

    I stand corrected. My guess, though, is that they will incorporate, which should mean that States can no longer 'infringe'.

  22. #22
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    306

    Post imported post

    Hello eye95. I have an opening statement written for my side of the debate. It somewhat addresses your question here, whether open carry legislation (I prefer the term 'legalization' because 'legislation' could go either way, for or against open carry), should be stopped. I, for one, think it should be stopped until this 'unresolved issue' is resolved.

    Should I maybe post my opening statement to get the debate rolling?

  23. #23
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Fairborn, Ohio, USA
    Posts
    13,063

    Post imported post

    I'd hold off until we have someone designated to debate you. Then we can start a thread just for the debate.

  24. #24
    Regular Member bom1911's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Chesterfield County , USA
    Posts
    114

    Post imported post

    Let's get to it already. Who is going to protect the friggin' children?

  25. #25
    Regular Member Brimstone Baritone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Leeds, Alabama, USA
    Posts
    786

    Post imported post

    swine wrote:
    I stand corrected. My guess, though, is that they will incorporate, which should mean that States can no longer 'infringe'.
    Will you be operating under that assumption for your argument? Would this significantly affect your argument either way?

    I don't think I am the best person to do this, but if no one else will argue the other side then I'm game. Is there any particular format you wish this to take? Any stipulations?
    There was a time that the pieces fit, but I watched them fall away, mildewed and smoldering, strangled by our coveting. I've done the math enough to know the dangers of our second guessing. Doomed to crumble, unless we grow and strengthen our communication. -Tool, "Schism"

Page 1 of 8 123 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •