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Just got drawn on and disarmed by LEO

The Donkey

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Master Doug Huffman wrote:
buster81 wrote:
IANAL, but it sounds like they received their version of your friends permission to enter. He did open the door and let them in.

I suggest you let your friend know that the police are not to be let in without a warrant. As I'm sure you know, it's not about having anything to hide, but about not having anything to share with the police.
Georgia v. Randolph, 547 U.S. 103 (2006) (if two residents are present and one consents but the other objects, the rights of the objecting party override the other party's consent.).


Majority:


Souter, joined by Stevens, Kennedy, Ginsburg, Breyer

--> first dissent by Roberts.

So how do you like the "liberal" Justices now?
 

Sabotage70

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XD40coyote wrote:
Yet ANOTHER negative cop story...:banghead:

Am I surprised at all?

Can't even OC in your own abode in AZ of all places, without some JBT cops drawing on you. Age profiling too I bet. Too young, so you "look suspicious".

Can someone post that video about not talking to cops?

 
These are the ones from flex your rights. Here's the how to refuse entry.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCVnMDy_7nM&feature=related

And here's the full video. Getting pulled over/ Street encounter and entry in to you home.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqMjMPlXzdA&feature=related

Here's the "don't talk to the cops"

Lawyer:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8z7NC5sgik&feature=related
Cop: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08fZQWjDVKE&feature=related
 

lil_freak_66

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had a similar instance myself a few months back,i reported a trespasser..and being nice i let the LEO's into the kitchen cuz it was well below freezing out.(mistake)

ruger on the table,long story short,i get searched,disarmed of all knives,and the ruger gets thrown into the other room,and improperly cleared,they tried double chambering it.

and then given a lecture on OC,which was completely irrelevant.

LEO's got in trouble for it(especially since it was recently after the ponderosa incident)

did you complain to the LEO's supervisor? i would. they COULD be cited for brandishing since it was not within authority of they're job duty(meaning they had no lawful reason to draw)
 

buster81

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NavyLT wrote:
buster81 wrote:
Master Doug Huffman wrote:
buster81 wrote:
IANAL, but it sounds like they received their version of your friends permission to enter. He did open the door and let them in.

I suggest you let your friend know that the police are not to be let in without a warrant. As I'm sure you know, it's not about having anything to hide, but about not having anything to share with the police.
Georgia v. Randolph, 547 U.S. 103 (2006) (if two residents are present and one consents but the other objects, the rights of the objecting party override the other party's consent.).
One of them did NOT object.
Correct. And the rights of the party that DID object overrides the the party who does not object. So what does it matter that one party did not object?
The OP's question was "Tell me if this is even legal..." Since no one objected to the presence of the police, the quoted case doesn't really seem to apply.
 

ODA 226

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Never invite a cop in! It's the same as inviting a vampire into your house...and even a vampire cannot enter your house without permission! ;)
 

Nutczak

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I would not let this incident just end like this, I would file a complaint about the weapons being drawn on you, being disarmed in your own domicile, and their unwarranted search.

Maybe contact an attorney first before talking to the blue wall.
 

AZkopper

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1. Your friend invited them in. So they were given permission to enter. Since by your own admission, you were the only (legal)one at the crime scene that night, you are a logical place to start an investigation--both as a person of interest (possible suspect) and as a possible witness.

1a. Now, your friend can invite them in, but legally does not have standing to allow a search of your home.

1b. Apparently you never asked them to leave before (2), so they were still there legally.

2. The whole draw down because you're armed thing: I'll be honest, this is probably one of those grey areas where case law is made. You were both a possible suspect and a possible witness. There is basically two ways this could have been handled. a) They see your gun, and either ignore it or ask you to put it away [not likely since they are conducting a criminal investigation for which you are a person of interest]. b) They seize it for the duration of the encounter, becauseyou are aPofI for a crim investigation. Did they need to draw down on you? Not necessarily. Was it illegal? Not necessarily. Since you were at best a person of interest, and were not being belligerent, brandishing, etc, you can easily argue they overreacted. There is some good reasoning for a complaint.

3. Once they did disarm you, they conducted a 'protective sweep' of the rest of the residence, to make sure more armed people were not hiding to hurt them. This is because they were treating you as a person of interest in a criminal investigation. The protective sweep only allows them to search areas where a person could reasonably be expected to be hidden. No warrant is needed. THAT BEING SAID, I'm not so sure a protective sweep is even allowed when a self initiated contact is made for only a person of interest of a crime, especially if you did nothing to ratchet things up with agressive behavior. I'm lying in bed at this moment, and I'm not getting up to check my search&seizure books.

Basically there are two ways this whole thing could have been handled. Way one is to treat you like a possible witness, and let things "develope" to move you in to a person of interest catagory (a suspect). This would be the 'low key' approach, which obviously did not happen.

Way two is to go in to this thinking you are a person of interest (a suspect) and treat you as such from moment 1 (or at least moment 2, once they saw you were armed).

Way two is not illegal [barring the question of the protective sweep], but is counter productive to an investigation--since most likely if you were the suspect, things would develope (inconsistant stories, etc) anyway. If you are not the suspect, the investigator just created a hostile witness.

From your brief synopsis, I don't see anything illegal [again, barring the possibility of the protective sweep], but I sure don't see anything positive they did. Sorry it happened to you.
 

AZkopper

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r6-rider wrote:
Tell me if this is even legal...

threatened to take my weapon because under "state and federal law if you are under investigation they can seize my weapon for how ever long they want" theyleft and said theyll be back. thoughts?
No such law.

They were talking out their asses.

A weapon could be seized if a) it's evidence of a crime; b) found to be stolen property; c) you are arrested for domestic violence; d) you are taken on a mental hold; e) it's on your person and you are arrested for any crime [booked for safekeeping].
 
M

McX

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yep, another example of how being a nice guy, a good citizen, gets your rights trampled on, in your own home no less!
 

Deanimator

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McX wrote:
yep, another example of how being a nice guy, a good citizen, gets your rights trampled on, in your own home no less!
But that CAN'T be right!

Why just the other day, on another forum, I was told that cops are the "good guys" and that you should just CONSENT to whatever they ask, whether it's legal or not! Expecting the police to know and obey the law is "anti-LEO"! Exercising your legal rights is even MORE "anti-LEO"!

Oh, and NEVER carry a voice recorder where it's lawful to do so. It's "paranoid"!
 

buster81

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Deanimator wrote:
McX wrote:
yep, another example of how being a nice guy, a good citizen, gets your rights trampled on, in your own home no less!
But that CAN'T be right!

Why just the other day, on another forum, I was told that cops are the "good guys" and that you should just CONSENT to whatever they ask, whether it's legal or not! Expecting the police to know and obey the law is "anti-LEO"! Exercising your legal rights is even MORE "anti-LEO"!

Oh, and NEVER carry a voice recorder where it's lawful to do so. It's "paranoid"!
It seems to me I've seen that same thing here :?.
 

sudden valley gunner

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Deanimator wrote:
McX wrote:
yep, another example of how being a nice guy, a good citizen, gets your rights trampled on, in your own home no less!
But that CAN'T be right!

Why just the other day, on another forum, I was told that cops are the "good guys" and that you should just CONSENT to whatever they ask, whether it's legal or not! Expecting the police to know and obey the law is "anti-LEO"! Exercising your legal rights is even MORE "anti-LEO"!

Oh, and NEVER carry a voice recorder where it's lawful to do so. It's "paranoid"!

I've heard similar here.:banghead:

I for one am glad you weren't shot by some overzealous officers. Simple fact that this could have gone very awry, is very scary. Definately talk to a lawyer. What if you came out with a rifle in your hand because you were getting ready to go to the range or plinking somewhere? I don't think you'd be posting here.

He was not a suspect, there was no reason to be suspicous simply because he was the last person in the excercise room.
 

eye95

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sudden valley gunner wrote:
Deanimator wrote:
McX wrote:
yep, another example of how being a nice guy, a good citizen, gets your rights trampled on, in your own home no less!
But that CAN'T be right!

Why just the other day, on another forum, I was told that cops are the "good guys" and that you should just CONSENT to whatever they ask, whether it's legal or not! Expecting the police to know and obey the law is "anti-LEO"! Exercising your legal rights is even MORE "anti-LEO"!

Oh, and NEVER carry a voice recorder where it's lawful to do so. It's "paranoid"!

I've heard similar here.:banghead:

I for one am glad you weren't shot by some overzealous officers. Simple fact that this could have gone very awry, is very scary. Definately talk to a lawyer. What if you came out with a rifle in your hand because you were getting ready to go to the range or plinking somewhere? I don't think you'd be posting here.

He was not a suspect, there was no reason to be suspicous simply because he was the last person in the excercise room.

Really? You've heard someone here say to CONSENT to whatever a LEO tells you to do? I haven't. You've heard someone here say that exercising your rights is anti-LEO. I haven't.
 

choover

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lil_freak_66 wrote:
when the wrong LEO does this to the wrong person,i wont feel sorry when the LEO gets shot,and then charged with a crime,and the citizen is cleared.

had a similar instance myself a few months back,i reported a trespasser..and being nice i let the LEO's into the kitchen cuz it was well below freezing out.(mistake)

ruger on the table,long story short,i get searched,disarmed of all knives,and the ruger gets thrown into the other room,and improperly cleared,they tried double chambering it.

and then given a lecture on OC,which was completely irrelevant.

LEO's got in trouble for it(especially since it was recently after the ponderosa incident)

did you complain to the LEO's supervisor? i would. they COULD be cited for brandishing since it was not within authority of they're job duty(meaning they had no lawful reason to draw)
I really think you need to hang your guns up till you mature a bit bud, your mindset is way off. The courts is where all the power is and it is where things against officers need to happen, not a citizen shooting a cop. I know you are not Openly advocating shooting a cop but your statements sometimes kinda show your age :? Very counter productive. :(
 

sudden valley gunner

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I've said similar, and yes I've heard a few say similar things over time that I've been here. Thankfully not many but yes I've heard it.

Come to Washington and check out some of the posts by BigDave, heonly posts in theour stateforum cuz he would get chewed up by folks like yourself, Tomohawk or Citizen. He resorts to trollish behavior and name calling when you don't agree with him and his statist viewpoints. I dare ya try and see......lol.
 

eye95

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Can you link one of his offending posts? Because, frankly, I wonder if what you posted wasn't an interpretation of what he said. Those two statements are absolutes. They have no qualifiers. Folks don't generally post that way.
 

sraacke

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congrats on surviving your encounter with the local LEOs. Now, EDUCATE your fracking roomie about what to do when the cops show up. If he can't get it straight then it's time to find another roommate.
 

SaintJacque

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choover wrote:
lil_freak_66 wrote:
when the wrong LEO does this to the wrong person,i wont feel sorry when the LEO gets shot,and then charged with a crime,and the citizen is cleared.

had a similar instance myself a few months back,i reported a trespasser..and being nice i let the LEO's into the kitchen cuz it was well below freezing out.(mistake)

ruger on the table,long story short,i get searched,disarmed of all knives,and the ruger gets thrown into the other room,and improperly cleared,they tried double chambering it.

and then given a lecture on OC,which was completely irrelevant.

LEO's got in trouble for it(especially since it was recently after the ponderosa incident)

did you complain to the LEO's supervisor? i would. they COULD be cited for brandishing since it was not within authority of they're job duty(meaning they had no lawful reason to draw)
I really think you need to hang your guns up till you mature a bit bud, your mindset is way off. The courts is where all the power is and it is where things against officers need to happen, not a citizen shooting a cop. I know you are not Openly advocating shooting a cop but your statements sometimes kinda show your age :? Very counter productive. :(
I disagree. The courts, as we've seen over and over, don't always protect even your most basic rights and often side with police regardless of the evidence against them. Each individual has to decide when deadly force must be used to protect their own rights. If police officers don't want to put their lives in jeopardy, they should respect the rights of the people they serve.

Draw on me without cause and you might well have a fight on your hands.
 

SaintJacque

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eye95 wrote:
Can you link one of his offending posts? Because, frankly, I wonder if what you posted wasn't an interpretation of what he said. Those two statements are absolutes. They have no qualifiers. Folks don't generally post that way.
That could be, and I'd like to see the posts too. However, I have heard a lot of comments from people who are pro-LEO whose qualifiers are so unreasonable that for all practical purposes they are absolute.
 

Archsgurl

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I dont let LEOs in and I actually tell them straight out, that I dont give permission for them to search my house, my person, anyone in my house, my car, or my property and that they cannot speak to my underage kids without a warrant.

They dont like me quoting the 4th Amendment at them but that is too bad.
 
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