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Thread: Perfect example of where a firearm would have come in to use

  1. #1
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    I'm sure many of you have seen this video. To me, this is a perfect example of where a firearm could have been put to use for personal protection. There are countless videos I've seen where the confrontation could have gone in favor of the victim had he been armed. What really makes me ill is that every stood aside and simply watched this horrific beat down by a man who had to have stood 6'3" and weighed 330+ lbs.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMIuG3HvV0Y

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    More to the point of this forum, had even one of those present been OC the incident would have been far less likely to have begun.


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    ugh, just disgusting, if someone had drawn and managed to have one bullet go through both of the perps I don't think many would have shed a tear. Kind of pathetic the rest of the patrons standing around watching that dude get his ass handed to him and not lift a finger. surely a chair across the neck would have dropped him.

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    Regular Member SFCRetired's Avatar
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    "Happiness is a warm shotgun!!"
    "I am neither a pessimist nor a cynic. I am, rather, a realist."
    "The most dangerous things I've ever encountered were a Second Lieutenant with a map and a compass and a Private who was bored and had time on his hands."

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    Open carry - CC not withstanding, 6 Men (?) stood by and did NOTHING, It's a pitiful statement of the world today. Unfortunately, this type of thing is somewhat common and on the lower scale of violence watched by a crowd.

    That said -- A glock in Bubba's ear would have saved that poor guy from a NASTY unprovoked beating

    Carry on

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    Wow, that was brutal. :shock:

    I don't want to analyze it, because I don't want to criticize the good guy. Way before this even started, everyone in line should have griped at the woman for cutting in line, instead of just the one guy commenting loudly into the cellphone.

    I hate it when people cut in line in a busy place. While not the case here, if you're joining your friends, I might let it slide, but even then, if your friends are interested in being with you, they should join you at the end of the line. Otherwise, someone should politely inform you that the end of the line is back there.

    The only other thing I'll say is, if you're in an escalating confrontation, stay out of reach of the bad guy.

    Joel F.
    Marquette, Michigan

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    Campaign Veteran rcawdor57's Avatar
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    Pretty sad that all those "men" just stood there and watched. Even worse was that the female prosecutor and news person never mentioned that no one would help. "Dial A Prayer" didn't save this guy, but it did get the perps arrested. Reminds me of a guy in a sandwich shop in N.Y. a few years back that was jumped by a bunch of gang bangers and they murdered him in the store. All caught on video. No one helped at all. What a sad state of affairs we have today in our country.
    “The Constitution shall never be construed... to prevent the People of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms.” -- Samuel Adams

    “Today, we need a nation of Minutemen. Citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom.”

    —John F. Kennedy

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    rcawdor57 wrote:
    Pretty sad that all those "men" just stood there and watched. Even worse was that the female prosecutor and news person never mentioned that no one would help.
    Just to be fair to the prosecutor, at about 2:13 the prosecutor mentions how sad it was that seven men just stood around watching and no one would help.

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    Regular Member buster81's Avatar
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    Yikes. The most shocking part is at the end. He gets only4 years, and she gets only2years probation. That seems pretty light for both to me.

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    Oh how I wish I would have been that man in the white shirt, standing by the door..

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    Aaron1124 wrote:
    Oh how I wish I would have been that man in the white shirt, standing by the door..
    Yeah, he's a big guy. After the first punch, he would have been the guy to jump in. The victim was completely taken by surprise. It looks like the guy in white was saying stuff to Bubba, but still stood by. Sure, Bubba would have turned on you, but, assuming that the police were on the way, he would have fared much better than the vic.

    It all comes down to mindset. He wasn't willing to act and/or didn't know how to act.

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    nobucks wrote:
    Aaron1124 wrote:
    Oh how I wish I would have been that man in the white shirt, standing by the door..
    Yeah, he's a big guy. After the first punch, he would have been the guy to jump in. The victim was completely taken by surprise. It looks like the guy in white was saying stuff to Bubba, but still stood by. Sure, Bubba would have turned on you, but, assuming that the police were on the way, he would have fared much better than the vic.

    It all comes down to mindset. He wasn't willing to act and/or didn't know how to act.
    Pretty much. If you're not exposed to that environment, or you haven't trained yourself how to respond to that type of situation, your immediate response is going to probably be either panic or freeze up.

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    Iam a ex mma fighter, i have been out of the game a few years, but i would have put the stink on that dude. there are many guys out there that put on a good show,but when it comes down to busting heads they look like those guys. ITS TIME TO MAN UP!!!!!!!!!



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    This only reinforces my extreme dislike of crowded places.... But yeah, I would have put the hurt on him, if I were one of the bystanders.

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    Regular Member Thos.Jefferson's Avatar
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    If just the clerk would have been carrying then this would've never happened.
    He that would make his own liberty secure, must guard even his enemy from oppression; for if he violates this duty, he establishes a precedent which will reach to himself. -- Thomas Paine (1737--1809), Dissertation on First Principles of Government, 1795

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    Thos.Jefferson wrote:
    If just the clerk would have been carrying then this would've never happened.
    Yep. Would have solved a lot of problems. However, even if one of the customers had been carrying, I doubt Big Bubba would have even noticed, considering his level of rage and how packed the place was.

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    Aaron1124 wrote:
    Thos.Jefferson wrote:
    If just the clerk would have been carrying then this would've never happened.
    Yep. Would have solved a lot of problems. However, even if one of the customers had been carrying, I doubt Big Bubba would have even noticed, considering his level of rage and how packed the place was.
    I agree I do not think he would have even noticed or cared if someone was carrying. Another thing to think about that was a very tight and crowded place you really could not get a clean shot off. Now a taser would have been nice to have. Pepper spay would not have worked as well too crowded.

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    collapsible batons are also good options for disabling people with less lethal force, when you don't think a firearm is justified.

    that being said, if you're using a baton as non-lethal you don't do head strikes, as though would be considered lethal blows.

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    Right take out the knees and the biggest go down. Does not take much to wipe out a knee.

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    Would drawing be warranted in this situation? At what point does his life become endangered enough to draw?

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    TyGuy wrote:
    Would drawing be warranted in this situation? At what point does his life become endangered enough to draw?
    The million dollar question. It's the moment that a reasonable person believes that the victim's life was in danger. I don't think there is much debate in this case that thevictim could easily have been seriously injured or killed in the beating or that the rage-a-holic had intention to do serious bodily injury to, or kill the victim.The real problem would be, in this jurisdiction, are the police, prosecution and jury reasonable?

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    thnycav wrote:
    Right take out the knees and the biggest go down. Does not take much to wipe out a knee.
    Maybe if you know what you're doing, but from my years of MMA training, the regular joe doesn't perfect a strike to the knee very well.

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    buster81 wrote:
    TyGuy wrote:
    Would drawing be warranted in this situation? At what point does his life become endangered enough to draw?
    The million dollar question. It's the moment that a reasonable person believes that the victim's life was in danger. I don't think there is much debate in this case that thevictim could easily have been seriously injured or killed in the beating or that the rage-a-holic had intention to do serious bodily injury to, or kill the victim.The real problem would be, in this jurisdiction, are the police, prosecution and jury reasonable?
    It sounded like the prosecutor was pretty serious once she viewed the footage. Can you imagine if that man had NOT been in a public place? I bet that huge guy would have killed him.

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    Regular Member thnycav's Avatar
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    Aaron1124 wrote:
    buster81 wrote:
    TyGuy wrote:
    Would drawing be warranted in this situation? At what point does his life become endangered enough to draw?
    The million dollar question. It's the moment that a reasonable person believes that the victim's life was in danger. I don't think there is much debate in this case that thevictim could easily have been seriously injured or killed in the beating or that the rage-a-holic had intention to do serious bodily injury to, or kill the victim.The real problem would be, in this jurisdiction, are the police, prosecution and jury reasonable?
    It sounded like the prosecutor was pretty serious once she viewed the footage. Can you imagine if that man had NOT been in a public place? I bet that huge guy would have killed him.
    Yes even though he is a big guy the bullet will travel though him and can strike another person. It is at best a very bad place to shoot some one, I think he would have to be armed as well to justify taking that chance.

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    thnycav wrote:
    Aaron1124 wrote:
    buster81 wrote:
    TyGuy wrote:
    Would drawing be warranted in this situation? At what point does his life become endangered enough to draw?
    The million dollar question. It's the moment that a reasonable person believes that the victim's life was in danger. I don't think there is much debate in this case that thevictim could easily have been seriously injured or killed in the beating or that the rage-a-holic had intention to do serious bodily injury to, or kill the victim.The real problem would be, in this jurisdiction, are the police, prosecution and jury reasonable?
    It sounded like the prosecutor was pretty serious once she viewed the footage. Can you imagine if that man had NOT been in a public place? I bet that huge guy would have killed him.
    Yes even though he is a big guy the bullet will travel though him and can strike another person. It is at best a very bad place to shoot some one, I think he would have to be armed as well to justify taking that chance.
    This is where the difference in state laws come in to play. Here, it could be considered excusable homicide.


    RCW 9A.16.030Homicide — When excusable.
    Homicide is excusable when committed by accident or misfortune in doing any lawful act by lawful means, without criminal negligence, or without any unlawful intent.


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