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Thread: Dragon Leatherworks

  1. #1
    Regular Member Huck's Avatar
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    I saw this link on Sayuncle yesterday and it looks interesting, especially the Versa-carry.

    http://www.dragonleatherworks.com/
    "You can teach 'em, but you cant learn 'em."

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    Huck, thank you for the link!

    I hadn't known that you had placed a link to my site here, until I did my weekly site traffic / site report check.

    Glad that you found the Versa-Carry interesting enough to link it!

    Regards,

    Dennis

    aka: DragonLW

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    Well,the "inspiration" statementat Dragon Leatherworks probably isn't going to go over well here at a OPENCARRY website:

    ”Why carry openly and give up your advantage to your attacker? You have a right to keep and bear arms, and the best way to do so is concealed.“



    -- John D.
    (formerly of Colorado Springs, CO)

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    Sir,

    The holster that was mentioned by the OP is one designed to be able to be carried both as an OPEN CARRY, along with concealed if necessary. The model is the Versa-Carry.

    You have taken a comment from my business site completely out of context, as the statement you quote is from a holster designed primarily for the populations of states such as New York, where open carry is not an option.

    Am I to understand that only those manufacturers who make only open carry holsters are to be mentioned and/or supported by those who are members of this forum? That would be insanely stupid on t he part of any business, as the purpose of any business is to cater to as broad clientele as possible.

    But thank you anyway for the mention, and the post. It helps keep the thread on the front page, close to the top.

    Warmest Regards,

    Dennis

    aka: DragonLW

  5. #5
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    Dennis,

    There's more to a company than just its actual product..its "guiding princicples" (philosophy) are equally important, maybe more so. To me, anyway.

    Yes, I wasjust looking at the quote as you said it "inspired" you and therefore reasonable can be interpreted as some kid of guiding principle/philosophy for your business. Regardless of it's application (places that don't allow OC), I take issue with its implication that OC is inferior to CC (it "gives upyour advanage to your attacker"). If you knew ANYTHING about OC andits CC vs. OC 'debates' -- let alone the person who madethat ignorant quote --you'd know that particular criticism of OC is just ignorant (and you haven't said anything abot the quote, have you, so I assume you agree with it).

    BOTH modes of carry have their places and one is not "giving up your advantage" to your attacker. Therefore, one is not superior or inferiorto the other.

    What I'm saying is that your 'pro-concealed carry' quote would fit better in a gun forum focused on CONCEALED CARRY...as lots of THOSE people think the very same thing about OC. Here we do not, as we know better.

    You need to 'know your audience' no matter where you speak/post. That quote insults OC people. And for some reason, there are a lot of OC people here (even though, yes, many of usalso CC). Perhaps you are just not up with OC and the 'OC talking points' that well. Hopefully, you are a bit more now.

    BTW, we here are also "champions of the 2nd Amendment."

    -- John D.

    P.S. "It helps keep the thread on the front page, close to the top." What's the significance of this? What do you mean? Getting publicity/sales? Not from people your site suggestsare using an inferior mode of carry (OC).

    (formerly of Colorado Springs, CO)

  6. #6
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    OK...I'm not going to belabor this, but I feel the need to set things straight, as you seem to want to disparage a legitimate business.

    1) Up until today (while doing my weekly marketing stuff by checking web host traffic) I had not posted on this forum. Specifically because up until just a few weeks ago, I was not producing a product that would fit well.

    2) I am a resident of, and therefore started my business in, NYS. The inspiration that you seem very keen on using to discredit me (for what reason, I have no clue) comes from researching the law, and designing a product which I have patented, that allows my immediate clientele (those residing in NYS) the ability to carry a weapon lawfully, and as close as possible to being the same in functionality as wearing it open on the hip. In other words, the draw is natural, the weapon is readily accessible, and for the target clientele in NYS, completely legal. So yes, for that specific product, I know my audience extremely well, and believe that on that point, I do know my target audience as you insist I should.

    3) The comment by the OP was to a link on a site, which picked up on a link to another site, where the newest release of my combination holster was mentioned as a primer for a review. The OP took an interest in that design, as it does satisfy the ability to carry open, and therefore was of interest to him as a member of an open carry forum.

    4) My post to the OP in which I thanked him for the link was meant, truly, as a Thank You. Being a start-up, its difficult to get things rolling. Anyone picking up on a product offering and finding that specific product to be interesting in its design and application, is greatly appreciated.

    I understand the passions that are on both sides of the OC / CC debate. As a businessman, I am doing what I need to, so as to nurture a successful business catering to all clientele. Statements used in my marketing of what inspired me to create a specifically unique product cannot and should not be used to disparage me, my business, other products I make, nor the methodology I use in designing the products I bring to market.

    Again, my deepest thanks go to the OP for the mention of an OC product. My hope is that people here, regardless of which side of the debate they fall on, can see some value in any of the products I offer, both in the quality of construction and affordability.

    In closing allow me to quote you:
    What I'm saying is, that 'pro-concealed carry' quote would fit better in a gun forum focused on CONCEALED CARRY...as lots of THOSE people think the very same thing about OC. Here we do not, as we know better.
    Please point out where either I, or the original poster, placed that comment in this forum? I didn't, and neither did the OP. If a marketing blurb on a business website automatically disqualifies myself, the OP, and/or this thread, then I would respectfully ask the moderator to remove this thread.

    Warmest Regards,

    Dennis

    aka: DragonLW

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    Dennis,

    The quote was from your website and therefore you take responsibility for its content. If it's on your site, you must agree with it. In fact, you state that it inspired you. So why be so evasive about what it says about OC?

    Your "marketing blurb" (quotation) does not "disqualify" you from posting here (and I'm just a nobody so I don't say who can or can't post here anyway),but I get the impression you still do not understand the issue.

    Good luck to you and your new business, but if I were you, I'd not have stuff on your website that denigratesa group of handgun carriers...I'd be lots more careful of how that may be perceived.That's just poor marketing at the very least and one shouldn't need an MBA to know that. Of course if you BELIEVE that OC is giving up the advantage to attackers, then stand up and say so. If not, say that also. Don't be ambiguous or evasive.

    Regards (and apologies for any misunderstandings),

    -- John D.

    P.S. I have no interest of'attacking a legitimate business' and couldn't care less about NYS (I didn't even know where you were located until you said so).
    (formerly of Colorado Springs, CO)

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    @ cloudcroft Is the forum the best place for such private arguments? Sounds like a personal problem. Go ahead and attack me too, but I honestly like the website and the product.

    I am not offended with his ”Why carry openly and give up your advantage to your attacker? You have a right to keep and bear arms, and the best way to do so is concealed" phrase.

    I conceal when I want and open carry when I want. While I am an advocate for OC and gun owners' rights, I understand how OC can both quicken a response, deter some criminal activity, or could give a criminal's advantage over a carrier.

    @DragonLW Do you make the holsters custom? Do you just make for smaller, easier-concealed guns (compact/subcompact). I'm still fiddling around with holster methods and may like the Versa-Carry for a 4.5-5" barrel, full size weapon. Would such be possible and/or probable?

  9. #9
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    I was just responding to Dennis here as HE was responding here. He could have PMed me, too. Works both ways, doesn't it. Like reponding to your question here rather than getting aPM from you.

    I think enough's been said though but thanks for the suggestion.

    -- John D.


    (formerly of Colorado Springs, CO)

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    Porter N wrote:
    @DragonLW* Do you make the holsters custom? Do you just make for smaller, easier-concealed guns (compact/subcompact). I'm still fiddling around with holster methods and may like the Versa-Carry for a 4.5-5" barrel, full size weapon. Would such be possible and/or probable?
    Yes, I have made the Versa-Carry for XD's ( 4" service model) Sig P226, and Glock 22's. For pistols of that size and weight, the preferred carry method has been on the hip, as having that much weight at the small of the back can be a bit uncomfortable. For SotB carry in one of these holsters, the most comfortable has been the compact / sub-compact sizes.

    Thanks much for asking!

    Dennis
    aka: DragonLW

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    Porter N wrote:
    Is the forum the best place for such private arguments?
    I do not think this is a private argument. The support of OC is the central purpose of this forum.

    Apart from his support or disparagement of OC, whether he means to or not, DragonLW is coming across in the above as arrogant and argumentative (as it appears to me in my personal opinion). This is knowledge I find valuable in deciding whether I wish to do business with a particular merchant.

    edit: typo, clarity

  12. #12
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    hi everyone, right now i only OC, Dragon makes some nice holsters, my favorite from looking at your site is the Fugly. i think the biggest disagreement was the fact that the way the inspiration statement was worded. Its "worded" as CC being better then OC, you then state that its intended for marketing in an area that does not allow OC. Remember the only time an attacker has the advantage is when the victim is unarmed.AND everyone NEEDS to remember, "Its not the intent of what you say or do that causes you to get into trouble, but how others Perceive it."

    You make holsters so that we may carry. Peace.

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