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Thread: Zion

  1. #1
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    Doing a 2 night trip to Zion- Leaving tonight

    I am under the impression that open carry is legal- upon visiting this site though apparently Utah law says the weapon must be 2 actions from firing

    it gives an example of a semi auto being loaded but not chambered-......ok thats easy- I have a M&P 40

    what about my buddy w/ his .357 revolver?


    what exactly is 2 actions from firing- drawing and then pulling the trigger sounds like two actions- but that would mean there was a round in the chamber


    Leaving in an hour- sorry for the late notice

  2. #2
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    With a revolver the cylinder under the hammer must be empty as well as the next cylinder.

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    Also, if you have a concealedcarry permit from any state, you can open carry completely loaded.

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    Thank you

    Glad I checked- I was originally under the impression that loaded open carry was legal



    What about at camp in the wilderness?

    Neither I nor my friend have a CCW in any state


  5. #5
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    76-10-502. When weapon deemed loaded.
    (1) For the purpose of this chapter, any pistol, revolver, shotgun, rifle, or other weapon described in this part shall be deemed to be loaded when there is an unexpended cartridge, shell, or projectile in the firing position.
    (2) Pistols and revolvers shall also be deemed to be loaded when an unexpended cartridge, shell, or projectile is in a position whereby the manual operation of any mechanism once would cause the unexpended cartridge, shell, or projectile to be fired.
    (3) A muzzle loading firearm shall be deemed to be loaded when it is capped or primed and has a powder charge and ball or shot in the barrel or cylinders.

    76-10-505. Carrying loaded firearm in vehicle or on street.
    (1) Unless otherwise authorized by law, a person may not carry a loaded firearm:
    (a) in or on a vehicle, unless:
    (i) the vehicle is in the person's lawful possession; or
    (ii) the person is carrying the loaded firearm in a vehicle with the consent of the person lawfully in possession of the vehicle;
    (b) on a public street; or
    (c) in a posted prohibited area.
    (2) Subsection (1)(a) does not apply to a minor under 18 years of age, since a minor under 18 years of age may not carry a loaded firearm in or on a vehicle.
    (3) Notwithstanding Subsection (1)(a)(i) and (ii), a person may not possess a loaded rifle, shotgun, or muzzle-loading rifle in a vehicle.
    (4) A violation of this section is a class B misdemeanor.



    So... it looks to me, if you are in the "wilderness", and not on a public street, or posted prohibited area, you should be fine if you are fully loaded... I am not a lawyer though, so hopefully someone else can post and verify this... As soon as you are on a street or on the side of a street though, you are fair game for LEOs though...

    Also, as of last year, you can now carry a fully loadedHANDGUN in your vehicle in Utah, concealed or open... FYI (you can carry a fully loaded rifle or shotgun in your car if you have a CFP/CWP)

  6. #6
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    hawk84 wrote:
    Thank you

    Glad I checked- I was originally under the impression that loaded open carry was legal



    What about at camp in the wilderness?

    Neither I nor my friend have a CCW in any state
    76-10-511. Possession of loaded firearm at residence or on real property authorized.
    Except for persons described in Section 76-10-503 and 18 U.S.C. Sec. 922(g) and as otherwise prescribed in this part, a person may have a loaded firearm:
    (1) at the person's place of residence, including any temporary residence or camp; or
    (2) on the person's real property.


    I am not a lawyer, this is not legal advice.

    But this section of code clearly authorizes a loaded gun at your "residence" including any temporary camp even if you do not have a permit.

    Also, I read the section of code provided by YozUpz as banning loaded carry (without a permit) only on "public streets". While that might be broadly interpreted to include a lot of city areas other than just where you drive your car, I think it would be a bit of stretch to think it includes some back country hiking trail without a home or business in sight.

    Remember that visitor centers and such other buildings in the park are federal facilities and off limits to guns even with a permit.

    And while you are in Utah, you might consider taking a Utah permit class and getting a permit. It greatly simplifies OC and carrying in general, especially if you consider school zones in urban and suburban areas.

    Enjoy your visit to Zion and do let us know how it goes.

    Charles
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

  7. #7
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    utbagpiper wrote:
    hawk84 wrote:
    Thank you

    Glad I checked- I was originally under the impression that loaded open carry was legal



    What about at camp in the wilderness?

    Neither I nor my friend have a CCW in any state
    76-10-511. Possession of loaded firearm at residence or on real property authorized.
    Except for persons described in Section 76-10-503 and 18 U.S.C. Sec. 922(g) and as otherwise prescribed in this part, a person may have a loaded firearm:
    (1) at the person's place of residence, including any temporary residence or camp; or
    (2) on the person's real property.


    I am not a lawyer, this is not legal advice.

    But this section of code clearly authorizes a loaded gun at your "residence" including any temporary camp even if you do not have a permit.

    Also, I read the section of code provided by YozUpz as banning loaded carry (without a permit) only on "public streets". While that might be broadly interpreted to include a lot of city areas other than just where you drive your car, I think it would be a bit of stretch to think it includes some back country hiking trail without a home or business in sight.

    Remember that visitor centers and such other buildings in the park are federal facilities and off limits to guns even with a permit.

    And while you are in Utah, you might consider taking a Utah permit class and getting a permit. It greatly simplifies OC and carrying in general, especially if you consider school zones in urban and suburban areas.

    Enjoy your visit to Zion and do let us know how it goes.

    Charles
    Im not going to have time to do the class while I'm there. I know they offer them here locally. I just was under the assumption that LOC was legal there.....so why bother.

    I knew the federal facilities were off limits (even the shuttles apparently) but thanks for the heads up

    Glad I checked the law before I left. Can never be too careful

    If we get a new sheriff here in Orange County I guess I'll have to get that CCW and stop worrying about it


    Leaving shortly-----lots of driving to do..........

  8. #8
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    YoZUpZ wrote:
    With a revolver the cylinder under the hammer must be empty as well as the next cylinder.
    True with a double-action revolver. With a single action, just make sure there's no round in the chamber under the hammer. With some single actions it's possible to position the hammer between chambers, in which case you can load 'em all up.

    Of course, most revolvers that people carry are double-action.

  9. #9
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    Please let us know if you have any issues. I plan on doing a lot of hiking with the family in Zion this year.

    Enjoy your trip!

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    combatcarry wrote:
    Please let us know if you have any issues. I plan on doing a lot of hiking with the family in Zion this year.

    Enjoy your trip!
    There were no issues at all. I didn't carry in the main park, but I did carry at all times while backpacking along La Verkin Creek. No one I came across freaked out- or even made any mention. I did see some people glance at it real quick. And the most dramatic response was on the way out. I was at the rear of our group of 3 when I smelled something, and annouced "I smell weed" to which I heard some giggling from farther up the trail behind some bushes. When they saw me they stopped giggling....Why I don't know....but if that was because they saw my right side- it was the only real response.

    On the way out of Zion yesterday we hit the BLM land before Hurricane and did some shooting. Introduced the girl that came with us to my 22a, and then my M&P40. she liked the 22 the 40 was a little much for her. She did great and was all smiles.

  11. #11
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    Glad you enjoyed your trip! Come back and see us again sometime.


  12. #12
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    Thanks for posting your experience! Glad you had a nice trip.

  13. #13
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    Just dropping in from the PRK (Peoples Republik of Kalifornia). I wanted to say thanks to all here in the UT forum. I took the family on a Memorial weekend roadtrip to Zion and all the excellentinfo here prepared me for my first national park OC adventure. I'm quite active here in the PRK and have UOC'ed a lot at our meetups, but until this trip haven't been able to OC in a NP.

    I UOC'ed according to UT law, 2 steps (which compared to the PRK is loaded), throughout the park and had a great time (not inside the fed bldgs). I also carriedaround town a little, but decided to play it safe around the school.

    No problems with any locals at all, the only folks who asked me about it where a couple from NY and another from the PRK! Imagine that. But they were very supportive nonetheless. There was also an older gentlemen from Louisiana who was supportive and made small talk about hardware, he was great.

    In the park I did have one guy mad dog me a little, while I was with my young son no less, I just nodded and went about my business. He didn't seem to happy about it though. Oh well. Maybe he was just constipated. :-)

    Wehad a great time, the park was amazing,andthe weather was great.Libertyina grand location like Zionis intoxicating.

    Again, thanks for making it possible.


    "Why should judicial precedent bind the nation if the Constitution itself does not?" -- Mark Levin

  14. #14
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    Cool,

    Glad you enjoyed yourself and had a nice time with the family.

    Charles
    All experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. Thank heaven we do not permit a few to impose anarchy.

    "With Anarchy as an aim and as a means, Communism becomes possible."
    --Marxist.org

    "Communism and Anarchy [are], a necessary complement to one another. "
    --PETER KROPOTKIN, "Anarchism: its philosophy and ideal." 1898.

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