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Thread: Gun Rights in Canada

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Canadians do have the Right to Bear Arms. Many Canadians believe (and our government would certainly have us believe) that there is no Right of the citizen to keep arms for their own use and defense, like the US Second Amendment, in Canadian law. To those citizens, I would suggest a bit of reading up on our own history and legal framework. Our right to bear arms is not mentioned in recent documents such as the Constitution or Charter because it's already stated elsewhere in Canadian law.
    Our right to keep and bear arms in our own or the country's defense comes from exactly the same place as the American one -- English Common Law, the English Bill of Rights 1689, the writings of Sir William Blackstone in his Commentaries on English Law, and others. All these laws (and indeed the full body of English Law), became part of Canadian law on our Confederation in 1867 with the affirmation of the British North America (BNA) Act.
    We have this Right, though our government is attempting to suppress it and deny citizen's their age-old right to self-defense with the egregious and unconstitutional (not to mention horrendously expensive) Firearms Act and other proposals.
    It leads one to wonder why the government so wants an unarmed and defenceless populace. See The Legal basis for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms in Canada.

    http://www.rkba.ca/

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    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member Sig229's Avatar
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    The only problems I have with Canadians gun rights are the crazy limitations of pistol barrel length, magazine capacity and no right to carry for self defense.
    "Let your gun be your constant companion during your walks" ~Thomas Jefferson

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    Regular Member Haz.'s Avatar
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    The Australian government pulled the wool over the Australian people.They told us the English Bill of Rights has no title here and promptly banned guns, and the people fell for it. The Australian Prim Minister,John Cowardwho banned guns here is a strict Monarchist
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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    English Bill of Rights



    The English Bill of Rights

    Created
    1689

    Ratified
    December, 1689

    Location
    National Archives of the United Kingdom

    Authors
    Parliament of England

    Purpose
    Ensure certain freedoms and ensure a Protestant political supremacy.
    The Bill of Rights (a short title[1][/suP]) is an act of the Parliament of England, whose title is An Act Declaring the Rights and Liberties of the Subject and Settling the Succession of the Crown. It is often called the English Bill of Rights.

    The Bill of Rights was passed by Parliament in December 1689. It was a re-statement in statutory form of the Declaration of Right presented by the Convention Parliament to William and Mary in March 1689, inviting them to become joint sovereigns of England. It enumerates certain rights to which subjects and permanent residents of a constitutional monarchy were thought to be entitled in the late 17th century, asserting subjects' right to petition the monarch, as well as to have arms in defence. It also sets out—or, in the view of its drafters, restates—certain constitutional requirements of the Crown to seek the consent of the people, as rFederation and the rise of regulation in the 20th century.

    __________________________________________________ _________________


    In AUSTRALIA, The Commonwealth does not have constitutional authority over firearms, yet John Howard and the Liberal andNational Party party ignored this and forged ahead and banned guns.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Australia

    Gun laws were the responsibility of each colony and since Federation in 1901, of each state.



    The Commonwealth does not have constitutional authority over firearms, but it controls customs and military matters, and the external affairs power can be used to enforce internal control over matters agreed in external treaties.



    During the 1920s, Australia, Canada and Great Britain became concerned about the rise of communism after the Bolshevik Revolution in Russia, and imposed restrictions on handguns.[6][/suP] However the rise of organised crime in Sydney and Melbourne, and many lurid underworld murders was also a definite factor [7][/suP] These restrictions have increased over the succeeding decades. In New South Wales, handguns were effectively banned after World War II but the 1956 Melbourne Olympic Games sparked a new interest in the sport of pistol shooting and laws were changed to allow the sport to develop.

    Rifles and shotguns were less restricted than handguns. State gun laws varied widely. Western Australia and the Northern Territory had severe restrictions even on sporting rifles and shotguns, but in Queensland and Tasmania they could be bought without restrictions.

    Fully-automatic arms were banned on the Australian mainland from the 1930s, but remained legal in Tasmania until 1996.

    In the 1940s and 1950s, Cold War concerns about ex-military rifles falling into the hands of communist radicals led New South Wales to place restrictions on the legal ownership of rifles of a military calibre (see: .303/25) while members of rifle clubs and military rifle clubs could own ex-military rifles. In the 1970s these restrictions were relaxed in New South Wales and military style rifles (both bolt-action and semi-automatic) once again became widely available, except in Western Australia and the Northern Territory.

    By the beginning of the 1980s, the relative popularity of shooting and the prevalence of firearms in the community began to fall as social attitudes changed and urbanisation increased. The rise of new values including feminism, environmental awareness and media reports of American gun violence created an awareness of gun control as a potential issue. The 1981 publication of Richard Harding's book "Firearms and Violence in Australian Life"[8][/suP] and conferences in several cities involved academics, criminologists, police representatives and gun control activists. As in other countries, public concern over violence and its possible links to media violence also gave rise to a general increase in support for gun control and increased media involvement in the issue. Gun control activism in Australia became organised with the formation in 1981 of the "Committee to Control Gun Misuse" in Victoria, later to become Gun Control Australia.epresented in parliament.

    When a criminal invades your home and has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun.

    My Definition of Gun Control: The idea that dozens of people found dead in the Broadway Café, Tasmania, and many also seriously wounded, all while waiting for police, who were called to show up and protect them, is somehow morally superior to having several armed and therefore alive civilian's explaining to police how the attacker got that fatal bullet wound.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Sig229 wrote:
    The only problems I have with Canadians gun rights are the crazy limitations of pistol barrel length, magazine capacity and no right to carry for self defense.
    Those are some pretty BIG problems IMO. :?

    Yata hey
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Regular Member Sig229's Avatar
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    Of course they are, I wasn't saying otherwise.
    "Let your gun be your constant companion during your walks" ~Thomas Jefferson

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    Regular Member Haz.'s Avatar
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    Grapeshot wrote:
    Sig229 wrote:
    The only problems I have with Canadians gun rights are the crazy limitations of pistol barrel length, magazine capacity and no right to carry for self defense.
    Those are some pretty BIG problems IMO. :?

    Yata hey
    Ye'p, same problems here in Aus., mate.

    Firearms categories.

    Firearms in Australia are grouped into Categories with different levels of control. The categories are:



    • Category C: Semi-automatic rimfire rifles holding 10 or fewer rounds and pump-action or semi-automatic shotguns holding 5 or fewer rounds. (Restricted: only primary producers, occupational shooters, collectors and some clay target shooters can own functional Category C firearms)

    • Category D: Semi-automatic centrefire rifles, pump-action/semi-automatic shotguns holding more than 5 rounds (functional Category D firearms are restricted to occupational shooters; collectors may own deactivated Category D firearms).[2][/suP]


    (Participants in "approved" competitions may acquire handguns up to .45", currently Single Action Shooting and Metallic Silhouette. IPSC shooting is not "approved" for the larger calibres, for unstated reasons. Category H barrels must be at least 100mm (3.94") long for revolvers, and 120mm (4.72") for semi-automatic pistols, and magazines are restricted to 10 rounds. Handgun collectors are exempt from the laws stated above.)


    Antique firearms can in some states be legally bought without licences. In other states they are subject to the same requirements as modern firearms.

    All single-shot muzzleloading firearms manufactured before 1 January 1901 are considered antique firearms. Four states require licences for antique percussion revolvers and cartridge repeating firearms but in Queensland and Victoria a person may possess such a firearm without a license, so long as the firearm is registered.

    Australia also has tight restrictions on air pistols, airsoft guns, and replica firearms, including toys that look realistic. Suppressors (or 'silencers') are extremely restricted and generally not available to most shooters.[3][/suP]
    When a criminal invades your home and has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun.

    My Definition of Gun Control: The idea that dozens of people found dead in the Broadway Café, Tasmania, and many also seriously wounded, all while waiting for police, who were called to show up and protect them, is somehow morally superior to having several armed and therefore alive civilian's explaining to police how the attacker got that fatal bullet wound.

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Grapeshot wrote:
    Sig229 wrote:
    The only problems I have with Canadians gun rights are the crazy limitations of pistol barrel length, magazine capacity and no right to carry for self defense.
    Those are some pretty BIG problems IMO. :?

    Yata hey
    Let's ad that the way they have to be kept in a business or home renders them useless.

    "Excuse me before you shoot me, may I please go to my safe and unlock my gun load my magazine? It would only be proper for you to give me a sporting chance."
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Regular Member Haz.'s Avatar
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    sudden valley gunner wrote:
    Grapeshot wrote:
    Sig229 wrote:
    The only problems I have with Canadians gun rights are the crazy limitations of pistol barrel length, magazine capacity and no right to carry for self defense.
    Those are some pretty BIG problems IMO. :?

    Yata hey
    Let's ad that the way they have to be kept in a business or home renders them useless.

    "Excuse me before you shoot me, may I please go to my safe and unlock my gun load my magazine? It would only be proper for you to give me a sporting chance."
    Hi Mate.

    Crazy isn't it. InAus., if you belong to a target pistol shooters club and have pistols, and if you were allowed to use it for self defence, you would not only have to go to your locked safe, get a pistol, you would then have to go to ANOTHER LOCKED CONTAINERor SAFE, where ammo must be stored separately before loading the magazine.

    Haz.
    When a criminal invades your home and has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun.

    My Definition of Gun Control: The idea that dozens of people found dead in the Broadway Café, Tasmania, and many also seriously wounded, all while waiting for police, who were called to show up and protect them, is somehow morally superior to having several armed and therefore alive civilian's explaining to police how the attacker got that fatal bullet wound.

  9. #9
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Haz. wrote:
    sudden valley gunner wrote:
    Grapeshot wrote:
    Sig229 wrote:
    Hi Mate.

    Crazy isn't it. InAus., if you belong to a target pistol shooters club and have pistols, and if you were allowed to use it for self defence, you would not only have to go to your locked safe, get a pistol, you would then have to go to ANOTHER LOCKED CONTAINERor SAFE, where ammo must be stored separately before loading the magazine.

    Haz.
    I think it's the same in B.C. Canada. Someone had their Jewelry store robbed 14 times at gun point and their firearm was rendered useless. I'm curious how many thugs rob the gun cases too? And if this contributes to the "illegal" guns on the street the government want to crack down on.

    I hope you Ozzies get your rights back soon too. Didn't New Zealand repeal their gun ban?
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Regular Member Haz.'s Avatar
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    sudden valley gunner wrote:
    Haz. wrote:
    sudden valley gunner wrote:
    Grapeshot wrote:
    Sig229 wrote:
    Hi Mate.

    Crazy isn't it. InAus., if you belong to a target pistol shooters club and have pistols, and if you were allowed to use it for self defence, you would not only have to go to your locked safe, get a pistol, you would then have to go to ANOTHER LOCKED CONTAINERor SAFE, where ammo must be stored separately before loading the magazine.

    Haz.
    I think it's the same in B.C. Canada. Someone had their Jewelry store robbed 14 times at gun point and their firearm was rendered useless. I'm curious how many thugs rob the gun cases too? And if this contributes to the "illegal" guns on the street the government want to crack down on.

    I hope you Ozzies get your rights back soon too. Didn't New Zealand repeal their gun ban?
    Hi mate,

    We have I believe very tough laws in Aus. Definately cannot use firearms for self defence, unless your a police officer.New Zealand gunlaws are similar to ours. New Zealand gun law is covered by the Arms Act 1983 and the Arms Regulations 1992. To own a firearm, a person must obtain a firearms license. These are issued by the police and enable holders to own and use sporting rifles, shotguns and ammunition. To obtain a license, applicants must pass a test on 'safe and responsible firearms use, ownership, and storage'. They must also be a 'fit and proper person' to hold a license, based on a background check, and the license may be revoked for a variety of reasons. A special license is required by dealers, collectors, pistol club members, and owners of certain semi-automatic firearms. Less than 3% of all firearms owners have such endorsements and they must comply with much more stringent conditions than sporting firearms license holders. When not in use firearms must be locked in a secure rack and cabinet

    Haz.
    When a criminal invades your home and has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun.

    My Definition of Gun Control: The idea that dozens of people found dead in the Broadway Café, Tasmania, and many also seriously wounded, all while waiting for police, who were called to show up and protect them, is somehow morally superior to having several armed and therefore alive civilian's explaining to police how the attacker got that fatal bullet wound.

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Just sucks, it doesn't seem too long ago that , U.S. and other former British Colonies used to respect the rights of private citizens.

    One of the foremost being the right to be armed. I have always wanted to visit Australia and New Zealand ( Maori and my local tribe are setting up trade agreements) but I don't know if I like the way the governments are going. U.S. isn't the exception either, the only reason we are better in our gun rights now is because we have been fighting for them hard and it is specifically spelled out in our constitution.

    Looks like the new world ( Americas, Australia, New Zealand) have forgotten history's lesson of what happens in Europe when they move toward socialism and restricted armed society.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Regular Member Sig229's Avatar
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    sudden valley gunner wrote:

    Looks like the new world ( Americas, Australia, New Zealand) have forgotten history's lesson of what happens in Europe when they move toward socialism and restricted armed society.
    Not forgotten, just ignored.
    "Let your gun be your constant companion during your walks" ~Thomas Jefferson

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Sig229 wrote:
    sudden valley gunner wrote:

    Looks like the new world ( Americas, Australia, New Zealand) have forgotten history's lesson of what happens in Europe when they move toward socialism and restricted armed society.
    Not forgotten, just ignored.
    Get's in the way of their agenda.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    So what would it take to give some of the rights back to our friends up north?

    Though I live in Washington, I frequently travel to BC. Sometimes I travel late at night on my way back. I've heard a lot of crap about what goes on in Surrey and other areas close to it.

    What are B.C's gun laws, and what could people do to get them turned around for the better?

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Dem0072 wrote:
    So what would it take to give some of the rights back to our friends up north?

    Though I live in Washington, I frequently travel to BC. Sometimes I travel late at night on my way back. I've heard a lot of crap about what goes on in Surrey and other areas close to it.

    What are B.C's gun laws, and what could people do to get them turned around for the better?
    At one point I think Surry was having a murder a week. That's been a while ago it is still gnarly up there though. I think number 1 or 2 in the world for petty crimes.


    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Regular Member buster81's Avatar
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    Dem0072 wrote:
    So what would it take to give some of the rights back to our friends up north?

    Though I live in Washington, I frequently travel to BC. Sometimes I travel late at night on my way back. I've heard a lot of crap about what goes on in Surrey and other areas close to it.

    What are B.C's gun laws, and what could people do to get them turned around for the better?
    If you are concerned with personal protection, Canada's gun laws are not going to satisfy you (at least I doubt they will.) Here is a guide to the laws: http://www.panda.com/canadaguns/

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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    buster81 wrote:
    Dem0072 wrote:
    So what would it take to give some of the rights back to our friends up north?

    Though I live in Washington, I frequently travel to BC. Sometimes I travel late at night on my way back. I've heard a lot of crap about what goes on in Surrey and other areas close to it.

    What are B.C's gun laws, and what could people do to get them turned around for the better?
    If you are concerned with personal protection, Canada's gun laws are not going to satisfy you (at least I doubt they will.) Here is a guide to the laws: http://www.panda.com/canadaguns/
    I think he is more concerned about how to change it and get Canadian folks fired up enough to fight for more gun rights. He lives in the same area I do and we have a lot of Canadian encounters and often times even business will take folks back and forth across the border.



    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  18. #18
    Regular Member buster81's Avatar
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    sudden valley gunner wrote:
    buster81 wrote:
    Dem0072 wrote:
    So what would it take to give some of the rights back to our friends up north?

    Though I live in Washington, I frequently travel to BC. Sometimes I travel late at night on my way back. I've heard a lot of crap about what goes on in Surrey and other areas close to it.

    What are B.C's gun laws, and what could people do to get them turned around for the better?
    If you are concerned with personal protection, Canada's gun laws are not going to satisfy you (at least I doubt they will.) Here is a guide to the laws: http://www.panda.com/canadaguns/
    I think he is more concerned about how to change it and get Canadian folks fired up enough to fight for more gun rights. He lives in the same area I do and we have a lot of Canadian encounters and often times even business will take folks back and forth across the border.



    As a former subject of the Queen, I wish you luck. Anyone in Canada that cares is already fired up, and the other 99% of the people are either clueless, or actually believe that things like a gun registry are effective for theirprotection.

    I spent some time in Edmonton about a year ago and went shooting with some folks. We had some good discussions about guns and some of them told me that they kept long guns at their homes that weren't registered (Criminals is the label their government would hang on them if theygot caught).They liked to complain about how the registry was ineffective, and far too costly.

    They asked me how many guns I owned, and when I told them, I got :shock:and when I further went on to say I carried a gun every day, I got :what:. I got the feeling they thought I was some kind of nut. When I told them how much ammunition I had in storage, I think some actuallygot a little frightened. It occurred to me that they talk a good game, but really didn't see the need to have more than a rifle, or perhaps a shotgun with a few rounds of ammunition secretlylocked up in the house.


  19. #19
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Yea I get the same reaction and I only own a few firearms compared to some.

    I am going to just keep encouraging Canadian folks to go shooting with me, down here I think the best education is a hands on education.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    I see, well thanks for the information.

    I usually stay away from Surrey, but I still think the laws up there on firearms are very oppressive.

    Seeing Europe and Canada always serve as good reminders of staying very solid and selective when promoting people into any government office. (not that we don't have our own messes to clean up though)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dem0072 View Post
    So what would it take to give some of the rights back to our friends up north?
    Short answer: A miracle.

    Slightly longer answer: I happened to casually mention OC on a Canadian message board and after an hour, the thread was flooded with literally dozens of posts ridiculing everything from my politics to the size of my genitals. This wasn't even what I would consider a leftist forum, either. It was loaded with members of the OFAH.

    Needless to say, there is much work to be done.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Just sucks, it doesn't seem too long ago that , U.S. and other former British Colonies used to respect the rights of private citizens.
    That does suck!

    Note to British/former British colonies: Get it in writing, i.e. embedded in your Constitution when you federalize!

    Looks like the new world ( Americas, Australia, New Zealand) have forgotten history's lesson of what happens in Europe when they move toward socialism and restricted armed society.
    Not I. Then again, we were among the first to break with our British overlords...
    The First protects the Second, and the Second protects the First. Together, they protect the rest of our Bill of Rights and our United States Constitution, and help We the People protect ourselves in the spirit of our Declaration of Independence.

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