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Thread: Kirotv spreading half-truth statistics...

  1. #1
    Regular Member swatspyder's Avatar
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    http://www.kirotv.com/news/23540945/detail.html

    Poll Source Of Latest Guns In Starbucks Flap

    SEATTLE -- Results of a poll by gun control advocates said the majority of Americans are against customers being able to carry guns into Starbucks locations.The poll by the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence said 56 percent voted in favor of Starbucks having a no guns policy and 37 percent said they were less likely to go to Starbucks because of its current policy of allowing guns in its stores.The Brady Campaign said that Republicans favored barring guns at Starbucks 50-37; independents wanted a no guns policy at Starbucks 55-30; men favored a no guns policy 48-34; rural residents favored no guns 52-33 and non-college graduates favored a no guns policy at Starbucks 56-30.The controversy started when gun rights activists started wearing their weapons into Starbucks stores in California. Gun control advocates fired back with a petition with 36,000 signatures asking Starbucks to ban guns."I certainly appreciate that people have the right to bear arms, but it’s a coffee shop, it's not a place where you need to bring a weapon," said Starbucks customer Rob Ginter.Starbucks said it can't be expected to have employees enforce a policy that is more restrictive than state law.Lake Research Partners conducted the national poll of 600 registered voters April 26-28. The poll carries a margin of error of plus or minus four percent.The Brady Campaign put more polling data on its website.

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    Regular Member amzbrady's Avatar
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    Evidently INVESTIGATIVE reporting is a thing of the past. I didnt see a link for the reporters email. Should send them their other poll, the one that the Brady camplainers couldnt falsify and add numbers to. They also werent able to pick and choose certain people to take it.

    http://apps.facebook.com/opinionpoll...pid=1271716670
    Edited for...

    Or better yet, why doesnt Kiro do their own poll?
    If you voted for Obama to prove you are not a racist...
    what will you do now to prove you are not stupid?

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    AND this proves the reason behind the sales and stock value increase in *$

    swatspyder wrote:
    http://www.kirotv.com/news/23540945/detail.html

    Poll Source Of Latest Guns In Starbucks Flap

    SEATTLE -- Results of a poll by gun control advocates said the majority of Americans are against customers being able to carry guns into Starbucks locations.The poll by the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence said 56 percent voted in favor of Starbucks having a no guns policy and 37 percent said they were less likely to go to Starbucks because of its current policy of allowing guns in its stores.The Brady Campaign said that Republicans favored barring guns at Starbucks 50-37; independents wanted a no guns policy at Starbucks 55-30; men favored a no guns policy 48-34; rural residents favored no guns 52-33 and non-college graduates favored a no guns policy at Starbucks 56-30.The controversy started when gun rights activists started wearing their weapons into Starbucks stores in California. Gun control advocates fired back with a petition with 36,000 signatures asking Starbucks to ban guns."I certainly appreciate that people have the right to bear arms, but it’s a coffee shop, it's not a place where you need to bring a weapon," said Starbucks customer Rob Ginter.Starbucks said it can't be expected to have employees enforce a policy that is more restrictive than state law.Lake Research Partners conducted the national poll of 600 registered voters April 26-28. The poll carries a margin of error of plus or minus four percent.The Brady Campaign put more polling data on its website.

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    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
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    So they got 36,000 signitures....NATION WIDE.

    There are over 2.2 million gun owners in Washington State alone! (And that my friends is only 33%)
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    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
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    Lake Research is a Democratic Front see here for the woman who founded: Celinda Lake

    Celinda Lake
    President





    Follow Celinda's postings on The Huffington Post, and friend Celinda on Facebook.

    Celinda Lake is one of the Democratic Party's leading political strategists, serving as tactician and senior advisor to the national party committees, dozens of Democratic incumbents, and challengers at all levels of the electoral process. Celinda and her firm are known for cutting-edge research on issues including the economy, health care, the environment and education, and have worked for a number of institutions including the Democratic National Committee (DNC), the Democratic Governor's Association (DGA), The White House Project, AFL-CIO, SEIU, CWA, IAFF, Sierra Club, NARAL, Human Rights Campaign, EMILY's List and the Kaiser Family Foundation. Her work has also taken her to advise fledgling democratic parties in several post-war Eastern European countries, including Bosnia, and South Africa. In 2008, Celinda worked as pollster for Vice President Biden.


    There is more BS if you want to read it.....
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    Regular Member HeesBonafide's Avatar
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    People,

    One thing to know, that you only have to sample a small portion of the population in order to come up with accurate results.One will usually see a statement showing95% accuracy on poll results -- this is a mathematical certainty to mean that there is a 95 percent chance that the entire possible poolwould vote that exact way.

    So, polling 600 people may be the number that represents the 95%. Someone may try to argue the merit of whether 600 people is representative of the whole -- don't waste your time unless you remember your statistical analysis math from college -- I have long forgotten how to figure that **** out, but understand the concept.

    And I just saw the Kiro spot -- Kiro did NOT say that these percentages where "their" numbers, but referenced Brady stating that.

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    Regular Member HeesBonafide's Avatar
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    Never have -- just took statistic classes in college. And I can't remember much of what I learned either, but I still have my degree!

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    Regular Member swatspyder's Avatar
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    HeesBonafide wrote:
    People,

    One thing to know, that you only have to sample a small portion of the population in order to come up with accurate results.One will usually see a statement showing95% accuracy on poll results -- this is a mathematical certainty to mean that there is a 95 percent chance that the entire possible poolwould vote that exact way.

    So, polling 600 people may be the number that represents the 95%. Someone may try to argue the merit of whether 600 people is representative of the whole -- don't waste your time unless you remember your statistical analysis math from college -- I have long forgotten how to figure that @#$% out, but understand the concept.

    And I just saw the Kiro spot -- Kiro did NOT say that these percentages where "their" numbers, but referenced Brady stating that.
    lol, by that standard, there should only be 3 people in the entire nation that should vote on the presidential election... wtf. One for each political party, I mean, since they are representative of the whole.

    Oh and better yet, we are going to pick one from New York City, one from Los Angeles and one from Washington D.C.

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    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
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    OK, guys....

    THIS GROUP IS BOGUS THEY ARE A DEMOCRATIC OPERATIVE....













































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    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
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    Live Free or Die!

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    Regular Member amzbrady's Avatar
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    NavyLT wrote:
    My email to them:
    Dear Lake Research Group,

    Brady Campaign poll results. Come on, seriously? Brady Campaign has posted publically that you did a poll of 600 voters nationwide. Really? What do you consider to be nationwide. You've got offices in Washington, DC, Berkely CA, and NYC, NY. Let me guess, that's probably what you consider to be nationwide. You realize by letting the Brady Campaign pay you off to produce skewed results from such a limited group of the American population you have lost any credibility that you might ever had. You really think that polling .0002% of the population that you can have any idea what the American public thinks about any topic at all? Heck, you poll 600 people in the correct locations and you could get 98% of Americans that say the moon is made of Swiss cheese!

    Do yourselves a favor, don't sell out your company, your reputation, and your credibility to make a few thousand dollars doing something as completely ridiculous as this stunt. I would be very interested to hear your defense to this.

    Very Respectfully,
    John Havercroft

    The Brady Campaign and KIROTV have sunk to an incredible new low with this absolutely unbelievably rediculous B.S.! What total morons.

    swatspyder, I am disappointed in you my friend. You called this half-truth statistics. Really? Half? Come one, man. I am sure you meant to call it NO truth statistics!
    You should send your findings to Kiro, or better yet to their competetor showing their lack of investigating the truth behind their story. It's too bad OCDO doesnt have a journalist freindwith a big name paper. Better yet Sea Times should run Dave's articles. Now that would be something.
    If you voted for Obama to prove you are not a racist...
    what will you do now to prove you are not stupid?

    "The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. But, under the name of "liberalism," they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program, until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened." - Norman Thomas

    "They who can who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve niether liberty nor safety." - Ben Franklin

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    swatspyder wrote:
    HeesBonafide wrote:
    People,

    One thing to know, that you only have to sample a small portion of the population in order to come up with accurate results.One will usually see a statement showing95% accuracy on poll results -- this is a mathematical certainty to mean that there is a 95 percent chance that the entire possible poolwould vote that exact way.

    So, polling 600 people may be the number that represents the 95%. Someone may try to argue the merit of whether 600 people is representative of the whole -- don't waste your time unless you remember your statistical analysis math from college -- I have long forgotten how to figure that @#$% out, but understand the concept.

    And I just saw the Kiro spot -- Kiro did NOT say that these percentages where "their" numbers, but referenced Brady stating that.
    lol, by that standard, there should only be 3 people in the entire nation that should vote on the presidential election... wtf. One for each political party, I mean, since they are representative of the whole.

    Oh and better yet, we are going to pick one from New York City, one from Los Angeles and one from Washington D.C.
    Hee'sBonafide is correct about the numbers, provided those numbers are random and have a 100% response rate. The problem with such numbers is that they exhibit self-selection bias, can be tweaked by using a weighted data set, etc.

    Not only that, but the numbers in such a survey are almost never presented honestly, even if the survey itself is not methodologically flawed. By their own results, the correct way to word the results would be "there is a 95% chance that the general population, as a whole, would answer affirmatively between 52 and 60% of the time to the following question: "<question that was asked, as it was asked>". The numbers show a 95% chance that between 46 and 54% of Republicans, 44-52% of men, 48 and 56% of men, and 52 to 60% of rural residents would answer the same question affirmatively."

    The questions are completely left out of the poll for obvious reasons - leading questions tend to produce leading results. That does not mean statistics, overall, are bad, just that they can be misused by a group with an agenda.
    "If we were to ever consider citizenship as the least bit matter of merit instead of birthright, imagine who should be selected as deserved representation of our democracy: someone who would risk their daily livelihood to cast an individually statistically insignificant vote, or those who wrap themselves in the flag against slightest slights." - agenthex

  13. #13
    Regular Member HeesBonafide's Avatar
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    I agree with you that they can skew the results with how they ask the questions and lead the "witness" ...err I mean the "subject"....err the person answering the question no other way than in a manner that suits their liking.

  14. #14
    69Charger
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    I just polled my wife and she said she will not ban guns in my house.
    NUFF SAID.
    Dave

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    Numbers are what they are, no more and no less. It's when we attempt to generate those numbers, and then assign meaning to them, that things get radically skewed.

    Anyone can craft a poll to support anything.

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