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Non-Lethal Self Defense

professor gun

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The reasons for me to carry a handgun openly are: 1) It is my right as a citizen, and 2) self defense.

I am curious if others who are openly carrying a handgun now in Wisconsin (or elsewhere) have considered other options besides the handgun. I am of the opinion that if you are in reasonable fear of significant harm or death that you should use lethal force to defend yourself. I do like to have options particularly because even legitimate uses of lethal force have numerous negative consequences for the defender and his/her family. If in my judgment I can defend myself or my family by use of empty hand techniques or with pepper spray with the handgun being the last option, that would be preferable as long as doing so does not increase the danger to me or my family.

I understand that some would not be physically able to use any sort of empty hand techniques. Martial arts studios and instructors have not done a very good job in my opinion of teaching basic self defense; the perception is that to become proficient you must spend many hours over months to years learning these techniques. The reality is that someone with average physical abilities can be taught effective and basic techniques in a few hours. Likewise proper use of pepper spray can be taught in a short period of time.

Your opinions on this?
 

icepik

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Oct 26, 2009
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Grafton, Wisconsin, USA
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professor gun wrote:
The reasons for me to carry a handgun openly are: 1) It is my right as a citizen, and 2) self defense.

I am curious if others who are openly carrying a handgun now in Wisconsin (or elsewhere) have considered other options besides the handgun. I am of the opinion that if you are in reasonable fear of significant harm or death that you should use lethal force to defend yourself. I do like to have options particularly because even legitimate uses of lethal force have numerous negative consequences for the defender and his/her family. If in my judgment I can defend myself or my family by use of empty hand techniques or with pepper spray with the handgun being the last option, that would be preferable as long as doing so does not increase the danger to me or my family.

I understand that some would not be physically able to use any sort of empty hand techniques. Martial arts studios and instructors have not done a very good job in my opinion of teaching basic self defense; the perception is that to become proficient you must spend many hours over months to years learning these techniques. The reality is that someone with average physical abilities can be taught effective and basic techniques in a few hours. Likewise proper use of pepper spray can be taught in a short period of time.

Your opinions on this?

I personally feel that lethal force should always be a last option, however, to engage in hand to hand combat, or other non lethal battles, you may open yourself up to more harm, or render yourself unable to use your sidearm to defend yourself...or worse, allow your attacker to gain access to your sidearm and use it against you.

Pointing your sidearm at a potential attacker would hopefully be enough of non lethal force to end the potential attack, but if it doesn't, you're only a finger squeeze away from changing your mind about non lethal versus lethal.

Of course this wouldn't apply to a dog attack, as simply pointing a gun at a dog is highly unlikely to deter said dog.

Lethal force isn't, and should never be a #1 go to solution, but making sure you're able to use it if needed should be.
 

Landose_theghost

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Whlie were on the topic, How about air tasers like the cops have? Is it legal for one of us to carry/have one? On a related note, I know from firsthand experiance that them mothers HURT and will definitly stop a would be attacker!
 

Interceptor_Knight

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Green Bay, Wisconsin, USA
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professor gun wrote:
The reasons for me to carry a handgun openly are: 1) It is my right as a citizen, and 2) self defense.

I am curious if others who are openly carrying a handgun now in Wisconsin (or elsewhere) have considered other options besides the handgun. I am of the opinion that if you are in reasonable fear of significant harm or death that you should use lethal force to defend yourself. I do like to have options particularly because even legitimate uses of lethal force have numerous negative consequences for the defender and his/her family. If in my judgment I can defend myself or my family by use of empty hand techniques or with pepper spray with the handgun being the last option, that would be preferable as long as doing so does not increase the danger to me or my family.
Your opinions on this?
Your first and best option is to leave the area. If someone tries to pick a fight, you leave. If someone throws a punch, you leave. Calling you, your mom and your wife names is no reason to stick around and argue. If someone threatens your life, leave. If they pursue you and you can not evade them, then you consider physical options. Deadly force is WAY down on the list of options you should be exercising.
 

TyGuy

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I carry Mean Green OC spray and a knife along with my pistol(s). I am also considering a collapsable batton.
 

Landose_theghost

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TyGuy wrote:
I carry Mean Green OC spray and a knife along with my pistol(s). I am also considering a collapsable batton.
Now i can't be sure that this is true, but I used to carry a batton with me, got stopped by police for an unrelated issue and was told by the officer that he's gonna "let me slide" on this one and to not carryit around anymore as this was technicly a felony offense. But like I said, not sure if that's law or not. Anyone got any input?
 

Interceptor_Knight

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[align=left]Green Bay City Ordinances ban concealed weapons. If you are driving down the street with a "weapon" on your belt, it is concealed.... If a baton is in your pocket in public, it is concealed. If it isenclosed in a case on your belt it may be concealed. I don't know if a holster case on your belt is considered available for immediate use or not.[/align]
[align=left]
[/align]
27.603 WEAPONS
.

[align=left]
(3) POSSESSION OF DANGEROUS OR DEADLY WEAPONS.(a) Generally Prohibited. Except as reasonably necessary to fulfill the exceptions provided elsewhere in this ordinance, no person shall carry or transport any bow or crossbow, or conceal about the person or display in a threatening manner any dangerous or deadly weapon including, but not limited by enumeration to, martial arts weapons such as throwing stars, swords, or nunchiku; slingshots; knuckles of lead, brass, or other metals; or a bowie knife, bow, or crossbow; pistol, revolver, rifle, or shotgun.[/align]
[align=left](b) Exceptions. The prohibitions of subsection (3)(a) will not be construed to prevent the carrying of any type of weapon when it is unloaded and properly cased, boxed, packaged, or otherwise unavailable for immediate use
[/align]
 

BROKENSPROKET

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professor gun wrote:
Martial arts studios and instructors have not done a very good job in my opinion of teaching basic self defense;
The academy that I went to it was all about scoring points at tournaments. It was rather disheartening to know that as a yellow belt, I could take out, in street fight fashion, a majority of the academy's brown belts.

I am not a kid anymore. I would like to take some classes that teaches techniques, to create distance, to draw and other weapon retention techniques.
 
M

McX

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dang boys, my belt going to end up looking alot like a cop's belt. i'm not down for that, but it's good we speak of it. keep going, i'm listening for mine- your idea.

that sword cane appeals to me, but it's 16 ways illegal i bet. added.
 

Nutczak

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Since I do not typically walk around with the batman utility belt hanging off my hips, I am not going to weigh myself down with every option I could ever use. I have a holstered pistol on my side, and a cell-phone in my pocket. I do not have the room for carrying all kinds of extra crap with me,

if a would-beattacker does not back down at the sight of a pistol pointed at his chest, then they are going to have a bigger problem in the next few seconds.
 

qball54208

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Mar 18, 2010
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GREEN BAY, Wisconsin, USA
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TyGuy wrote:
I carry Mean Green OC spray and a knife along with my pistol(s). I am also considering a collapsable batton.
I have an ASP readily accessible on the floor in my truck. I dabble in the Profession of Auto Repo, since I have come in contact with some unsavory individuals. If I can not get away in my truck and I have no other means of escape, then yes I will utilize my ASP. But Empty Hand Control and Verbal Stuns hopefully will do the trick along with some bluffin and puffin.
 

GLOCK21GB

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Green Bay, Wisconsin, USA
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qball54208 wrote:
TyGuy wrote:
I carry Mean Green OC spray and a knife along with my pistol(s). I am also considering a collapsable batton.
I have an ASP readily accessible on the floor in my truck. I dabble in the Profession of Auto Repo, since I have come in contact with some unsavory individuals. If I can not get away in my truck and I have no other means of escape, then yes I will utilize my ASP. But Empty Hand Control and Verbal Stuns hopefully will do the trick along with some bluffin and puffin.
I have an Aluminum Baseball bat next to the door inside my van & a tire buddy.:D

when the cops ask me why I have a bat I tell them I sponsor a little league team.:D
 

professor gun

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BROKENSPROKET wrote:
professor gun wrote:
 Martial arts studios and instructors have not done a very good job in my opinion of teaching basic self defense;
The academy that I went to it was all about scoring points at tournaments. It was rather disheartening to know that as a yellow belt, I could take out, in street fight fashion, a majority of the academy's brown belts.

Unfortunately, Brokensprocket, I think that applies even more today to a lot of the studios. Where I train I suspect most of the young black belts would be in trouble in a fight. There are a few that I spar with that would do just fine but a lot of them would end up in pieces.

Old Grump makes a good point. One of the really good black belts I have trained with over the years got involved in cane defense. With just some very basic training the cane is an excellent weapon.

Thanks for the opinions, guys. I agree use of the weapon has to be a last resort, but it is comforting to have that available.

Other opinions?
 

Shotgun

Wisconsin Carry, Inc.
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Aug 23, 2006
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Madison, Wisconsin, USA
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Landose_theghost wrote:
Whlie were on the topic, How about air tasers like the cops have? Is it legal for one of us to carry/have one? On a related note, I know from firsthand experiance that them mothers HURT and will definitly stop a would be attacker!
Possession of an electric weapon by non-LEO is a felony in Wisconsin. (Chapter 941.295)
 

Shotgun

Wisconsin Carry, Inc.
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Madison, Wisconsin, USA
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Landose_theghost wrote:
TyGuy wrote:
I carry Mean Green OC spray and a knife along with my pistol(s). I am also considering a collapsable batton.
Now i can't be sure that this is true, but I used to carry a batton with me, got stopped by police for an unrelated issue and was told by the officer that he's gonna "let me slide" on this one and to not carryit around anymore as this was technicly a felony offense. But like I said, not sure if that's law or not. Anyone got any input?
Yes, my input is that it's bullshit. It's completely legal to have a collapsible baton, unless you have a local ordinance against it, in which case it wouldn't be a felony or even a misdemeanor----- it would be a non-criminal forfeiture.
 
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