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PPD (Pontiac) says open carry is a direct violation of the cpl

A

army74

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Pontiac, Michigan, USA
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Ive had contact with the PPD and LEO saying im illegally carrying a firearm and ill be arrested. Tried to handle it the right way they didnt want to hear it. Chief says he wants city attorney to check the legality of it even with the paperwork he was given. MSP i called and then they notified PPD i was not in violation of my cpl and they still say i am. So im going to the pontiac city council meeting on Thursday 5/20/2010 at 7pm. The address is 47450 woodward ave 48342. Any support would greatly be appreciated ive gotten response of people who may be coming but any others will be great. TY ev1 you guys have great info
 
S

Savage.Detroit

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Army74 drove out from Pontiac to Taylor Tuesday night to support OCers at the Taylor council meeting. If you are able please support him as well in his fight. The more the merrier! I'll be there for sure.
 
Glock9mmOldStyle

Glock9mmOldStyle

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Taylor, Wayne County, Michigan, USA
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I'll do my best....It'll be difficult for me to make it. Can we try to get a OC help needed thread going ASAP.

If you get crap from them we should try to to put together a LARGE turn out in the future with Scott or another speaker like Jan.

Pontiac City Hall
47450 Woodward Avenue
Pontiac, MI 48342-5009
(248) 758-3000 LINK TO MAP
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sou...0.154324&z=13&iwloc=A&cid=9459716379071993704

Savage.Detroit wrote:
Army74 drove out from Pontiac to Taylor Tuesday night to support OCers at the Taylor council meeting. If you are able please support him as well in his fight. The more the merrier! I'll be there for sure.
Click to expand...
 
DanM

DanM

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I'll be there.

Edit to add:

I propose the following approach. Yourelate to the council a brief summary of your incident, what was said to you, and your communications with other city officials. I will follow you and give council a summary of the legality of OC, how themisinformation from the city's agents, if the allegations are true, are wrong and need to be corrected, and MOC's willingness to be available to the city for further information, training, yada, yada.

What do you think?

Note: I'm a member of MOC, but if there is an issue with me committing MOC in such a way above, change "MOC's willingness" to "our willingness".
 
DanM

DanM

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Army74,

Are you going to be able to be there before 6pm to submit a public comment card, so that you can speak later?

I don't know about the legality of the following, but these apparently are the rules with regard to public comments from the last available agenda:

"The public may address the council during the public discussion portion of the agenda. You must complete a public discussion card located in the City Council Office. Please indicate on the card your name, address, and topic(s) for discussion, and leave your card with the City Council Office staff prior to the start of the meeting at 6:00 p.m. Citizens will be allowed five (5) minutes to discuss city business during a council meeting; and provided further, the Council President shall determine the order in which each person may speak. City Council Rule VI-D (Adopted 2/27/03)"
 
Venator

Venator

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Lansing area, Michigan, USA
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army74 wrote:
Ive had contact with the PPD and LEO saying im illegally carrying a firearm and ill be arrested. Tried to handle it the right way they didnt want to hear it. Chief says he wants city attorney to check the legality of it even with the paperwork he was given. MSP i called and then they notified PPD i was not in violation of my cpl and they still say i am. So im going to the pontiac city council meeting on Thursday 5/20/2010 at 7pm. The address is 47450 woodward ave 48342. Any support would greatly be appreciated ive gotten response of people who may be coming but any others will be great. TY ev1 you guys have great info
Click to expand...
I will be sending an email as a MOC representative. PM me with details so I can include same in my investigation.
 
fozzy71

fozzy71

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Roseville, Michigan, USA
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I could understand this level of ineptitude a year ago, but how can an entire cities police force be so clueless, with all the recent publicity on OC? :?
 
Venator

Venator

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Lansing area, Michigan, USA
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Comments? Haven't sent it yet, but will by noon today.

chief@pontiac.mi.us

Dear Chief Gross:

A citizen of Pontiac requested Michigan Open Carry, Inc. (MOC, Inc.) to investigate his claim that one of your officers informed him that it is against the law for a person with a CPL to open carry thier handgun. The officer stated that once you have a CPL you give up your right to open carry. There is no such law that states you give up your right to open carry once you have a license to conceal. The license allows the person the option to conceal if he so desires. It would be like stating, that since you have a drivers license you can no longer walk.

He also stated that he brought this issue to your department’s attention and was still told it was illegal, even after the Michigan State Police stated it was not. I understand you are having legal look into this issue. Once they inform you that it is indeed lawful to open carry with a CPL it is MOC, Inc. hope that you train your officers in regards to the open carry of a handgun.

I have attached a memo created by the Lansing Police Department on open carry and suggest you review it along with the attached newsletter prepared by the Michigan Municipal League’s LEAF staff on open carry.

If you have any questions please contact me. Our organization is also available to present training to departments on the various aspects of open carry.

Thank you for your time and service to the community of Pontiac.

Sincerely,
Brian G. Jeffs, MS, CPG
Director of Research, MOC, Inc.

 
dougwg

dougwg

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MOC Charter Member Westland, Michigan, USA
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Venator wrote:
Comments? Haven't sent it yet, but will by noon today.

chief@pontiac.mi.us

Dear Chief Gross:

A citizen of Pontiac requested Michigan Open Carry, Inc. (MOC, Inc.) to investigate his claim that one of your officers informed him that it is against the law for a person with a CPL to open carry their handgun. The officer stated that once you have a CPL you give up your right to open carry. There is no such law that states you give up your right to open carry once you have a license to conceal. The license allows the person the option to conceal if he/she so desires. It would be like stating that since you have a drivers license you can no longer walk.

He also stated that he brought this issue to your department’s attention and was still told it was illegal, even after the Michigan State Police stated it was not. I understand you are having legal look into this issue. Once they inform you that it is indeed lawful to open carry with a CPL it is MOC, Inc. hope and in fact your duty to train your officers in regards to the open carry of a handgun.

I have attached a memo created by the Lansing Police Department on open carry and suggest you review it along with the attached newsletter prepared by the Michigan Municipal League’s LEAF staff on open carry.

If you have any questions please contact me. Our organization is also available to present training to departments on the various aspects of open carry.

Thank you for your time and service to the community of Pontiac.

Sincerely,
Brian G. Jeffs, MS, CPG
Director of Research, MOC, Inc.
Click to expand...
all fixed as far as I know
 
Glock9mmOldStyle

Glock9mmOldStyle

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Taylor, Wayne County, Michigan, USA
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dougwg wrote:
Venator wrote:
Comments? Haven't sent it yet, but will by noon today.

chief@pontiac.mi.us

Dear Chief Gross:

A citizen of Pontiac requested Michigan Open Carry, Inc. (MOC, Inc.) to investigate his claim that one of your officers informed him that it is against the law for a person with a CPL to open carry their handgun. The officer stated that once you have a CPL you give up your right to open carry. There is no such law that states you give up your right to open carry once you have a license to conceal. The license allows the person the option to conceal if he/she so desires. It would be like stating that since you have a drivers license you can no longer walk.

He also stated that he brought this issue to your department’s attention and was still told it was illegal, even after the Michigan State Police stated it was not. I understand you are having legal look into this issue. Once they inform you that it is indeed lawful to open carry with a CPL it is MOC, Inc. hope and in fact your duty to train your officers in regards to the open carry of a handgun.

I have attached a memo created by the Lansing Police Department on open carry and suggest you review it along with the attached newsletter prepared by the Michigan Municipal League’s LEAF staff on open carry.

If you have any questions please contact me. Our organization is also available to present training to departments on the various aspects of open carry.

Thank you for your time and service to the community of Pontiac.

Sincerely,
Brian G. Jeffs, MS, CPG
Director of Research, MOC, Inc.
Click to expand...
all fixed as far as I know
Click to expand...
Should she be in bold type? It looks great, well written & to the point.
 
Glock9mmOldStyle

Glock9mmOldStyle

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Taylor, Wayne County, Michigan, USA
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This is from Pontiac's ordinances


Sec. 86-276. Possession of firearms--Restricted. (a)No person shall transport or have in his possession in or upon any vehicle on or about his person a loaded firearm in and upon any street, alley or other place in the city or at any place other than the residence or fixed place of business of such person. (b)No person shall transport or have in his possession in or upon any vehicle, at any place other than the residence or fixed place of business of such person, a firearm unless the firearm shall be unloaded, encased and carried in the luggage compartment of the vehicle. (c)No person shall carry or have on or about his person at any place other than the residence or fixed place of business of such person a firearm unless the firearm is unloaded and encased. (d)No minor shall carry or have on or about his person, or transport or have in possession in or upon any vehicle in and upon any street, alley or other public places in the city a firearm. (Code 1985, § 16-113)

Link to Ords. Type pistol in search box

http://library1.municode.com/default-test/home.htm?infobase=11439&doc_action=whatsnew
 
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