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Thread: GW Parkway-Gun Trap

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    Activist Member swinokur's Avatar
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    From VCDL. Map here

    http://www.vcdl.org/static/gwp.html

    Now that gun carry in National Parks is governed by the substantive law of the state which encompasses the National Park, we expect many Virginia residents as well as visitors will choose to exercise their right to carry as they drive the George Washington Parkway.

    There is a small portion of the GW Parkway which actually runs through DC. Consequently, those carrying firearms would subject themselves to arrest and prosecution under DC's draconian gun laws if stopped on this short stretch of highway.

    What can you do if you plan to drive this section of the GW Parkway?

    1) Be aware!

    2) Divert around this section of the GW Parkway.

    Northbound: Take the I395 SOUTH exit, and get off on the exit for 110 / US 1 (north). Follow this to the intersection US 50, then take the exit to Wilson Blvd. Turn right on North Kent street, then right again on North Lynn street. Follow this to the entrance ramp for the GW Parkway North and you will be safely in VA the whole time.

    Southbound: Take the exit to Arlington National Cemetary / Tomb of the Unknowns. Take the route 110 south exit. Follow 110 south until the I395 interchange. Take I395 North JUST until you get on the GW Parkway.

    OR

    3) Stop at one of the many small parks and pull-offs on the Parkway, unload, and case your firearm before traversing this short section of the Parkway. When safely back in Virginia, reverse the process.

    Northbound: The best location to unload and case your firearm is north of Washington / Reagan National Airport at Gravelly Point.

    Southbound: The best location to unload and case your firearm is off the Arlington National Cemetary / Tomb of the Unknowns exit, turn LEFT and go all the way to the right where the cabs pull off. The best place to reload is Roaches Run right across from Gravelly Point.



    Now that gun carry in National Parks is governed by the substantive law of the state which encompasses the National Park, we expect many Virginia residents as well as visitors will choose to exercise their right to carry as they drive the George Washington Parkway.

    There is a small portion of the GW Parkway which actually runs through DC. Consequently, those carrying firearms would subject themselves to arrest and prosecution under DC's draconian gun laws if stopped on this short stretch of highway.

    What can you do if you plan to drive this section of the GW Parkway?

    1) Be aware!

    2) Divert around this section of the GW Parkway.

    Northbound: Take the I395 SOUTH exit, and get off on the exit for 110 / US 1 (north). Follow this to the intersection US 50, then take the exit to Wilson Blvd. Turn right on North Kent street, then right again on North Lynn street. Follow this to the entrance ramp for the GW Parkway North and you will be safely in VA the whole time.

    Southbound: Take the exit to Arlington National Cemetary / Tomb of the Unknowns. Take the route 110 south exit. Follow 110 south until the I395 interchange. Take I395 North JUST until you get on the GW Parkway.

    OR

    3) Stop at one of the many small parks and pull-offs on the Parkway, unload, and case your firearm before traversing this short section of the Parkway. When safely back in Virginia, reverse the process.

    Northbound: The best location to unload and case your firearm is north of Washington / Reagan National Airport at Gravelly Point.

    Southbound: The best location to unload and case your firearm is off the Arlington National Cemetary / Tomb of the Unknowns exit, turn LEFT and go all the way to the right where the cabs pull off. The best place to reload is Roaches Run right across from Gravelly Point.

  2. #2
    Founder's Club Member - Moderator ed's Avatar
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    [flash=320,256]http://www.youtube.com/v/ixq7D9MuaH4&hl=en_US&fs=1[/flash]
    Carry On.

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    Activist Member swinokur's Avatar
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    I measured this yesterday,

    SB .8 miles
    NB 1.3 miles

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    So if I dial 911 there, who responds?

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    Activist Member swinokur's Avatar
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    Glock27Bill wrote:
    So if I dial 911 there, who responds?
    Depends on the Emergency

    Fire/EMS DC responds
    Police U.S. Park Police

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    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Maybe it's just my bad eyes, but I did not see any sign saying "Welcome to the District of Columbia" or "Leaving Virginia".

    Not that they are required, AFAIK, to post such a notice. But it is common enough on most other roads that cross state lines to tell you when you have done so.

    stay safe.
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    Regular Member wylde007's Avatar
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    I posed similar questions to Philip when I received the mini-update.

    A couple of things come to mind and I present them simply for your consideration:

    1. If you are being "pursued" by Virginia or Fairfax Co. police and enter this section, do they still have authority to cite?
    2. If you enter this section and drive straight through is the park police going to pursue you beyond the D.C. limits? Do they have authority to do so?
    3. Who maintains the road? D.C. or Virginia?
    I doubt seriously that the Park Police have any vested interest in enforcing traffic laws for D.C. on a singular stretch of road. D.C. isn't going to go to the trouble of sending officers through Virginia (where they have no jurisdiction) simply to enforce traffic laws on a 1-mile stretch of highway.

    I'd be willing to bet that if you dial 911 you would get Fairfax Co. and not D.C. You'd probably get Arlington.

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    Activist Member swinokur's Avatar
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    skidmark wrote:
    Maybe it's just my bad eyes, but I did not see any sign saying "Welcome to the District of Columbia" or "Leaving Virginia".

    Not that they are required, AFAIK, to post such a notice. But it is common enough on most other roads that cross state lines to tell you when you have done so.

    stay safe.
    nope. nary a sign. Maybe one of you guys should ask NPS to do this. It's their jurisdiction

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    Activist Member swinokur's Avatar
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    wylde007 wrote:
    I posed similar questions to Philip when I received the mini-update.

    A couple of things come to mind and I present them simply for your consideration:
    1. If you are being "pursued" by Virginia or Fairfax Co. police and enter this section, do they still have authority to cite?
    2. If you enter this section and drive straight through is the park police going to pursue you beyond the D.C. limits? Do they have authority to do so?
    3. Who maintains the road? D.C. or Virginia?
    I doubt seriously that the Park Police have any vested interest in enforcing traffic laws for D.C. on a singular stretch of road. D.C. isn't going to go to the trouble of sending officers through Virginia (where they have no jurisdiction) simply to enforce traffic laws on a 1-mile stretch of highway.

    I'd be willing to bet that if you dial 911 you would get Fairfax Co. and not D.C. You'd probably get Arlington.
    Dc cops don;t have to drive through VA to get to this location. They come across Memorial Bridge and as soon as they do they are on the Island. Still DC the entire time
    US Park Police have jurisdiction almost evrywhere IIRC. because they are Fed, Pursuit rules would dictate when to stop a pursuit.Outside the island, it's Arlington Co. The road is maintained by NPS. It's a parkway. If you call 911 and get Arlington and tell them you are on Columbia Island, they will transfer the call to either DC or USPP, depending on the nature.

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    Regular Member wylde007's Avatar
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    swinokur wrote:
    D.C. cops don't have to drive through VA to get to this location. They come across Memorial Bridge and as soon as they do they are on the Island. Still DC the entire time

    No, but they don't come right onto GW Pkwy immediately. In order to do so they must exit north, turn around in Virginia and then drive S.B. on GW through Virginia.

    They could not physically police GW Parkway without at some time or another entering VA.

    There is no turnaround anywhere on the island N.B. The only pullover is just north of the Navy & Marine Memorial. S.B. the only spot is the LBJ Park.

    To me this seems like a non-issue. Don't get pulled over on the island. Park police have better things to worry about and I doubt seriously that their primary impetus is going to be to guess who is carrying a firearm, pull only those people over and then issue a citation.

    Is it a reason to exercise caution? Sure. Is it a reason to route your drive around a stretch of highway? Make your own call. I would say "no" but I guess I just like living on the edge.
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    Activist Member swinokur's Avatar
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    wylde007 wrote:
    swinokur wrote:
    D.C. cops don't have to drive through VA to get to this location. They come across Memorial Bridge and as soon as they do they are on the Island. Still DC the entire time

    No, but they don't come right onto GW Pkwy immediately. In order to do so they must exit north, turn around in Virginia and then drive S.B. on GW through Virginia.

    They could not physically police GW Parkway without at some time or another entering VA.

    There is no turnaround anywhere on the island N.B. The only pullover is just north of the Navy & Marine Memorial. S.B. the only spot is the LBJ Park.

    To me this seems like a non-issue. Don't get pulled over on the island. Park police have better things to worry about and I doubt seriously that their primary impetus is going to be to guess who is carrying a firearm, pull only those people over and then issue a citation.

    Is it a reason to exercise caution? Sure. Is it a reason to route your drive around a stretch of highway? Make your own call. I would say "no" but I guess I just like living on the edge.
    I don't feel it's worth the risk, but as you said it's just informational. i drive that way evey day. As soon as you get off the MemorialBbridge there is an exit on your leftthat takes you right down onto the PW. I will doble check Monday but IIRC you don't leave DC.The circle at the end of the bridgeis in DC. I'll rerport back.

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    Regular Member wylde007's Avatar
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    The circle is in D.C. It is a roundabout so there is no "left" exit. If you come from the D.C. proper onto Columbia Island you must bear right on the roundabout onto Arlington Blvd and then merge onto N.B. GW Pkwy.

    I'm looking at it being impossible for a vehicle to enter the island and then attempt to stay entirely in D.C. The only way to do that is to follow the roundabout all the way around and re-cross the bridge. It is physically impossible to access G.W. parkway and return without entering Virginia.

    However, if you are able to find a way to discount my review of the aerial maps of this area, I do welcome it. It is possible I am not seeing something.

    I still contend that a D.C. officer would have to be making an extra-special concerted effort enforce traffic laws in that particular area. I wouldn't necessarily put it past them, either, but it just doesn't seem like it would be worth the trouble, and I would think the NPS has better things to do.


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    Activist Member swinokur's Avatar
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    wylde007 wrote:
    The circle is in D.C. It is a roundabout so there is no "left" exit. If you come from the D.C. proper onto Columbia Island you must bear right on the roundabout onto Arlington Blvd and then merge onto N.B. GW Pkwy.

    I'm looking at it being impossible for a vehicle to enter the island and then attempt to stay entirely in D.C. The only way to do that is to follow the roundabout all the way around and re-cross the bridge. It is physically impossible to access G.W. parkway and return without entering Virginia.

    However, if you are able to find a way to discount my review of the aerial maps of this area, I do welcome it. It is possible I am not seeing something.

    I still contend that a D.C. officer would have to be making an extra-special concerted effort enforce traffic laws in that particular area. I wouldn't necessarily put it past them, either, but it just doesn't seem like it would be worth the trouble, and I would think the NPS has better things to do.

    My concern is you get stopped for a minor traffic violation and you are carrying in any form. Bingo. Busted. it's not the traffic law I am concerned about. It's DC's gun laws that scare me

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    Activist Member swinokur's Avatar
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    wylde007 wrote:
    The circle is in D.C. It is a roundabout so there is no "left" exit. If you come from the D.C. proper onto Columbia Island you must bear right on the roundabout onto Arlington Blvd and then merge onto N.B. GW Pkwy.

    I'm looking at it being impossible for a vehicle to enter the island and then attempt to stay entirely in D.C. The only way to do that is to follow the roundabout all the way around and re-cross the bridge. It is physically impossible to access G.W. parkway and return without entering Virginia.

    However, if you are able to find a way to discount my review of the aerial maps of this area, I do welcome it. It is possible I am not seeing something.

    I still contend that a D.C. officer would have to be making an extra-special concerted effort enforce traffic laws in that particular area. I wouldn't necessarily put it past them, either, but it just doesn't seem like it would be worth the trouble, and I would think the NPS has better things to do.

    I looked at the map and the short exit off to the left of Arl. Blvd is there. I can't upload it becuse it's to large even after trimming. It is there however.

    At any rate, be forewarned. DC cops won't be on the Island. USPP will.

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    Activist Member swinokur's Avatar
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    map attached exit in red

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    Regular Member wylde007's Avatar
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    swinokur wrote:
    I looked at the map and the short exit off to the left of Arl. Blvd is there. I can't upload it becuse it's to large even after trimming. It is there however.
    Arlington Boulevard.

    Therein lies the rub.

    This thread is about George Washington Parkway. If you start in Virginia and drive along George Washington Parkway you cannot enter D.C. proper.

    If you start in D.C. you cannot enter GW Pkwy and re-enter D.C. without making a trip through part of Virginia.

    Again, I doubt seriously that the NPS is going to make much of an effort to enforce anything other than traffic laws on that stretch of road. While their jurisdiction may encompass enforcing D.C. criminal law is that going to be the focus of their policing?

    I highly, highly doubt it. And that's based on my interaction with park police at the RTC Rally.

    Conclusion: be smart, but don't be paranoid. Not until we start hearing about dozens of lawfully-carrying citizens being pulled over into Lady Bird Johnson Park and hauled off in handcuffs.
    The quiet war has begun, with silent weapons
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    Activist Member swinokur's Avatar
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    wylde007 wrote:
    swinokur wrote:
    I looked at the map and the short exit off to the left of Arl. Blvd is there. I can't upload it becuse it's to large even after trimming. It is there however.
    Arlington Boulevard.

    Therein lies the rub.

    This thread is about George Washington Parkway. If you start in Virginia and drive along George Washington Parkway you cannot enter D.C. proper.

    If you start in D.C. you cannot enter GW Pkwy and re-enter D.C. without making a trip through part of Virginia.

    Again, I doubt seriously that the NPS is going to make much of an effort to enforce anything other than traffic laws on that stretch of road. While their jurisdiction may encompass enforcing D.C. criminal law is that going to be the focus of their policing?

    I highly, highly doubt it. And that's based on my interaction with park police at the RTC Rally.

    Conclusion: be smart, but don't be paranoid. Not until we start hearing about dozens of lawfully-carrying citizens being pulled over into Lady Bird Johnson Park and hauled off in handcuffs.
    gotcha but you can make a U turn at the entrance to the Marina this not going back into VA

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    I've been driving in that area since the late 1960's, and I've never, ever seen a car stopped in, around, or near that section of road. I think the cops are happy if everyone just keeps going from one side to the other and gets themselves sorted out properly depending on whether they're headed to Washington, Rosslyn, or up Rt. 50.
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    Newbie W.E.G.'s Avatar
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    While the mentioned area is without a doubt DC territory, I can say I have NEVER seen, nor am I aware of, a DC Scout Car engaged in police operations on the GW Parkway.

    All police matters on the Parkway are handled by US Park Police.
    They have concurrent police jurisdiction with DC and Virginia anyway.

    Arlington County Fire Department has first due fire and EMS responsibility in that area.

    Metropolitan Police "harbor patrol" unit handles police matters on the water in that area.

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    Regular Member wylde007's Avatar
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    gotcha but you can make a U turn at the entrance to the Marina this not going back into VA
    I looked at that but it appeared to be blockaded. Maybe it's the "camera" angle. :?
    The quiet war has begun, with silent weapons
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    Activist Member swinokur's Avatar
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    wylde007 wrote:
    gotcha but you can make a U turn at the entrance to the Marina this not going back into VA
    I looked at that but it appeared to be blockaded. Maybe it's the "camera" angle. :?
    The barricade is temporary because of the bridge construction IIRC

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    Activist Member swinokur's Avatar
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    W.E.G. wrote:
    While the mentioned area is without a doubt DC territory, I can say I have NEVER seen, nor am I aware of, a DC Scout Car engaged in police operations on the GW Parkway.

    All police matters on the Parkway are handled by US Park Police.
    They have concurrent police jurisdiction with DC and Virginia anyway.

    Arlington County Fire Department has first due fire and EMS responsibility in that area.

    Metropolitan Police "harbor patrol" unit handles police matters on the water in that area.
    DC Fire is first due to any fire ems or fire incident including the Marina. I worked for te DCFD for many years and my Engine Company in Foggy Bottom was "first due" to Columbia Island. Arlington is not responsible for the Island, DC is unless mutual aid is now in place.

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    Regular Member riverrat10k's Avatar
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    Just to be a smart aleck, how many GSL magnets did you have on your car, Ed?
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    Regular Member wylde007's Avatar
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    swinokur wrote:
    The barricade is temporary because of the bridge construction IIRC
    So technically I'm right... until construction is complete!
    The quiet war has begun, with silent weapons
    And the newest slavery is to keep the people poor, and stupid
    Novos ordo seclorum ~ Mustaine

    Never argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

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    If you want to take your chances carrying through this area, that's up to you. But at least now you've got the info. You know what can happen to you if you get stopped for speeding or get into an accident on this road while carrying, so it's up to you to make an informed decision.

    I wouldn't be telling anyone, "There's nothing to worry about," though. My concern would be if the USPP decide someday this would be a good place to start sticking it to Virginia gun owners, especially if the powers-that-be tell them to do it for political reasons. That's why it's called the Columbia Island Gun Trap.

    Just use your noodle and take care.

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