GW Parkway-Gun Trap

swinokur · May 20, 2010

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[font="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"]From VCDL. Map here

http://www.vcdl.org/static/gwp.html

[/font][font="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"]Now that gun carry in National Parks is governed by the substantive law of the state which encompasses the National Park, we expect many Virginia residents as well as visitors will choose to exercise their right to carry as they drive the George Washington Parkway.

There is a small portion of the GW Parkway which actually runs through DC. Consequently, those carrying firearms would subject themselves to arrest and prosecution under DC's draconian gun laws if stopped on this short stretch of highway.

What can you do if you plan to drive this section of the GW Parkway?

1) Be aware!

2) Divert around this section of the GW Parkway.

Northbound: Take the I395 SOUTH exit, and get off on the exit for 110 / US 1 (north). Follow this to the intersection US 50, then take the exit to Wilson Blvd. Turn right on North Kent street, then right again on North Lynn street. Follow this to the entrance ramp for the GW Parkway North and you will be safely in VA the whole time.

Southbound: Take the exit to Arlington National Cemetary / Tomb of the Unknowns. Take the route 110 south exit. Follow 110 south until the I395 interchange. Take I395 North JUST until you get on the GW Parkway.

OR

3) Stop at one of the many small parks and pull-offs on the Parkway, unload, and case your firearm before traversing this short section of the Parkway. When safely back in Virginia, reverse the process.

Northbound: The best location to unload and case your firearm is north of Washington / Reagan National Airport at Gravelly Point.

Southbound: The best location to unload and case your firearm is off the Arlington National Cemetary / Tomb of the Unknowns exit, turn LEFT and go all the way to the right where the cabs pull off. The best place to reload is Roaches Run right across from Gravelly Point. [/font]
[font="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"]

Now that gun carry in National Parks is governed by the substantive law of the state which encompasses the National Park, we expect many Virginia residents as well as visitors will choose to exercise their right to carry as they drive the George Washington Parkway.

There is a small portion of the GW Parkway which actually runs through DC. Consequently, those carrying firearms would subject themselves to arrest and prosecution under DC's draconian gun laws if stopped on this short stretch of highway.

What can you do if you plan to drive this section of the GW Parkway?

1) Be aware!

2) Divert around this section of the GW Parkway.

Northbound: Take the I395 SOUTH exit, and get off on the exit for 110 / US 1 (north). Follow this to the intersection US 50, then take the exit to Wilson Blvd. Turn right on North Kent street, then right again on North Lynn street. Follow this to the entrance ramp for the GW Parkway North and you will be safely in VA the whole time.

Southbound: Take the exit to Arlington National Cemetary / Tomb of the Unknowns. Take the route 110 south exit. Follow 110 south until the I395 interchange. Take I395 North JUST until you get on the GW Parkway.

OR

3) Stop at one of the many small parks and pull-offs on the Parkway, unload, and case your firearm before traversing this short section of the Parkway. When safely back in Virginia, reverse the process.

Northbound: The best location to unload and case your firearm is north of Washington / Reagan National Airport at Gravelly Point.

Southbound: The best location to unload and case your firearm is off the Arlington National Cemetary / Tomb of the Unknowns exit, turn LEFT and go all the way to the right where the cabs pull off. The best place to reload is Roaches Run right across from Gravelly Point. [/font]

ed · May 20, 2010

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[flash=320,256]http://www.youtube.com/v/ixq7D9MuaH4&hl=en_US&fs=1[/flash]

swinokur · May 21, 2010

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I measured this yesterday,

SB .8 miles
NB 1.3 miles

Glock27Bill · May 21, 2010

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So if I dial 911 there, who responds?

swinokur · May 21, 2010

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Glock27Bill wrote:

So if I dial 911 there, who responds?

Depends on the Emergency

Fire/EMS DC responds
Police U.S. Park Police

skidmark · May 21, 2010

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Maybe it's just my bad eyes, but I did not see any sign saying "Welcome to the District of Columbia" or "Leaving Virginia".

Not that they are required, AFAIK, to post such a notice. But it is common enough on most other roads that cross state lines to tell you when you have done so.

stay safe.

wylde007 · May 21, 2010

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I posed similar questions to Philip when I received the mini-update.

A couple of things come to mind and I present them simply for your consideration:

If you are being "pursued" by Virginia or Fairfax Co. police and enter this section, do they still have authority to cite?
If you enter this section and drive straight through is the park police going to pursue you beyond the D.C. limits? Do they have authority to do so?
Who maintains the road? D.C. or Virginia?

I doubt seriously that the Park Police have any vested interest in enforcing traffic laws for D.C. on a singular stretch of road. D.C. isn't going to go to the trouble of sending officers through Virginia (where they have no jurisdiction) simply to enforce traffic laws on a 1-mile stretch of highway.

I'd be willing to bet that if you dial 911 you would get Fairfax Co. and not D.C. You'd probably get Arlington.

swinokur · May 21, 2010

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skidmark wrote:

Maybe it's just my bad eyes, but I did not see any sign saying "Welcome to the District of Columbia" or "Leaving Virginia".

Not that they are required, AFAIK, to post such a notice. But it is common enough on most other roads that cross state lines to tell you when you have done so.

stay safe.

nope. nary a sign. Maybe one of you guys should ask NPS to do this. It's their jurisdiction

swinokur · May 21, 2010

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wylde007 wrote:

I posed similar questions to Philip when I received the mini-update.

A couple of things come to mind and I present them simply for your consideration:

If you are being "pursued" by Virginia or Fairfax Co. police and enter this section, do they still have authority to cite?
If you enter this section and drive straight through is the park police going to pursue you beyond the D.C. limits? Do they have authority to do so?
Who maintains the road? D.C. or Virginia?

I doubt seriously that the Park Police have any vested interest in enforcing traffic laws for D.C. on a singular stretch of road. D.C. isn't going to go to the trouble of sending officers through Virginia (where they have no jurisdiction) simply to enforce traffic laws on a 1-mile stretch of highway.

I'd be willing to bet that if you dial 911 you would get Fairfax Co. and not D.C. You'd probably get Arlington.

Dc cops don;t have to drive through VA to get to this location. They come across Memorial Bridge and as soon as they do they are on the Island. Still DC the entire time

US Park Police have jurisdiction almost evrywhere IIRC. because they are Fed, Pursuit rules would dictate when to stop a pursuit.Outside the island, it's Arlington Co. The road is maintained by NPS. It's a parkway. If you call 911 and get Arlington and tell them you are on Columbia Island, they will transfer the call to either DC or USPP, depending on the nature.

wylde007 · May 21, 2010

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swinokur wrote:

D.C. cops don't have to drive through VA to get to this location. They come across Memorial Bridge and as soon as they do they are on the Island. Still DC the entire time

No, but they don't come right onto GW Pkwy immediately. In order to do so they must exit north, turn around in Virginia and then drive S.B. on GW through Virginia.

They could not physically police GW Parkway without at some time or another entering VA.

There is no turnaround anywhere on the island N.B. The only pullover is just north of the Navy & Marine Memorial. S.B. the only spot is the LBJ Park.

To me this seems like a non-issue. Don't get pulled over on the island. Park police have better things to worry about and I doubt seriously that their primary impetus is going to be to guess who is carrying a firearm, pull only those people over and then issue a citation.

Is it a reason to exercise caution? Sure. Is it a reason to route your drive around a stretch of highway? Make your own call. I would say "no" but I guess I just like living on the edge.

swinokur · May 21, 2010

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wylde007 wrote:

swinokur wrote:

D.C. cops don't have to drive through VA to get to this location. They come across Memorial Bridge and as soon as they do they are on the Island. Still DC the entire time

Click to expand...

No, but they don't come right onto GW Pkwy immediately. In order to do so they must exit north, turn around in Virginia and then drive S.B. on GW through Virginia.

They could not physically police GW Parkway without at some time or another entering VA.

There is no turnaround anywhere on the island N.B. The only pullover is just north of the Navy & Marine Memorial. S.B. the only spot is the LBJ Park.

To me this seems like a non-issue. Don't get pulled over on the island. Park police have better things to worry about and I doubt seriously that their primary impetus is going to be to guess who is carrying a firearm, pull only those people over and then issue a citation.

Is it a reason to exercise caution? Sure. Is it a reason to route your drive around a stretch of highway? Make your own call. I would say "no" but I guess I just like living on the edge.

I don't feel it's worth the risk, but as you said it's just informational. i drive that way evey day. As soon as you get off the MemorialBbridge there is an exit on your leftthat takes you right down onto the PW. I will doble check Monday but IIRC you don't leave DC.The circle at the end of the bridgeis in DC. I'll rerport back.

wylde007 · May 21, 2010

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The circle is in D.C. It is a roundabout so there is no "left" exit. If you come from the D.C. proper onto Columbia Island you must bear right on the roundabout onto Arlington Blvd and then merge onto N.B. GW Pkwy.

I'm looking at it being impossible for a vehicle to enter the island and then attempt to stay entirely in D.C. The only way to do that is to follow the roundabout all the way around and re-cross the bridge. It is physically impossible to access G.W. parkway and return without entering Virginia.

However, if you are able to find a way to discount my review of the aerial maps of this area, I do welcome it. It is possible I am not seeing something.

I still contend that a D.C. officer would have to be making an extra-special concerted effort enforce traffic laws in that particular area. I wouldn't necessarily put it past them, either, but it just doesn't seem like it would be worth the trouble, and I would think the NPS has better things to do.

swinokur · May 21, 2010

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wylde007 wrote:

The circle is in D.C. It is a roundabout so there is no "left" exit. If you come from the D.C. proper onto Columbia Island you must bear right on the roundabout onto Arlington Blvd and then merge onto N.B. GW Pkwy.

I'm looking at it being impossible for a vehicle to enter the island and then attempt to stay entirely in D.C. The only way to do that is to follow the roundabout all the way around and re-cross the bridge. It is physically impossible to access G.W. parkway and return without entering Virginia.

However, if you are able to find a way to discount my review of the aerial maps of this area, I do welcome it. It is possible I am not seeing something.

I still contend that a D.C. officer would have to be making an extra-special concerted effort enforce traffic laws in that particular area. I wouldn't necessarily put it past them, either, but it just doesn't seem like it would be worth the trouble, and I would think the NPS has better things to do.

My concern is you get stopped for a minor traffic violation and you are carrying in any form. Bingo. Busted. it's not the traffic law I am concerned about. It's DC's gun laws that scare me

swinokur · May 21, 2010

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wylde007 wrote:

The circle is in D.C. It is a roundabout so there is no "left" exit. If you come from the D.C. proper onto Columbia Island you must bear right on the roundabout onto Arlington Blvd and then merge onto N.B. GW Pkwy.

I'm looking at it being impossible for a vehicle to enter the island and then attempt to stay entirely in D.C. The only way to do that is to follow the roundabout all the way around and re-cross the bridge. It is physically impossible to access G.W. parkway and return without entering Virginia.

However, if you are able to find a way to discount my review of the aerial maps of this area, I do welcome it. It is possible I am not seeing something.

I still contend that a D.C. officer would have to be making an extra-special concerted effort enforce traffic laws in that particular area. I wouldn't necessarily put it past them, either, but it just doesn't seem like it would be worth the trouble, and I would think the NPS has better things to do.

I looked at the map and the short exit off to the left of Arl. Blvd is there. I can't upload it becuse it's to large even after trimming. It is there however.

At any rate, be forewarned. DC cops won't be on the Island. USPP will.

swinokur · May 21, 2010

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map attached exit in red

wylde007 · May 21, 2010

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swinokur wrote:

I looked at the map and the short exit off to the left of Arl. Blvd is there. I can't upload it becuse it's to large even after trimming. It is there however.

Arlington Boulevard.

Therein lies the rub.

This thread is about George Washington Parkway. If you start in Virginia and drive along George Washington Parkway you cannot enter D.C. proper.

If you start in D.C. you cannot enter GW Pkwy and re-enter D.C. without making a trip through part of Virginia.

Again, I doubt seriously that the NPS is going to make much of an effort to enforce anything other than traffic laws on that stretch of road. While their jurisdiction may encompass enforcing D.C. criminal law is that going to be the focus of their policing?

I highly, highly doubt it. And that's based on my interaction with park police at the RTC Rally.

Conclusion: be smart, but don't be paranoid. Not until we start hearing about dozens of lawfully-carrying citizens being pulled over into Lady Bird Johnson Park and hauled off in handcuffs.

swinokur · May 21, 2010

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wylde007 wrote:

swinokur wrote:

I looked at the map and the short exit off to the left of Arl. Blvd is there. I can't upload it becuse it's to large even after trimming. It is there however.

Click to expand...

Arlington Boulevard.

Therein lies the rub.

This thread is about George Washington Parkway. If you start in Virginia and drive along George Washington Parkway you cannot enter D.C. proper.

If you start in D.C. you cannot enter GW Pkwy and re-enter D.C. without making a trip through part of Virginia.

Again, I doubt seriously that the NPS is going to make much of an effort to enforce anything other than traffic laws on that stretch of road. While their jurisdiction may encompass enforcing D.C. criminal law is that going to be the focus of their policing?

I highly, highly doubt it. And that's based on my interaction with park police at the RTC Rally.

Conclusion: be smart, but don't be paranoid. Not until we start hearing about dozens of lawfully-carrying citizens being pulled over into Lady Bird Johnson Park and hauled off in handcuffs.

gotcha but you can make a U turn at the entrance to the Marina this not going back into VA

user · May 21, 2010

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I've been driving in that area since the late 1960's, and I've never, ever seen a car stopped in, around, or near that section of road. I think the cops are happy if everyone just keeps going from one side to the other and gets themselves sorted out properly depending on whether they're headed to Washington, Rosslyn, or up Rt. 50.

W.E.G. · May 21, 2010

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While the mentioned area is without a doubt DC territory, I can say I have NEVER seen, nor am I aware of, a DC Scout Car engaged in police operations on the GW Parkway.

All police matters on the Parkway are handled by US Park Police.
They have concurrent police jurisdiction with DC and Virginia anyway.

Arlington County Fire Department has first due fire and EMS responsibility in that area.

Metropolitan Police "harbor patrol" unit handles police matters on the water in that area.

wylde007 · May 21, 2010

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gotcha but you can make a U turn at the entrance to the Marina this not going back into VA

I looked at that but it appeared to be blockaded. Maybe it's the "camera" angle. :?

GW Parkway-Gun Trap

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