Results 1 to 21 of 21

Thread: Video Recording Of Arrests Sparks Debate. ABC TV13 WJZ.com

  1. #1
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    across Death's Door on Washington Island, Wisconsin, USA
    Posts
    2,382

    Post imported post

    http://wjz.com/local/preakness.fight...2.1708562.html

    Marylanders face felony charges for recording their arrests on camera, and others have been intimidated to shut their cameras off.

    That's touched off a legal controversy. Mike Hellgrenexplains thefierce debate and what you should do to protect yourself.

    A man whose arrest was caught on video faces felony charges from Maryland State Police for recording it on camera.

    "We are enforcing the law, and we don't make any apologies for that," said Greg Shipley, MSP.

    Video of another arrest at the Preakness quickly made its way online, despite an officer issuing this warning to the person who shot it, "Do me a favor and turn that off.It's illegal to videotape anybody's voice or anything else, against the law in the state of Maryland."

    But is he right? Can police stop you from recording their actions, likea beating at the University of Maryland College Park?

    TheAmerican Civil Liberties Union says no.

    "For the government to be saying it has the power to prevent citizens from doing that is profoundly shocking, troubling, and particularly in the case of Maryland, simply flat-out wrong," said David Roach, ACLU.

    Under Maryland law, conversations in private cannot be recorded without the consent of both people involved.

    But can that be applied toincidents such as one caught on tape three years ago where a Baltimore officer arrested a teenager at the Inner Harbor?

    "When you tell me to turn it off because it's against the law, you've proven to me that I'm not secretly taping you," said law professor Byron Warnken. "He doesn't have the right to say, if you don't stop recording me, I'm going to arrest you."

    The last official interpretation of Maryland's law came from the previous attorney general saying it was legal for officers to record video on dashcams.

    Delegate Sandy Rosenberg is pushing the current attorney general for his opinion on whether you can record them, too.

    "If he finds that there are circumstances when it's illegal, under existing law, to tape public actions by police or other public officials, then it's appropriate for me to introduce a bill to change that statute," said Rosenberg, Democrat, District 41, Baltimore City.

    At this point, the attorney general has not indicated whether he will issue an opinion clarifying this law.

  2. #2
    Regular Member Brimstone Baritone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Leeds, Alabama, USA
    Posts
    786

    Post imported post

    Which is why I'm glad I live in a single-party consent state. They can ask me to turn off the recorder, but as long as we're in a public place, I have no obligation.

    I would think that if a third party is openly recording the arrest then it wouldn't qualify as a private conversation...
    There was a time that the pieces fit, but I watched them fall away, mildewed and smoldering, strangled by our coveting. I've done the math enough to know the dangers of our second guessing. Doomed to crumble, unless we grow and strengthen our communication. -Tool, "Schism"

  3. #3
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Fairborn, Ohio, USA
    Posts
    13,063

    Post imported post

    IANAL, but wouldn't you be able to record a public conversation, even in an all-party State?

    It seems to me that any interaction between a representative of the State and a citizen, especially one that puts the citizen at risk from the State, is a matter of public record, not a private conversation. Therefore, the citizen should be able to record it. The only person in the interaction with a privacy interest would be the citizen.

  4. #4
    Regular Member rodbender's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Navasota, Texas, USA
    Posts
    2,524

    Post imported post

    eye95 wrote:
    IANAL, but wouldn't you be able to record a public conversation, even in an all-party State?

    It seems to me that any interaction between a representative of the State and a citizen, especially one that puts the citizen at risk from the State, is a matter of public record, not a private conversation. Therefore, the citizen should be able to record it. The only person in the interaction with a privacy interest would be the citizen.
    Same here.


    The thing about common sense is....it ain't too common.
    Will Rogers

  5. #5
    Campaign Veteran Nelson_Muntz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Manassas, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    697

    Post imported post

    Then it must be against the law to use all those dash cams, red light and speeding cams, and surveillance cameras on the street and in stores....

  6. #6
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Portsmouth, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    463

    Post imported post

    "We are enforcing the law, and we don't make any apologies for that," said Greg Shipley, MSP.
    Enforcing their own personal opinions, rather than the law, is more like it!

    Further proof...NEVER ask a LEO for legal advice...to put it nicely, they're clueless!!! This is NOT and honest mistake...This isthe police force for the People's Republic of MD trying to enforce their will under the cover of darkness...plain and simple!!!

    I hope the victims in this case sue and the MD State Police get their a$$es handed to them on a platter!

  7. #7
    McX
    Guest

    Post imported post

    it's nice to have the gizmo, but you gotta turn it on. something must be afoot, as i see some threads that you can't record, or something to that effect. everyone concerned can pin their hopes on dash cams, suveliance cams, web cams, if they're turned on. and no one corrupt gets to them before the truth must be viewed. mindful of their actions for everyone concerned, yeah, if it's allowed and turned on.

  8. #8
    Campaign Veteran GLOCK21GB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Green Bay, Wisconsin, USA
    Posts
    4,348

    Post imported post

    Still think you all reside in a free country ? :?
    http://youtu.be/xWgVGu3OR4U AACFI, Wisconsin / Minnesota Carry Certified. Action Pistol & Advanced Action pistol concepts + Urban Carbine course. When the entitlement Zombies begin looting, pillaging, raping, burning & killing..remember HEAD SHOTS it's the only way to kill a Zombie. Stockpile food & water now.

    Please support your local,county, state & Federal Law enforcement agencies, right ???

  9. #9

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Posts
    1,128

    Post imported post

    The MSP are reaching here: but the law is a fickle thing.

    Until there is some good law on this, just turn the sound off on your videocam.

    Sure they can arrest you, but at least you won't be convicted of a felony.

  10. #10
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    166

    Post imported post

    Quick! Someone rush to defend the police position!

  11. #11
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Eagle, Idaho, USA
    Posts
    639

    Post imported post

    canadian wrote:
    Quick! Someone rush to defend the police position!
    Actually, I have more of an issue with the prosecutors and local government in these cases. The police are subject to civil authority, and when the local authorities tell them to stop they will in most cases. The police are wrong, yes, but it is a greater tragedy that we continue to elect government officials who do not stand up for our rights.

  12. #12
    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Grennsboro NC
    Posts
    5,358

    Post imported post

    my only comment:


    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

  13. #13
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Valdosta, Georgia, USA
    Posts
    347

    Post imported post

    I fully support 'most' LEO's and I understand that they have a difficult, dangerous and sometimes thankless job. I commonly interface with local LEO.

    Having said that, when I was in my 20's to 30's, I was often treated with disrespect, without cause, from many LEO's. This would happen even if I was treating them with respect.

    The problem I saw was the use of the "disorderly conduct" charge. There was a time that I witnessed two men fighting. One hit the other from behind and got quite a beating. Finally, the one that was attacked, got the upper hand. That is when a LEO arrived.

    He dragged off the one who had been assaulted and put him in cuffs, while doing nothing to the other. Since I witnessed the fight, as did
    others, I said: "Officer, the other guy started the fight.". He said: "If you say another word, you're going to jail!". I shut up! But others didn't.

    People tried to tell him what they saw and that the other guy instigated the fight. He said: "The next person that opens their mouth is going to jail!". The guy's friend said: But, officer my friend didn't...

    That is far as he got as the cop threw him on the floor, handcuffed him
    and took him to jail. The charge: "Disorderly conduct."

    Now I could understand this if the officer said that he would take witness's statements later, but he didn't care. I've seen people arrested on the "disorderly conduct" charge for the most innocent things.

    I know LEO's have a tough job and they need to take control of a situation, but I'm referring to one's who abuse their power. They may be a small number, but they give many a very negative viewpoint of LE.

  14. #14

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Posts
    1,128

    Post imported post

    + 1

  15. #15
    Regular Member Deanimator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Rocky River, OH, U.S.A.
    Posts
    2,086

    Post imported post

    open4years wrote:
    I know LEO's have a tough job and they need to take control of a situation, but I'm referring to one's who abuse their power. They may be a small number, but they give many a very negative viewpoint of LE.
    You're not allowed to have a "negative viewpoint" of LE, no matter what. If you do, you're a "cop hater" and wanted to be a cop but couldn't... at least that's what the cops say.
    --- Gun control: The theory that 110lb. women have the "right" to fistfight with 210lb. rapists.

  16. #16
    Regular Member Deanimator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Rocky River, OH, U.S.A.
    Posts
    2,086

    Post imported post

    What are cops so fond of saying to citizens?

    "If you have nothing to hide...?"

    Their opposition to filming/recording has absolutely NO motivation aside from preventing valid complaints and lawsuits from being sustained.
    --- Gun control: The theory that 110lb. women have the "right" to fistfight with 210lb. rapists.

  17. #17
    Regular Member Thundar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Newport News, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    4,961

    Post imported post

    Deanimator wrote:
    open4years wrote:
    I know LEO's have a tough job and they need to take control of a situation, but I'm referring to one's who abuse their power. They may be a small number, but they give many a very negative viewpoint of LE.
    You're not allowed to have a "negative viewpoint" of LE, no matter what. If you do, you're a "cop hater" and wanted to be a cop but couldn't... at least that's what the cops say.
    I am not a cop hater, but I am a tyranny hater. When a cop acts in a tyrannical manner, then yes I do hate his/her actions.

    If a group of cops act with a pattern of opressive and tyrannical behavior which consistantly abuses our rights, well that is why we have a 2nd A, right?
    He wore his gun outside his pants for all the honest world to see. Pancho & Lefty

    The millions of people, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us....There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! ...The war is inevitable–and let it come! I repeat it, Sir, let it come …………. PATRICK HENRY speech 1776

  18. #18
    Regular Member Deanimator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Rocky River, OH, U.S.A.
    Posts
    2,086

    Post imported post

    Thundar wrote:
    Deanimator wrote:
    open4years wrote:
    I know LEO's have a tough job and they need to take control of a situation, but I'm referring to one's who abuse their power. They may be a small number, but they give many a very negative viewpoint of LE.
    You're not allowed to have a "negative viewpoint" of LE, no matter what. If you do, you're a "cop hater" and wanted to be a cop but couldn't... at least that's what the cops say.
    I am not a cop hater, but I am a tyranny hater. When a cop acts in a tyrannical manner, then yes I do hate his/her actions.

    If a group of cops act with a pattern of opressive and tyrannical behavior which consistantly abuses our rights, well that is why we have a 2nd A, right?
    You just don't understand:

    1. The police are never wrong.
    2. See rule 1 above.

    If you don't accept that as unassailable truth, a cop obviously stole your girlfriend... just ask a cop.
    --- Gun control: The theory that 110lb. women have the "right" to fistfight with 210lb. rapists.

  19. #19
    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Grennsboro NC
    Posts
    5,358

    Post imported post

    Thundar wrote:
    If a group of cops act with a pattern of opressive and tyrannical behavior which consistantly abuses our rights, well that is why we have a 2nd A, right?
    Well, much like there is no right to a "free press" (making documentary videotapes of a newsworthy event) in MD, it is ALSO the official published position of the MD Attorney General and the MSP that the Second Amendment of the US Constitution DOES NOT APPLY in the state of Maryland.

    There is no individual RKBA in the MD State Constitution. Owning and carrying firearms in MD is viewed as a privilege by the State government and the LE community.

    MD is not so much a "State" as it is an Oligarchical Serfdom...

    I should be receiving a video recording of a MSP officer stating this in official testimony before the MD General Assembly's Judiciary Committee during the hearing for HB-52 earlier this year. (Yes, this particular recording is legal--it was made by the MD-GA, and was obtained through a FOIA request...)

    I was there, testifying on the "pro" side, and heard and saw it with my own eyes and ears. I was tempted to make a citizen's arrest, based on the fact that it was an act of treason, being a direct violation of his Oath...

    It will be up on YouTube within days after the DVD hits my mailbox, which should be in the next few weeks...
    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

  20. #20
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Valdosta, Georgia, USA
    Posts
    347

    Post imported post

    Deanimator wrote:
    open4years wrote:
    I know LEO's have a tough job and they need to take control of a situation, but I'm referring to one's who abuse their power. They may be a small number, but they give many a very negative viewpoint of LE.
    You're not allowed to have a "negative viewpoint" of LE, no matter what.Â* If you do, you're a "cop hater" and wanted to be a cop but couldn't... at least that's what the cops say.
    Yes, and based on one post of mine about cops caught in a lie, regarding killing a girl - it was locked rather fast. I was just reporting what was in my paper, on AP, CNN, etc.

  21. #21
    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Grennsboro NC
    Posts
    5,358

    Post imported post

    “Without censorship, things can get terribly confused in the public mind.”
    --Gen William C. Westmoreland



    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •