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Thread: Help me understand

  1. #1
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    Before reading further, please understand that I am in NO way, shape or form against guns or questioning why anyone has one. I myself have a firearm and my permit to carry and have carried once or twice, but the concept of carrying is still pretty new to me. My boyfriend carries EVERYWHERE, ALL THE TIME and when he carries it tends to be openly. When I ask him to explain to me a) why he carries ALL the time and b) why he open carries, he just gets diffensive and feels like I'm saying he shouldn't. I have NO problem with him carrying, I knew when I started seeing him that he was this way so I knew what I was getting into. My only goal here is to have a better understanding, which I am not getting from talking to him. The times that I have carried have been openly and I was overall okay, but kinda uncomfortable. I guess I feel like with open carry, more people are going to stare and it will make people uncomfortable. My boyfriend has actually had to deal with police on multiple accounts because of his open carrying. Maybe I am just afraid it'll get him in trouble one day...

    I have a pretty specific reason that I got my permit to carry. I had a firearm for home defence and wanted to gain some more shooting experience and knowledge. I have also read most of the gun laws for my state. I was in an abusive relationship in the past and my abuser still comes around to cause problems. He is a scary, dangerous person which is specifically why I decided to get my permit. I have a hard time understanding why someone who doesn't have a specific threat would need to carry which is why I am posting this, because I WANT to understand. When I ask my boyfriend why he carries he just says "for self defense" which almost makes me feel like he is nervous or afriad that everywhere he goes he will be a victim. I do believe that everyone should be able to defend themselves wherever they are so I guess overall I get why people carry...Please don't post anything defensively, I am honestly not trying to say that people shouldn't carry, again I am for it overall.

    I love my boyfriend and would really like to have a better understanding of where he is coming from and why he chooses this life style. I think I am the first girlfriend he has had that has been ok with it and I want to keep impressing him with how supportive and understanding I am. I think I would be more comfortable with the whole idea of carrying if I could just understand it better. So, please, help me answer these two questions:

    1) Why carry a firearm at all times?

    2) Why open carry?

    Thank you all so much =)

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    Have you ever had a home fire?

    If you say no, do you still have a fire extinguisher? Or a smoke alarm? Or both?

    You won't know that you will ever need a gun, until you need it.

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    Why carry all the time?

    No matter how safe an area seems to be, or has been in the past, it only takes seconds for none of that to matter. Personally, if something happened to my wife, another person I care about, or even a stranger when I could have intervened and stopped it if I was carrying, I wouldn't be able to live with myself. We all avoid 'dangerous' areas, but sometimes the danger comes to us.

    Why carry openly?

    Personal preference. Many of us are of the belief that the best way to stay safe is to advertise to the anonymous predators out there that we won't be an easy mark. They see a firearm, and they go the other way. They fade back into the shadows. If, God forbid, we ever need it, there's less in the way to cause us to fumble when drawing it, be the cause clothing, fanny-pack, or digging it out of a purse or briefcase.



    I hope I helped you gain at least a little insight without coming off sounding defensive. just curious, how were you phrasing your question to your boyfriend? If he's run into people hostile to carrying, he might just have an automatic barrier to certain phrasing.

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    hightecrebel wrote:
    I hope I helped you gain at least a little insight without coming off sounding defensive. just curious, how were you phrasing your question to your boyfriend? If he's run into people hostile to carrying, he might just have an automatic barrier to certain phrasing.
    I have asked on several occasions "why do you feel the need to carry everywhere, all the time?" And I don't feel like I've ever used a rude tone, it's always been in trying to "get it" and he usually starts off trying to explain but gets kinda upset. And yes, he has had people approach him in a rude way multiple times. So, it's kinda like why I wear a seatbelt?! I don't think I am going to get in an accident everytime I drive, but it's a precaution. Obviously guns and seatbelts are waaaay different, but same kinda idea behind it?! Thanks so much! I really appriciate the input!

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    After reading your post in the "band all guns" thread, it seems to me like you already understand for the most part. Those people at VT would have had a much better chance of survival if they were armed. Or better yet, if people went in and out of that school on a regular basis while open carrying, maybe the criminals would have thought twice before going in.

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    Mr.FiredUp wrote:
    After reading your post in the "band all guns" thread, it seems to me like you already understand for the most part. Those people at VT would have had a much better chance of survival if they were armed. Or better yet, if people went in and out of that school on a regular basis while open carrying, maybe the criminals would have thought twice before going in.
    I understand carrying for the most part, I guess I just feel like maybe ALL THE TIME is a little much. And I realize that we have to protect ourselves. I'm torn because I can see so many sides of it and just when I think that I get it, I get confused. I know I may come off as inconsistent and I don't mean to. I just don't know why all the time, and why openly. Idk...I have definate opinions and I support carrying, like I said, I just want a better understanding of the reasons...

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    Well, I would say the most basic reasoning for carrying all the time is you can never predict when a VT style incident will happen. As far as openly carrying, I would say that it may deter a VT style incident from happening. There are many other reasons people choose to carry, both concealed and openly. There are many arguments for both, and for neither. It's a personal choice that one needs to make for themselves. That, in my opinion, is the only reason you need to come up with.

    I hope this has been some help. Good luck to you in your search for answers!

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    "I have a hard time understanding why someone who doesn't have a specific threat would need to carry which is why I am posting this, because I WANT to understand. When I ask my boyfriend why he carries he just says "for self defense" which almost makes me feel like he is nervous or afriad that everywhere he goes he will be a victim."

    Are you telling me this man never takes off his piece? Surely, wherever you are from, there are certain places you may not carry. I carry everywhere... all the time..

    but say I go to the ball game.. can't carry there.. And I Still Go. I'm sure your boyfriend is the same way. Piece or not.. it's the same guy.. but why not carry it if you can?


    Why do you carry a cell phone everywhere all the time? Nervous? Not sure when an emergency will happen right? That's why you carry a cell phone all the time everywhere.. because you can Dial 911 in an emergency. Paramedics are on the way.

    Same reason why people carry everywhere.. a firearm or a cell phone.. pocket knife or tooth floss.. because you might need it.

  9. #9
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    First, men have a very different sense of responsibility in protecting the ones they love. That is a natural state of the world and there is no other way to state the feeling men have in protecting family. I have said that there are only two protection forces that will jump in front of someone and take a bullet. A parent of a child and the US Secret Service. No one else will. Therefore, your boyfriends innate sense of responsibility is to protect himself and his loved ones.

    What are Friday'swinning lottery numbers?

    ....

    ....

    ....

    I'll wait.............................................. ........

    What?

    You can't predict the future?

    When will the next crime happen? Where?

    ....

    ....

    ....

    I'll wait.............................................. .........

    What?

    You can't predict the future?

    Where would you recommend him not to carry? (Church, grocery store, etc....)

    Now go to the Google and google gun and church, or gun and __________.

    Crime happens everywhere and anytime. You must have your tool to defend yourself at all times.

    Why OPEN CARRY?

    Put your mind in that of a thief....you drive into the parking lot of the bank. You intend to go in and rob the bank. You sit in the car for 2 or 3 minutes and wait for a lull in the traffic around the area, you make sure there are no police cars around. You see a guy in a regular car drive up and walk across the parking lot. He has a holster and a gun on his belt. Not a police car, no police uniform.

    Do you go in the bank now? Or, do you wait for this person to leave? Or, do you drive away and pick a different bank?

    In my opinion 0% of the criminals would pick choice #1. 50% would choose choice #2 and the remaining 50% would choose choice #3.

    While the crime may not have been deterred, the crime and possibility for violence committed against the open carrier was deterred.

    If you were concealing you would be in the bank, the criminal would of come in and committed the crime. Perhaps the criminal was nervous and fired his gun. Perhaps he starts the crime and the silent alarm is used. The police come, a gun fight breaks out. You are hit by a stray bullet.

    I hope that helps explain why you must always carry and why open carry is preferred. Open carry is not for everyone, but those who do become comfortable with it should be commended for their choice. Open carry in a professional way, be courteous, be polite, be kind and others will trust and respect your choice.
    Live Free or Die!

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    Why would anyone feel the need to carry ALL THE TIME?

    Well, maybe what I told a lady one day will help you understand a bit better.

    I was waiting in line at a local convenience store with a side arm hanging in it's holster on my belt. A lady walked up behind me and jokingly asked if I was expecting trouble. I played dumb just to get her to by spcific as to why she asked. It WAS because of my OC pistol.

    I smiled and said, 'NAH, I never expect trouble." And then in a non-chelant manner I continued with, "But ya know, I doubt anyone at Ruby's Cafeteria, Columbine, VT, or Ft Hood were expecting any trouble the day all hell broke loose on them either."

    Her facial expression turned from of a jokester to seriousness and I could tell teh lightbulb of reality had suddenlt come on. She said, "Man.....I didn't think of it that way, but your right."

    The reality miss is that violant crime or threat of such can ocurr anywhere, anytime, to anyone, most of the time without any prior warning. I'm sure you've read or seen reports on TV of some horrible violant crime being committed in some sleepy little neighborhood somewhere and heard how shocked the residents of that neighborhood were that something that could happen where they lived. Sure their shocked. Things like that just don't happen there, right? But that's just it. They can happen in sleepy little neighborhoods. Criminal acts can and do ocurr to good people that mind their own business and stay away from places of ill repute.

    You said you were unconfortable open carrying. I think we've all gone through that at first. I was anxious about it for the first few weeks until I realized that the folks in my neck of the woods weren't concerned about it. The worst I've had to put up with is people asking what make and cal of sidearm I'm carrying, even from the local sheriff's deputies. I can live with that. LOL

    My suggeston to you when you find someone staring at you for OC is to put on a big smile and ask them, "How ya doin today?" Who knows, you might have a chance to strike up a conversation and educate someone with some of the info we are sharing with you on these forums.

    BTW, I didn't see in you post as to location/state you live in.

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    Task Force 16 wrote:
    Why would anyone feel the need to carry ALL THE TIME?

    Well, maybe what I told a lady one day will help you understand a bit better.

    I was waiting in line at a local convenience store with a side arm hanging in it's holster on my belt. A lady walked up behind me and jokingly asked if I was expecting trouble. I played dumb just to get her to by spcific as to why she asked. It WAS because of my OC pistol.

    I smiled and said, 'NAH, I never expect trouble." And then in a non-chelant manner I continued with, "But ya know, I doubt anyone at Ruby's Cafeteria, Columbine, VT, or Ft Hood were expecting any trouble the day all hell broke loose on them either."

    Her facial expression turned from of a jokester to seriousness and I could tell teh lightbulb of reality had suddenlt come on. She said, "Man.....I didn't think of it that way, but your right."

    The reality miss is that violant crime or threat of such can ocurr anywhere, anytime, to anyone, most of the time without any prior warning. I'm sure you've read or seen reports on TV of some horrible violant crime being committed in some sleepy little neighborhood somewhere and heard how shocked the residents of that neighborhood were that something that could happen where they lived. Sure their shocked. Things like that just don't happen there, right? But that's just it. They can happen in sleepy little neighborhoods. Criminal acts can and do ocurr to good people that mind their own business and stay away from places of ill repute.

    You said you were unconfortable open carrying. I think we've all gone through that at first. I was anxious about it for the first few weeks until I realized that the folks in my neck of the woods weren't concerned about it. The worst I've had to put up with is people asking what make and cal of sidearm I'm carrying, even from the local sheriff's deputies. I can live with that. LOL

    My suggeston to you when you find someone staring at you for OC is to put on a big smile and ask them, "How ya doin today?" Who knows, you might have a chance to strike up a conversation and educate someone with some of the info we are sharing with you on these forums.

    BTW, I didn't see in you post as to location/state you live in.
    +1

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    I live outside of one of the quietest little towns in America, most towns in Kansas are for the most part very peaceful. I have a CC permit, and on occasion I will OC, not often but I do.
    I've always looked at the carrying of a weapon like this. The world has turned into a very evil place, even more since the economy has gotten worse. People get desperate when they can't feed their families. Some will always do the right thing and some won't.
    When I first moved here, who would've thought that the accomplice of the OK City bomber would be living here, but he was.
    I just always think that, ya just never know when the boogie man will come around the corner, and say "Gotcha" And I hate surprises.
    Besides, as often stated here, a right not excersized is a right lost.
    Laws that forbid the carrying of arms... disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man. Thomas Jefferson

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    TTcrunchberry wrhttp://opencarry.mywowbb.com/reply.php?topic_id=44767&post_id=772880&qu ote=1ote:
    hightecrebel wrote:
    I hope I helped you gain at least a little insight without coming off sounding defensive. just curious, how were you phrasing your question to your boyfriend? If he's run into people hostile to carrying, he might just have an automatic barrier to certain phrasing.
    I have asked on several occasions "why do you feel the need to carry everywhere, all the time?" And I don't feel like I've ever used a rude tone, it's always been in trying to "get it" and he usually starts off trying to explain but gets kinda upset. And yes, he has had people approach him in a rude way multiple times. So, it's kinda like why I wear a seatbelt?! I don't think I am going to get in an accident everytime I drive, but it's a precaution. Obviously guns and seatbelts are waaaay different, but same kinda idea behind it?! Thanks so much! I really appriciate the input!
    "why do you feel the need to carry everywhere, all the time?" is the type of phrasing that puts me on the defensive. Even when asked in a passive voice, the phrasing comes off as aggressive, making me out to be a paranoid nutcase.

    And as far as guns and seatbelts, yeah, same idea. While one can lead to injury and death for children even when used correctly, the other often comes with mechanical safeties and provides an active deterrent to third-parties that may wish you or your loved ones harm. While you never expect the worst to happen, it can with little notice.

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    vegasche1023 wrote:
    Task Force 16 wrote:

    BTW, I didn't see in you post as to location/state you live in.
    Minnesota

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    First, you should be complimented on a well constructed and well written post. Very lucid and very succinct.

    You have received most all of the answers just about anyone can think of and offer as reason for carrying where ever they go, where legal, and carrying openly. I cannot add much to any of this.. accept maybe one little incident that happened over a year ago about 25+ miles from where I live (hope I get this right).

    In a quiet and peaceful newer development outside of Leesburg, VA early on a Sunday morning, a man and his wife were out for a run. Suddenly and for no apparent reason, they were attacked by several men who had been riding around in the neighborhood. They were both severely beaten and the man died from his wounds. He had a CHP (Concealed Handgun Permit), but chose not to carry on that morning... no doubt most mornings when taking a run. He paid for his oversight with his life and nearly the life of his wife.

    Bad things do happen to good people and we can sight incidents from here to when to prove this. I have to believe that the thought of "why didn't I bring my gun" must have crossed this man's mind as he was being killed. For me, I never want to have to think this.

    As for open carry, I do this because my knees no longer afford me the ability to fight or run as I was once capable of doing. So my little friend speaks silently for me, telling those who may be of a mind to do me harm, to leave me alone.

    I also read your post on the other thread and it's clear you understand things... that and the fact that you chose to arm yourself and get a permit because of your past problems with someone. These are positive moves from someone who clearly knows how to think and plan. Hopefully the responses you have received here have given you food for thought. If you are in need of more, the nightly news is a great place to start.

    In the final seconds of your life, just before your killer is about to dispatch you to that great eternal darkness, what would you rather have in your hand? A cell phone or a gun?

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    cscitney87 wrote:
    Are you telling me this man never takes off his piece? Surely, wherever you are from, there are certain places you may not carry. I carry everywhere... all the time..

    but say I go to the ball game.. can't carry there.. And I Still Go. I'm sure your boyfriend is the same way. Piece or not.. it's the same guy.. but why not carry it if you can?

    There is only 1 place that he doesn't carry and that's only because he can't conceal deeply enough to be comfortable. He carries everywhere else (even when he "shouldn't") he just conceals...

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    hightecrebel wrote:
    TTcrunchberry wrhightecrebel wrote:
    "why do you feel the need to carry everywhere, all the time?" is the type of phrasing that puts me on the defensive. Even when asked in a passive voice, the phrasing comes off as aggressive, making me out to be a paranoid nutcase.

    [/quote]
    How would you suggest I ask in a better way that won't provoke his defences??

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    TTcrunchberry wrote: How would you suggest I ask in a better way that won't provoke his defences??


    I don't know.I don't know him or the type(s) of questions that would provoke his defenses. For me, the way a female friend of mine got me to answer without being defensive is by asking if I thought she should do the same, and then asking or my reasoning as well.

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    TTcrunchberry wrote:
    hightecrebel wrote:
    TTcrunchberry wrhightecrebel wrote:
    "why do you feel the need to carry everywhere, all the time?" is the type of phrasing that puts me on the defensive. Even when asked in a passive voice, the phrasing comes off as aggressive, making me out to be a paranoid nutcase.
    How would you suggest I ask in a better way that won't provoke his defences??[/quote]




    It would help us out some if we knew where you are located (City/ State is enough). Political demographics vary from one state/city to another. If yu live in a area where there are allot of anti-gun people, I'm not surprised that your BF becomes defensive when queried about OC. Anti gun people can often be aggressive and obnxious. If this is the reason for your BF defensiveness that's a shame. He needs to rethink his tactics for dealing with these people.

    We never want to let the anti's put us on the defensive. We should always be polite and curteous no matter how big of an ass the anti becomes. If such an encounter occurs in a public place (anti's love to try to publicly belittle OC'ers)our best way to counter them is with a big smile and politeness. Pose questions to them that you know they can't answer without making them selves look like the idiot. YOu won't sway the hard core anti, but if there are bystanders that may be on the fence about the issue, those are the ones you'll impress. These forums are chock full of resources that will help you in dealing with the anti's

    We also have to remember that not all people that approach us with questions are anti gun. Some will just be curious, like the lady I spoke about in my earlier post.

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    TTcrunchberry wrote:
    I was in an abusive relationship in the past and my abuser still comes around to cause problems. He is a scary, dangerous person which is specifically why I decided to get my permit. I have a hard time understanding why someone who doesn't have a specific threat would need to carry which is why I am posting this, because I WANT to understand.
    So... you're saying that because your boyfriend hasn't (yet) been personally threatened by this "scary, dangerous person", he shouldn't have any interest or regard for YOUR safety while you two are together?

    Explain, please.

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    First, I live somewhere near Anoka, Minnesota. Second, thanks for everyone that has been willing to explain and answer my questions, I really do appriciate it and it does make a lot more sense. For some reason it makes it easier to understand when ya hear it from multiple people. The very last comment before this post asks why my boyfriend shouldn't be able to protect himself from my crazy x while we are together and I want to make it clear than I in NO WAY said that he shouldn't or can't and I want him to be able to defend himself. As I said before I just didn't understand why parting with a firearm for a day or an hour in specific places would cause someone to be so uncomfortable. And I do realize that crazy people can show up at any point in time. I was no trying to anger anyone at alland I hope you all know that I support you all very much. I've always been for and supported home defense and this carry thing is just new to me so I am only trying to collect information and understanding.

    I do understand a lot of things better now because of all you answering my questions, so thank you!! Someone said in an earlier post that where we live may be particularly hostile when it comes to open carriers and I think that's slightly true where we live. He has had several people approach him and been thrown around by cops who don't know the law. Carry is pretty uncommon here and openly carrying is even more uncommon. Besides my boyfriend I havn't seen a single person carrying in any of the places that I've been in my entire life (besides police officers).

    So again, thanks for all the advice/explainations. Lots of you had great things to say and most of you seem to be great at educating the curious =) Much appriciation!!

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    TTcrunchberry wrote:
    As I said before I just didn't understand why parting with a firearm for a day or an hour in specific places would cause someone to be so uncomfortable. And I do realize that crazy people can show up at any point in time.
    The second underlined part is the answer to the first.

    That, and the fact that people who are out to harm you may be able to wait until you are in a place or situation where they know or believe they can cause you pain without anyone being able to stop them. Evil is not the same as stupid.

    I hope that is understandable.

    (Oh, and by the way, unless you stop each person you pass and ask if they are carrying a gun, you really don't know how common that is. Concealed means people can't see it.
    I'd wager there are FAR more armed people around you than you imagine.)

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    TTcrunchberry wrote:
    How would you suggest I ask in a better way that won't provoke his defences??
    Don't ask anymore! You already have his answer. Why are you still pushing that button?

    Be supportive, complimentary and positive. Take the pressure off.

    We encourage obeying all laws at all times. I do NOT go where I cannot legally carry if at all within my control.

    It is not paranoia, but quietly, responsibly being prepared for the 1 time in a million.

    Yata hey


    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Grapeshot wrote:
    TTcrunchberry wrote:
    How would you suggest I ask in a better way that won't provoke his defences??
    Don't ask anymore!* You already have his answer.* Why are you still pushing that button?
    *
    Be supportive, complimentary and positive.* Take the pressure off.

    We encourage obeying all laws at all times.* I do NOT go where I cannot legally carry if at all within my control.

    It is not paranoia, but quietly, responsibly being prepared for the 1 time in a million.

    ******** Yata hey

    *
    +1

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    TTcrunchberry wrote:
    First, I live somewhere near Anoka, Minnesota. Second, thanks for everyone that has been willing to explain and answer my questions, I really do appriciate it and it does make a lot more sense. For some reason it makes it easier to understand when ya hear it from multiple people. The very last comment before this post asks why my boyfriend shouldn't be able to protect himself from my crazy x while we are together and I want to make it clear than I in NO WAY said that he shouldn't or can't and I want him to be able to defend himself. As I said before I just didn't understand why parting with a firearm for a day or an hour in specific places would cause someone to be so uncomfortable. And I do realize that crazy people can show up at any point in time. I was no trying to anger anyone at alland I hope you all know that I support you all very much. I've always been for and supported home defense and this carry thing is just new to me so I am only trying to collect information and understanding.

    I do understand a lot of things better now because of all you answering my questions, so thank you!! Someone said in an earlier post that where we live may be particularly hostile when it comes to open carriers and I think that's slightly true where we live. He has had several people approach him and been thrown around by cops who don't know the law. Carry is pretty uncommon here and openly carrying is even more uncommon. Besides my boyfriend I havn't seen a single person carrying in any of the places that I've been in my entire life (besides police officers).

    So again, thanks for all the advice/explainations. Lots of you had great things to say and most of you seem to be great at educating the curious =) Much appriciation!!

    Perhaps watching this video will help you understand why some of us are not comfortable being without our side arm.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1u0Byq5Qis

    As has been mentioned, just because you don't see people carrying it doesn't mean that they don't. Concealed carry (CC) is what it is, concealed, out of sight.

    Instead of asking your BF why he carries everyday, if you are considering carrying more than you do now, perhaps you could bring it up that you are. Then list off some of "your" reasons (some that we've supplied you here) and ask him what he thinks. If he agrees that your reasons are good ones, you'll know at least in part why he carries everyday.

    There's more than one way to skin a cat. LOL


    BTW, Welcome to OCDO. Hope you stick around. Your BF is welcome to come join us too.

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