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Thread: Michigan State Police tripling Flint patrols in response to violent crime

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    Regular Member kyleplusitunes's Avatar
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    http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/inde..._increasi.html


    FLINT, Michigan — The governor has authorized the Michigan State Police to triple its presence in Flint after the city has seen five homicides in six days, including a fatal shooting this morning.

    Mayor Dayne Walling made the call for help yesterday to Gov. Jennifer Granholm's office, and she responded:

    "Public safety is our top priority, and we stand ready to assist our local partners to ensure that citizens are protected and remain safe," Granholm said in a statement released at a City Hall news conference this morning.

    Lt. Rick Arnold, commander of the Flint state police post, said the agency is tripling its Flint patrols during peak crime hours and in high crime areas. Instead of one squad of 5-7 troopers, the city will have three squads available, he said.

    The additional patrols were effective yesterday evening, he said.

    City officials said Granholm dismissed a recent call from two former state representatives for a National Guard presence in Flint. The governor confirmed calling in the National Guard "is not warranted or appropriate in this instance," they said.

    State troopers will mostly be patrolling, but could assist in responding to high priority emergencies if necessary, he said.

    The times and areas of the patrols have yet to be worked out with the Flint police department, he said.

    "We will explore bringing in (troopers) from other areas," Arnold said. "We have to ensure our patrols will be used in the most effective manner possible."

    Flint police Chief Alvern Lock said the city will also maintain the additional Flint police patrols Walling authorized Tuesday evening.

    The news of the additional state police patrols came on the heels of a fatal shooting this morning at Eastmount and Jewell drives on the northeast side of the city.

    A man died after being shot multiple times in the head, police said, about 12 hours after the increased state police patrols went into effect.

    "Additional officers and additional patrols don't mean crime is going to stop," Walling said. "We'll never know how many crimes were prevented last night."

    Walling again called on the city's public safety unions to give double-digit contract concessions, saying union leaders need to "wake up from fantasy land."

    "I don't believe this is a time for politics," he said. "The way you save jobs is you share the sacrifice."

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    This is a crock. MSP presence is not going to do a single thing. Oh, it may hinder things a little, very little. But when Flint had a full PD force, crime was STILL off the charts. With a full force Flint ranked in the top 5 most dangerous cities to live in the United States for 3 years straight.

    http://www.buzzle.com/articles/ameri...us-cities.html

    http://crimeinamerica.net/2010/03/01...erable-cities/

    The MSP is just going to plug the holes that the laid off Flint PD officers left. Oh yeah...it's only supposed to last 2 weeks, then it's going to revert right back to a HLZ after they leave.

    Captn---

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    did anybody catch the fact that they are tripling their presence by simply adding two additional cars?
    Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? (who will watch the watchmen?)

    I am not a lawyer. Nothing in any of posts should be construed as legal advice.

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    Isn't that hilarious! Two cars...whew...that makes me feel sooo much safer.

    The city cannot afford to open the city jail and the county is already overcrowded so they have been releasing criminals. So someone downtown here has to explain something to me...what the he** are they (MSP or FPD) supposed to do with people they arrest?? That's why I feel the MSP presence is BS...it's a tactic the mayors office is using to make the citizens feel all cozy and safer and also get us to believe that they actually have this under control.

    Captn---

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    Short of installing a police state, you aren't going to change crime levels by increasing or decreasing patrolling. I'd have expected Jenny to know that. Probably just a PR stunt.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas_City_experiment
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    I fully agree Michigander.

    Also I heard that they are only increasing patrols in high crime areas, ie: the North end of town.
    Ok, but what will that do? Simple. It will push the criminals to other areas.
    Prime example of that is what they tried to do a few years ago with prostitutes hanging around on Dort Hwy. The PD increased patrols, made more stops and the hookers just moved somewhere else. Then once the PD presence eased off, they came right back.
    It's just a case of location, location, location. When the heat gets turned up in one, move on until it goes away.

    I think you're right, it definitely smells like a PR stunt.

    Captn---

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    Regular Member kryptonian's Avatar
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    drug and alcohol rehab in memphis, michigan. 90% of people there are for heroin. 90% of those people are from flint. when asked how many overdosed 90% raised their hands. when asked how many flatlined (clinically dead) requiring reviving 90% raised their hands. when asked how many went right back to doing heroin 90% raised their hands. your danger isn't from people on heroin it is from people without heroin who are in withdrawl. they will do anything - say anything - take anything to get money for it. they aren't in their right minds and don't look like people you would imagine heroin addicts look like. they are predominately white and young. their brains in withdrawl are geared towards one thing - getting money or something they can sell for money from you. don't ever believe drugs are a victimless crime. i lost a friend to overdose 2 days out of rehab. pretty, young (23), smart, funny. couldn't get heroin but got morphine. went to sleep and died. my phone number was in her pocket.
    you'll never see them on heroin. they are stationary, docile, happy. when they need it they will do whatever it takes including violence. i heard many of their stories. when i asked them what was the best advice you could give to deal with them - they all said DON'T GO TO FLINT. i take that advice. this is what OC is designed for in my opinion.

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    kryptonian wrote:
    drug and alcohol rehab in memphis, michigan. 90% of people there are for heroin. 90% of those people are from flint. when asked how many overdosed 90% raised their hands. when asked how many flatlined (clinically dead) requiring reviving 90% raised their hands. when asked how many went right back to doing heroin 90% raised their hands. your danger isn't from people on heroin it is from people without heroin who are in withdrawl. they will do anything - say anything - take anything to get money for it. they aren't in their right minds and don't look like people you would imagine heroin addicts look like. they are predominately white and young. their brains in withdrawl are geared towards one thing - getting money or something they can sell for money from you. don't ever believe drugs are a victimless crime. i lost a friend to overdose 2 days out of rehab. pretty, young (23), smart, funny. couldn't get heroin but got morphine. went to sleep and died. my phone number was in her pocket.
    you'll never see them on heroin. they are stationary, docile, happy. when they need it they will do whatever it takes including violence. i heard many of their stories. when i asked them what was the best advice you could give to deal with them - they all said DON'T GO TO FLINT. i take that advice. this is what OC is designed for in my opinion.
    I would REALLY love to see where you got those statistics from? Because I can pretty much assure you that you're wrong.

    I have lived or been in Flint the majority of my adult life, and not in the cozy parts of it either. I'd like to start off by saying, have you ever been inside the county jail? The majority of people in it are defiantly NOT white kids on heroin. This is not the 1960's, and Flint is not the UK.

    Yes, Heroin is around, I am fully aware, however, not at epidemic proportions you are describing. I know a few people who engage in heroin here and there, also, so I like to think I am not blind to what is going on.

    Also, advice given to someone from a Heroin junkie in rehab for committing violent crimes while trying to score some more, is what I'd HARDLY call a credible person to advise me on my travel plans. Flint might be a mad place for a heroin junkie trying to make another score, so of course they'd say to stay out of there, hell, rob people in Memphis.

    Sure, Flint has a high crime rate, does that mean there is anyplace in the city I wouldn't go while unarmed? Sure, maybe one or two places but hardly anyplace that deems someone saying "STAY OUT OF FLINT."

    ...

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    kyleplusitunes - not young. i'm 47 going on 17. my statistics come from the rehab itself. my opinion of flint comes from that and the few times i went there. didn't matter where i went i was approached by people begging for money or pretending it to get close enough to rob. i pulled my 9mm once to a white guy on a bike in a gas station parking lot demanding money with his hand in his pocket. when it's own citizens tell you not to go there - i listen.

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    Regular Member kyleplusitunes's Avatar
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    well you guys from outside flint, keep telling ghost stories about it.

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    kryptonian wrote:
    drug and alcohol rehab in memphis, michigan. 90% of people there are for heroin. 90% of those people are from flint. when asked how many overdosed 90% raised their hands. when asked how many flatlined (clinically dead) requiring reviving 90% raised their hands. when asked how many went right back to doing heroin 90% raised their hands. your danger isn't from people on heroin it is from people without heroin who are in withdrawl. they will do anything - say anything - take anything to get money for it. they aren't in their right minds and don't look like people you would imagine heroin addicts look like. they are predominately white and young. their brains in withdrawl are geared towards one thing - getting money or something they can sell for money from you. don't ever believe drugs are a victimless crime. i lost a friend to overdose 2 days out of rehab. pretty, young (23), smart, funny. couldn't get heroin but got morphine. went to sleep and died. my phone number was in her pocket.
    you'll never see them on heroin. they are stationary, docile, happy. when they need it they will do whatever it takes including violence. i heard many of their stories. when i asked them what was the best advice you could give to deal with them - they all said DON'T GO TO FLINT. i take that advice. this is what OC is designed for in my opinion.
    Please provide CITES for your statements above from this specific treatment center.
    Rights are like muscles. You must EXERCISE THEM to keep them from becoming atrophied.

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    kryptonian wrote:
    drug and alcohol rehab in memphis, michigan. 90% of people there are for heroin. 90% of those people are from flint. when asked how many overdosed 90% raised their hands. when asked how many flatlined (clinically dead) requiring reviving 90% raised their hands. when asked how many went right back to doing heroin 90% raised their hands. your danger isn't from people on heroin it is from people without heroin who are in withdrawl. they will do anything - say anything - take anything to get money for it. they aren't in their right minds and don't look like people you would imagine heroin addicts look like. they are predominately white and young. their brains in withdrawl are geared towards one thing - getting money or something they can sell for money from you. don't ever believe drugs are a victimless crime. i lost a friend to overdose 2 days out of rehab. pretty, young (23), smart, funny. couldn't get heroin but got morphine. went to sleep and died. my phone number was in her pocket.
    you'll never see them on heroin. they are stationary, docile, happy. when they need it they will do whatever it takes including violence. i heard many of their stories. when i asked them what was the best advice you could give to deal with them - they all said DON'T GO TO FLINT. i take that advice. this is what OC is designed for in my opinion.
    Being a lifelong resident of Flint and having relatives and friends that have addiction problems I can only agree to an extent. The part about the users of heroin being predominantly white and young and the part about drugs not being a victimless crime, true. The rest...well...not so much.

    Drug rehab centers have specialized areas of addictions in which they treat patients. Only on rare occasions will a patient addicted to cocaine be sent to a facility that specializes in opiates. While they can treat patients with various addictions, patients are sent to facilities where the detoxification of their drug of choice is specialized. Since you mentioned a facility in Memphis MI, I checked on one, Sacred Heart Rehabilitation Center. They specialize in opiate detoxification. Heroin just happens to be an opioid drug so it would be a relatively safe assumption that 90% of the addicts at Sacred Heart are addicted to heroin. And since Memphis is just 55 miles away from Flint, another assumption might be that 90% of the 90% could very well be from Flint.

    People with ANY addiction can and usually do resort to any means necessary to get another fix....robbing, stealing, pan handling or all out violence. Heroin, crack, alcohol, meth, extacy, marijuana...it makes little, if any difference.

    It is not the specific drug that warrants one type of response over another, it is the person. People have been beaten and killed over marijuana. People have begged for spare change for crack. People have broken into liquor stores for a drink. The chemical imbalance in their brains and the way they handle (or not) the driving force to get that next fix determines their course of action.

    This happens anywhere there is a drug problem, not just Flint. Seattle, Dallas, LA, New Orleans, Boston...you will see addicts doing what they can to get what they need. Saying don't go to Flint because the heroin addicts are violent is unrealistic. Are heroin addicts more 'friendly' in some other city?

    By no means am I defending Flint. I can't stand it here. As a matter of fact my family and I are moving in less than 2 months to get away from the BS here. It is not just the drug addicts that are dangerous, it is practically anyone that wants what someone else has. And for anyone to try to get anything from me or my family, they will have to discuss it with my Glock 22 and her 16 friends.

    Captn---


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    captnkirk wrote:
    kryptonian wrote:
    drug and alcohol rehab in memphis, michigan. 90% of people there are for heroin. 90% of those people are from flint. when asked how many overdosed 90% raised their hands. when asked how many flatlined (clinically dead) requiring reviving 90% raised their hands. when asked how many went right back to doing heroin 90% raised their hands. your danger isn't from people on heroin it is from people without heroin who are in withdrawl. they will do anything - say anything - take anything to get money for it. they aren't in their right minds and don't look like people you would imagine heroin addicts look like. they are predominately white and young. their brains in withdrawl are geared towards one thing - getting money or something they can sell for money from you. don't ever believe drugs are a victimless crime. i lost a friend to overdose 2 days out of rehab. pretty, young (23), smart, funny. couldn't get heroin but got morphine. went to sleep and died. my phone number was in her pocket.
    you'll never see them on heroin. they are stationary, docile, happy. when they need it they will do whatever it takes including violence. i heard many of their stories. when i asked them what was the best advice you could give to deal with them - they all said DON'T GO TO FLINT. i take that advice. this is what OC is designed for in my opinion.
    Being a lifelong resident of Flint and having relatives and friends that have addiction problems I can only agree to an extent. The part about the users of heroin being predominantly white and young and the part about drugs not being a victimless crime, true. The rest...well...not so much.

    Drug rehab centers have specialized areas of addictions in which they treat patients. Only on rare occasions will a patient addicted to cocaine be sent to a facility that specializes in opiates. While they can treat patients with various addictions, patients are sent to facilities where the detoxification of their drug of choice is specialized. Since you mentioned a facility in Memphis MI, I checked on one, Sacred Heart Rehabilitation Center. They specialize in opiate detoxification. Heroin just happens to be an opioid drug so it would be a relatively safe assumption that 90% of the addicts at Sacred Heart are addicted to heroin. And since Memphis is just 55 miles away from Flint, another assumption might be that 90% of the 90% could very well be from Flint.

    People with ANY addiction can and usually do resort to any means necessary to get another fix....robbing, stealing, pan handling or all out violence. Heroin, crack, alcohol, meth, extacy, marijuana...it makes little, if any difference.

    It is not the specific drug that warrants one type of response over another, it is the person. People have been beaten and killed over marijuana. People have begged for spare change for crack. People have broken into liquor stores for a drink. The chemical imbalance in their brains and the way they handle (or not) the driving force to get that next fix determines their course of action.

    This happens anywhere there is a drug problem, not just Flint. Seattle, Dallas, LA, New Orleans, Boston...you will see addicts doing what they can to get what they need. Saying don't go to Flint because the heroin addicts are violent is unrealistic. Are heroin addicts more 'friendly' in some other city?

    By no means am I defending Flint. I can't stand it here. As a matter of fact my family and I are moving in less than 2 months to get away from the BS here. It is not just the drug addicts that are dangerous, it is practically anyone that wants what someone else has. And for anyone to try to get anything from me or my family, they will have to discuss it with my Glock 22 and her 16 friends.

    Captn---
    Well said Captn.

    Sacred Heart in Memphis, MI not only specializes in Opiate Detox prior to true rehab beginning, they serve as a facility that takes in "county referred" cases (read: low/no income and/or jobless/homeless). These are generally "low-bottom" cases and ends up being one of the last "stops" before jail or death. The statistics are probably not that far off, just could not find these stated anywhere. Colombiere Center (Insight) in Clarkston and the now defunct Holly Gardens were others that served Flint residents but were not "overflowing" with Heroin Addicts AFAIK.

    Here in Royal Oak, the ROPD/ROFD responded to 500+ Heroin Overdoses in 2006 (or 2005) in which many started with Heroin instead of other drugs. It is a problem all over, although each area can have specific issues ("tweakers" in Arizona is commonplace, not so much here in MI). There were less "drug-crimes" (read: stealing) reported here since the kids/young adults probably got the money from family sources (who are far less likely to press charges).
    Rights are like muscles. You must EXERCISE THEM to keep them from becoming atrophied.

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    all good points guys. yes it was sacred heart. unfortunately or fortunately i was a "resident" there last year and was not sent there by any court agency but by my own need. not proud of it but i did what you are supposed to do when you have a dangerous addiction. it wasn't opiates but just plain old alcohol. had a seizure first day and woke up in an ambulance going to port huron hospital. not my best time in life but sober today 9 months later and life is good. not seeking praise. if i were robbong banks and announced i quit that i wouldn't expect people to congratulate me for stopping something i wasn't supposed to be doing anyway. had a beautiful pile of family and friends that stood by me and helped me. if that helps clarify my insight into these people then i hope it does.

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    Regular Member WARCHILD's Avatar
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    Congrats on your dry time. Hang in there, it's rough I know but well worth the trip.
    I too am a graduate of Columbiere...6 weeks...1971...Jack Daniels. On occasion I still have hard days now and then.

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    I heard something on the radio about them asking the National Guard for help over there. Then some other official sounding person was saying that this is just a rumor.

    Gotta wonder if that's what it'll take though.
    I always open carry one of my Kimber 1911 pistols everywhere I go. Usually in a paddle holster. Nothing fancy, but it works for me.

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    Regular Member WARCHILD's Avatar
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    Yes, Grandholm offered her assistance to send the NG to help.
    Mayor Walling declined, saying it had not reached that point.

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    kryptonian wrote:
    all good points guys. yes it was sacred heart. unfortunately or fortunately i was a "resident" there last year and was not sent there by any court agency but by my own need. not proud of it but i did what you are supposed to do when you have a dangerous addiction. it wasn't opiates but just plain old alcohol. had a seizure first day and woke up in an ambulance going to port huron hospital. not my best time in life but sober today 9 months later and life is good. not seeking praise. if i were robbong banks and announced i quit that i wouldn't expect people to congratulate me for stopping something i wasn't supposed to be doing anyway. had a beautiful pile of family and friends that stood by me and helped me. if that helps clarify my insight into these people then i hope it does.
    Although you said you're not seeking praise, I'm afraid I have to give you some anyway.. Congrats on being sober..glad you are still here with us! It takes a big person to admit they have a problem...and an even bigger one to do something about it. Props to you!

    Family support is everything. I'm glad to hear you have that kind of family and friends, few can say that. Too many times I've heard that once the family hears someone has a problem, they try to help..a little...but if doesn't work, then they are usually disowned or ignored.

    Congrats again!

    Captn---


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    Regular Member kryptonian's Avatar
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    thanks guys. wasn't easy but did it. was pretty bad. every family function i went to i thought it was going to be an intervention. thought they were going to put me on that show. pretty bad if your friends and family have an intervention and you have to ask which thing. when they picked up the recycle in my neighborhood i had to go out the night before and put all my liquor bottles in everybody else's bins. i live on a corner and i'm a bus stop and didn't want all the parents seeing that. i didn't object when family took my guns and safe key from me.
    if anybody was wondering NO i didn't carry when i was drinking. even the drunk me knew that. when i was an officer in texas too many times at cop parties somebody usually did something stupid. i saw a deputy pull out his off duty weapon and shoot 8 holes thru the patio screen aimed towards another parking lot. saw another off duty cop shoot from a moving pickup into a low income apartment complex that he hated.
    anyway feels great other than being a designated driver - "why is everybody talking so loud?" "why do you people say everything 2 or 3 times? i heard you the first time." "yes i know where i'm going" "we just stopped so she could pee. why didn't you go then?" "don't touch the radio. it's loud enough"

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    kryptonian wrote:
    all good points guys. yes it was sacred heart. unfortunately or fortunately i was a "resident" there last year and was not sent there by any court agency but by my own need. not proud of it but i did what you are supposed to do when you have a dangerous addiction. it wasn't opiates but just plain old alcohol. had a seizure first day and woke up in an ambulance going to port huron hospital. not my best time in life but sober today 9 months later and life is good. not seeking praise. if i were robbong banks and announced i quit that i wouldn't expect people to congratulate me for stopping something i wasn't supposed to be doing anyway. had a beautiful pile of family and friends that stood by me and helped me. if that helps clarify my insight into these people then i hope it does.
    Congrats on 9 months! Every day is a gift. I checked myself in as well back in August 1989 and have been clean/sober since.
    Rights are like muscles. You must EXERCISE THEM to keep them from becoming atrophied.

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