Problem at Best Buy in Greensboro

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According to Jermaine Smith (whose business card describes him as "Customer Solutions Manager") at store #155 in Greensboro, firearms are prohibited inside Best Buy stores. He says that this is corporate policy, and that the only people allowed to carry, open or concealed, are LEOs. Also, the store is not posted.

I've been OC'ing for about 5 months now, and this is the first time I have ever had any issue. How did this come about? Well, Friday evening I was shopping for a birthday gift for my wife. I had been shopping for 30 to 40 minutes, had already finished shopping for my wife, and was crouched down looking at some Xbox games when I was approached by a Best Buy security guard named Courtland. He politely informed me that he could see my concealed handgun (I was wearing my SR9 in a Fobus paddle holster) and inquired as to whether I am a LEO. I smiled & politely informed him that I'm not an officer, and the handgun is not concealed, as it is fully visible. I told him that if it were concealed then he wouldn't see it. I made sure to smile as I said this & be casual about it, as if there was something slightly humorous about his inquiry (which, I guess there IS). Basically, I wanted to try to downplay it & appear as nonthreatening as possible & not come across like a smart-ass. Be that as it may...

Courtland told me that he had been approached by a couple of customers who had informed him that I was carrying a gun, and he himself had spotted it on the security camera. He seemed disappointed in himself, in that he seemed to think that he should have noticed it when I entered the store. I told Courtland that I have openly carried my firearm in this particular store on two other occasions without incident, and that I am fairly certain that Best Buy's corporate policy is to follow whatever the local laws are regarding the carrying of firearms, therefore I am not doing anything wrong. Courtland told me that I could only carry in their store if I was a LEO, and that his manager had instructed him to tell me that I needed to store my firearm in my vehicle while shopping. I asked Courtland if I could speak with his manager regarding this. I don't think he was expecting that - he got on his radio & led me to the Geek Squad counter at the front of the store. Courtland had a few hushed words with his manager that I couldn't hear, and then it was just me & the manager.

I relayed to the manager the same stuff I went over with Courtland, regarding my belief that I was in compliance with store policy, and how I have OC'd in the store once or twice this year without incident.

I assured Jermaine that it is not my intention to intimidate anyone, or to disrupt his business in any manner. Trying to be diplomatic and see things from his viewpoint I thought I might offer to simply conceal while shopping in his store. I know that there are some here who would readily flame me for making that concession, but vehemently standing our ground is sometimes going to do more harm than good. I don't want to be "that a-hole with the gun" in the manager's eyes. We're trying to win people over, and sometimes a hard-line approach is not the most effective. Anyway, Jermaine said that per corporate policy, LEOs are the only people allowed to carry weapons in the store. He said that it doesn't matter if it is concealed either. He acted like he would do me a "favor" and allow me to proceed to the checkout line with my merchandise without making me stow my SR9 in the car first. Some favor, eh? After hearing that I would not even be allowed to CC there, I told him that I have openly carried my firearm in many other large chain retailers in the area without incident, and that there are other stores I can purchase my merchandise at. I requested a business card from him, and left my $150 worth of merchandise on the counter in front of him. I shook hands with a very apologetic Courtland on my way out the door, and smiled, telling him "I understand - you're doing what your manager has instructed you to do. No hard feelings."

The folks at the Apple store in Friendly Center didn't seem to be bothered by the SR9. I bought everything there instead.

Even though it is not posted, since the manager instructed me that I am not allowed to carry a handgun in Best Buy stores, I will not set foot in Best Buy until this is resolved.

I plan to contact Best Buy corporate this week.

EDIT: Here is the info from the manager's business card:

Jermaine Smith
Customer Solutions Manager
Best Buy Store #155
1701 South Forty Dr.
Greensboro, NC 27407

Ph 336-297-1242 direct
Jermaine.Smith@BestBuy.com

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this story from the wall street journal dated march 4th this year the last line of the 12th paragraph a best buy spokesperson says it's their corporate policy to comply with state and local laws....

of course i am taking for granted that since the story is about open carry that that is the question to which the BB spokesperson was replying

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704541304575099433593489048.html?mod=WSJ_hpp_MIDDLETopStories

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I think you did a good job. I will also be sending an email and spreading the word. Thanks for the report.

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Just OC'd there last month no problem. I wonder if there was a different manager that day; a manager helped me find something I was looking for with no mention of my weapon.

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With regard to Best Buy, if you get me corporate contact info we will drop an alert on them, but I would not expect success. When push comes to shove, most chains have "no firearms" policies. Invariably, some idiot in loss prevention decides it is "safer."

When we originally geared up the "Don't Buy" project, what we targeted were "no firearms" **signs** because those made people guilty of a Class2 misdemeanor. In this case, you are guilty of a crime (trespass) only if you fail to leave when asked.

I realize the nature of this forum and understand the intent to normalize firearms carry. That said, I carry concealed because: (1) It is all too easy to inadvertantly violate the law, with evidence obvious to all; and (2) It will be a cold day in hell when I remove my firearm and fail to protect my family simply because a politician has created a "no carry" zone.

Postings GRNC can often get removed. Policies without postings are far more prevalent and difficult. Best bet would be to get the corporate policy in writing, then target a single Best Buy for a demonstration (public property, not private), running rotating stores on rotating days (say, every Saturday). GRNC can put out alerts, but the truth is that you guys need to make people show up -- and that is not easy.

Paul

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Unless this has changed, here it is.

BEST BUY's POLICY

from Customer Contact <CustomerContact@bestbuy.com>
to XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
date Sat, Apr 11, 2009 at 7:31 PM
subject Best Buy Gun policy - XXXXXXXX
mailed-by bestbuy.com

Best Buy strives to comply with all applicable law and statues. Best Buy also strives to provide a safe and comfortable shopping environment for all our customers. Best Buy does not ban guns at our retail locations. As a general rule, Best Buy does not post “no guns allowed” signs in our stores and we are not aware of any individual stores that might have posted such a sign.


http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/view_topic.php?id=42442&forum_id=57&highlight=cabelas+open+carry

Let us know how it goes.

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chiefjason wrote:

Unless this has changed, here it is.

BEST BUY's POLICY

from Customer Contact <CustomerContact@bestbuy.com>
to XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
date Sat, Apr 11, 2009 at 7:31 PM
subject Best Buy Gun policy - XXXXXXXX
mailed-by bestbuy.com

Best Buy strives to comply with all applicable law and statues. Best Buy also strives to provide a safe and comfortable shopping environment for all our customers. Best Buy does not ban guns at our retail locations. As a general rule, Best Buy does not post “no guns allowed” signs in our stores and we are not aware of any individual stores that might have posted such a sign.


http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/view_topic.php?id=42442&forum_id=57&highlight=cabelas+open+carry

Let us know how it goes.

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Chiefiason, you are correct this was the first store I ever OC in! Being my first OC establishment I made sure to contact corporate for policy and checked the doors as I entered. I have since OC in 4 different Best Buy locations without trouble. I have even had a manager ask me about my leo status and even though shocked when I told him I wasn't. I didn't give him time to create his own fears, I stated to him that I am a registered firearm owner and that in NC it is legal for me to OC in his establishment unless he asks me to leave and places conspicuous signage up at all entrances. I then let him know that while I would leave I would never enter his store again on principle, and would continue to shop at another Best Buy that doesn't have a problem following corporate policy! He became informed, told me I was fine and that he had no problems with me carrying, and most likely went to make a phone call to get reassurance. All places I enter result with no mention except on occasion. Then there was last night at Walmart!!! http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum41/40366-4.html

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I stated to him that I am a registered firearm owner

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Funny, I am not.

There is no such thing as a registry of firearms owners.

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customer solution...............hmmm, was it printed in pretty pastels?

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mekender wrote:

I stated to him that I am a registered firearm owner

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Funny, I am not.

There is no such thing as a registry of firearms owners.

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Yes and no.

If the OP is from Durham County, they require registration of handguns.

And if he has a NC CHP, then he is sort of "registered" with his County Sheriff's department, because they have his info (name, address, DL info, etc).

But you're right,for outright OC, NC doesn't require registration of either people or firearms... Unless you live in Durham Co...

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What I was going for was this whole "registered" BS. I see it on TV all the time... CSI and CSI: NY I can forgive as can I forgive NCIS and NCIS: Los Angeles because those are all featuring places that require registration. I see it on CSI: Miami all the time too but there is no registration in FL... The problem is, no one questions it even though it is dead wrong because they are so conditioned to think that everyone has to register.

Saying "I am a registered gun owner" to someone that does not know any better makes them think that everyone has to be registered. When they find out that isn't the case or some political proposes a law requiring registration they are stunned and think that cant be right, they have always been told that people or guns are registered in the news stories they read. They are also much more likely to support laws requiring registration.

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mekender wrote:

What I was going for was this whole "registered" BS. I see it on TV all the time... CSI and CSI: NY I can forgive as can I forgive NCIS and NCIS: Los Angeles because those are all featuring places that require registration. I see it on CSI: Miami all the time too but there is no registration in FL... The problem is, no one questions it even though it is dead wrong because they are so conditioned to think that everyone has to register.

Saying "I am a registered gun owner" to someone that does not know any better makes them think that everyone has to be registered. When they find out that isn't the case or some political proposes a law requiring registration they are stunned and think that cant be right, they have always been told that people or guns are registered in the news stories they read. They are also much more likely to support laws requiring registration.

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I am not here to debate verbiage but there is such thing as a registered firearm and I am the owner of that registered firearm. Therefore in NC I am a registered firearm OWNER! I had to register with my Sheriffs Dept and supply fingerprints along with a full background check to be issued a permit to purchase a handgun. I then had to, by law, take this registered document to a firearms dealer and give this document to him/her in exchange for a firearm that has a serial number stamped on it which is recorded and registered to my original purchase permit. If any of you purchased a handgun in NC I would believe that someone can tell you from a registry what handguns you purchased legally in NC! N.C. Gen. Stat. § 14-402 will explain in greater detail that you my friend if legal are a "registered firearm" owner by application of § 14-405 and § 14-406. If I dropped my Sig off at a local police station in a bag anonymously, they would contact me regarding my firearm by simply running all records/registries back to me. Let act like we know what we are talking about so we do not look like silly gunslingers! I do not mean to be a d^&* but lets not be the pot calling the kettle black, by instigating negativity due to a lack of complete understanding. I want people to know that my firearm is registered, I think all responsible firearm owners would want firearms registered. By the public thinking or believing that there is a registry they are more likely to feel safe by that crap they see on that poison box they call a television. Because we know when it isn't spreading fear it is spewing crap!

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Chas222 wrote:

mekender wrote:

What I was going for was this whole "registered" BS. I see it on TV all the time... CSI and CSI: NY I can forgive as can I forgive NCIS and NCIS: Los Angeles because those are all featuring places that require registration. I see it on CSI: Miami all the time too but there is no registration in FL... The problem is, no one questions it even though it is dead wrong because they are so conditioned to think that everyone has to register.

Saying "I am a registered gun owner" to someone that does not know any better makes them think that everyone has to be registered. When they find out that isn't the case or some political proposes a law requiring registration they are stunned and think that cant be right, they have always been told that people or guns are registered in the news stories they read. They are also much more likely to support laws requiring registration.

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  I am not here to debate verbiage but there is such thing as a registered firearm and I am the owner of that registered firearm. Therefore in NC I am a registered firearm OWNER! I had to register with my Sheriffs Dept and supply fingerprints along with a full background check to be issued a permit to purchase a handgun. I then had to, by law, take this registered document to a firearms dealer and give this document to him/her in exchange for a firearm that has a serial number stamped on it which is recorded and registered to my original purchase permit. If any of you purchased a handgun in NC I would believe that someone can tell you from a registry what handguns you purchased legally in NC! N.C. Gen. Stat. § 14-402 will explain in greater detail that you my friend if legal are a "registered firearm" owner by application of  § 14-405 and § 14-406. If I dropped my Sig off at a local police station in a bag anonymously, they would contact me regarding my firearm by simply running all records/registries back to me. Let act like we know what we are talking about so we do not look like silly gunslingers! I do not mean to be a d^&* but lets not be the pot calling the kettle black, by instigating negativity due to a lack of complete understanding. I want people to know that my firearm is registered, I think all responsible firearm owners would want firearms registered. By the public thinking or believing that there is a registry they are more likely to feel safe by that crap they see on that poison box they call a television. Because we know when it isn't spreading fear it is spewing crap!

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Not quite. There is no registry of your firearm that the police can instantly access. Unless you have reported it stolen. They would have to contact the manufacturer, then the FFL, then the FFL could tell them who the original owner is/was. I'm sure it involves a bit more detail than the above. But there should not be a central database of firearms and their owners in NC that the police can access. And there should NEVER be one.

Unless you can clue us in to how your firearm is registered with the police, I think you have the process mistaken. Unless you went and personally offered them your information, they don't have it.

FWIW, if you dropped off your gun they would likely run the numbers against any stolen firearm data. Maybe keep it and check it later. Then destroy or sell it when it did not show up. If you truly believe the cops are going to go to all the trouble it takes to find out who the original owner is/was I think you are mistaken there too.

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Chas222 wrote:

mekender wrote:

What I was going for was this whole "registered" BS. I see it on TV all the time... CSI and CSI: NY I can forgive as can I forgive NCIS and NCIS: Los Angeles because those are all featuring places that require registration. I see it on CSI: Miami all the time too but there is no registration in FL... The problem is, no one questions it even though it is dead wrong because they are so conditioned to think that everyone has to register.

Saying "I am a registered gun owner" to someone that does not know any better makes them think that everyone has to be registered. When they find out that isn't the case or some political proposes a law requiring registration they are stunned and think that cant be right, they have always been told that people or guns are registered in the news stories they read. They are also much more likely to support laws requiring registration.

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I am not here to debate verbiage but there is such thing as a registered firearm and I am the owner of that registered firearm. Therefore in NC I am a registered firearm OWNER! I had to register with my Sheriffs Dept and supply fingerprints along with a full background check to be issued a permit to purchase a handgun. I then had to, by law, take this registered document to a firearms dealer and give this document to him/her in exchange for a firearm that has a serial number stamped on it which is recorded and registered to my original purchase permit. If any of you purchased a handgun in NC I would believe that someone can tell you from a registry what handguns you purchased legally in NC! N.C. Gen. Stat. § 14-402 will explain in greater detail that you my friend if legal are a "registered firearm" owner by application of § 14-405 and § 14-406. If I dropped my Sig off at a local police station in a bag anonymously, they would contact me regarding my firearm by simply running all records/registries back to me. Let act like we know what we are talking about so we do not look like silly gunslingers! I do not mean to be a d^&* but lets not be the pot calling the kettle black, by instigating negativity due to a lack of complete understanding. I want people to know that my firearm is registered, I think all responsible firearm owners would want firearms registered. By the public thinking or believing that there is a registry they are more likely to feel safe by that crap they see on that poison box they call a television. Because we know when it isn't spreading fear it is spewing crap!

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There is no registry in NC outside of Durahm County. The permit you get to purchase a handgun is merely stapled to the 4473 and kept in the records of the FFL.

I think all responsible firearm owners would want firearms registered.

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Every single time in history a registry has been done, the ultimate end of that registry was to confiscate the firearms from law abiding citizens... EVERY SINGLE TIME. So be registered if you want... I would prefer freedom myself.

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I think all responsible firearm owners would want firearms registered.

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Thats the last thing I want to happen. History time and time again have proven that gun registration 1) doesn't work, and 2) can be very dangerous to the owner.

I prefer freedom over security any day. I'm a responsible adult, so I can take care of myself, thank you.

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chiefjason wrote:

Not quite. There is no registry of your firearm that the police can instantly access. Unless you have reported it stolen. They would have to contact the manufacturer, then the FFL, then the FFL could tell them who the original owner is/was. I'm sure it involves a bit more detail than the above. But there should not be a central database of firearms and their owners in NC that the police can access. And there should NEVER be one.

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Not entirely true. If a person has EVER had an encounter with the police regarding OC, and they "ran your serial number", there is a VERY high probablility that they entered your data (guns serial#, your name, address, description, etc) into E-Trace, which is a NATIONAL DATABASE operated by BATFE.

De-facto national registration.

I think there are probably a LOT of people on this forum who would be surprised to find that they firearms are, in fact, in this registry already.

What it boils down to is that if you have EVER had the SN on your firearm run by the police, it is most likely been entered into E-Trace, and is, therefore, de-facto, "registered", whether the BATFE is willing to call it that or not...

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My point is merely in some fashion every handgun sold legally in NC is registered through application of sheriff record, to seller of firearm, to the owner of said firearm.

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Chas222 wrote:

My point is merely in some fashion every handgun sold legally in NC is registered through application of sheriff record, to seller of firearm, to the owner of said firearm.

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No it isnt. The sheriff has no idea where your permit is used within the state. And if you use it for a private purchase, you do not even have any legal requirement to hand it over to the seller. Private sales have zero ability for a paper trail unless the private parties keep one.

The FFL that sells a firearm can have his files inspected by LEOs true but in order to trace a specific gun to a specific owner. They have to go to the Manufacturer, then to the distributor, then to the FFL. Each step of that process requires a warrant.

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I shop in Best Buy Fayetteville Skibo almost everyday and I OC. I work in an office directly behind their radio installation facility.

In regards to leaving without incident every time you OC AND a supervisor/manager tells you to leave I'll call no-go. The manager is not always correct on these occasions, as with the incident with the OP. Let them call the po-po. Let them charge you and go to the courthouse to figure the situation out.

The manager of BB needs to be reminded of the consequences of his own actions AND Corporate policy for not knowing Best Buy corporate policy regarding the NC state laws and weapons carry within his own store.

I'm willing to take that chance at the front checkout stand of any store that allows weapons as per state laws. I get discouraged at folks who walk out and call corporate 'later'.

Make it a point so that the store manager knows right then and there that weapons are allowed by smarter people than the asshat managers at the local level who are anti-gun or simply ignorant to their own rights AND THEIR CUSTOMERS RIGHTS pertaining to RTKBA.

2 cents

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razor_baghdad wrote:

I shop in Best Buy Fayetteville Skibo almost everyday and I OC. I work in an office directly behind their radio installation facility.

In regards to leaving without incident every time you OC AND a supervisor/manager tells you to leave I'll call no-go. The manager is not always correct on these occasions, as with the incident with the OP. Let them call the po-po. Let them charge you and go to the courthouse to figure the situation out.

The manager of BB needs to be reminded of the consequences of his own actions AND Corporate policy for not knowing Best Buy corporate policy regarding the NC state laws and weapons carry within his own store.

I'm willing to take that chance at the front checkout stand of any store that allows weapons as per state laws. I get discouraged at folks who walk out and call corporate 'later'.

Make it a point so that the store manager knows right then and there that weapons are allowed by smarter people than the asshat managers at the local level who are anti-gun or simply ignorant to their own rights AND THEIR CUSTOMERS RIGHTS pertaining to RTKBA.

2 cents

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So you are saying that you would refuse to leave if asked?

In that case, even if you are right about store and corporate policy, you are still breaking the law. The law says that if you are asked to leave by someone that is authorized to ask you to leave, then you are trespassing if you refuse. They do not have to have a reason for asking you to leave, and even if they are using reasons that are against corporate policy, you cannot legally refuse their demand that you leave. Hell they could ask you to leave for reasons that were illegal such as race or religion and you would still have to leave even though you would have civil legal recourse later.