Sears and Kmart - Defense Free Zones

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Apparently I misunderstood the statement of policy. Please disregard the suggestion to try to work with them.

If I were ever to bother dealing with Sears (sorry Craftsman tools, but I have no use for you) or K-Mart (I steal my cop lights from the real cop cars, thankyouverymuch) I would stop and boycot them. Seems I started too soo and for all the wrong reasons.

However, a letter to the corporate head of each will be on the way.

stay safe.

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Here is Sears' reply to my email. Well, non-reply, that is.

On 6/3/2010 20:44, Sears Orders wrote:

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E-mails sent and boycott started

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Sears in my town is located in a posted mall so I already take my business elsewhere. I head for specialty stores or Penny's or even Macy's these days. You get better quality,selectionand pricing anyway.

As for K-Mart, LOL, are they even still in business? Take your money to Walmart and put the blue light boobs outta' business.

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When I was a kid we use to get catalogs in the mail from all the major stores and one of them was Sears and guess what, they use to sell guns. It wasn't that long ago and K Mart sold guns, they still sell ammo.Whata change of opinion, as soon as the profit is gone so is the support.

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Sent this off to both Sears and K-Mart earlier today:

It has been brought to my attention that Sears (and K-Mart, now that you are essentially the same company) has instituted a policy barring citizens who may legally carry firearms from doing so in your stores. Most recently, an openly-carrying citizen was asked to leave a Sears store in Nevada.

For the record, I support your property rights, and respect your decision to make such policies. Having said that, however, I still retain my constitutional right of free association. By definition, that includes the right to not associate with a person or entity with whom I disagree. I strongly disagree with your policy to ban those of us who choose to protect ourselves with firearms should the need arise.

By enforcing such a ban you are not creating a "Gun Free Zone", as criminal elements will blithely ignore your ban. You are instead creating a "Criminal Empowerment Zone". Consider the following carnage, all of which occurred in "Gun Free Zones":

1) November 5, 2009: Fort Hood, 13 killed, 30 wounded.
2) Feb. 14, 2008: Northern Illinois University, 5 killed,18 wounded.
3) April 16, 2007: Virginia Tech, 32 killed.
4) Oct. 2, 2006: West Nickel Mines Amish School, 5 killed.
5) March 21, 2005: Red Lake High School, 9 killed, 7 wounded.

By banning legitimate carriers of firearms you are not protecting your clientele; you are instead drastically increasing their risk. By prohibiting legal self-defense on your property you are also assuming liability for any injuries suffered on your premises as a result of a violent attack. While having a firearm at the ready is no magic talisman, it greatly enhances my odds of survival in such a scenario.

I have spent literally thousands of dollars at your stores over the years on a wide range of products: clothing, hand and power tools, tires and batteries, appliances and other household goods. My then-newlywed wife and I were thrilled some years ago when Sears was the first retailer to offer us a credit card.

No longer. I will now to spend my money in your competitor's stores where, I am certain, they will be happy to have me.

Let's see if it does any good.

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Great letter. I would have added some of the Simon Properties mall shootings since retail gets more of their attention than schools will.

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ecocks wrote:

Great letter. I would have added some of the Simon Properties mall shootings since retail gets more of their attention than schools will.

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Hadn't thought of that specifically. Nuts.

FWIW, both Sears and K-Mart responded today. Neither intends to revisit their policy.

Response from Sears:

Dear Valued Customer,
Thank you for your recent correspondence. We are always interested in
hearing from our customers, and regret it was this type of situation
that prompted you to contact us. We apologize for the inconvenience you
have experienced and understand your frustration with our firearms
policy.

By sharing your concerns, you have enabled us to address the issues and
provide feedback to the appropriate person. Truly, your remarks provide
forthright feedback that will enable Sears to achieve excellence in
everything we do.

Once again, we apologize for the experience you encountered with our
firearms policy. We appreciate your business and value you as a Sears
Holdings customer. We certainly hope you will continue to make Sears
Holdings your choice for quality and value.

Sincerely,

Joanne J.
Retail Customer Care
Sears Holdings Corporation

And from K-Mart:

Dear xxxxxxxx,

Thank you for your recent correspondence. We are always interested in
hearing from our customers, and regret it was this type of situation
that prompted you to contact us. Please accept our apology for any
offense this may have caused.

With regard to your suggestion that Sears change its policy regarding
weapons in the workplace, Sears has no intention of doing so at this
time as we remain focused on providing a safe shopping and work
environment for our customers and associates

By sharing your concerns, you have enabled us to provide feedback to the
appropriate person. Truly, your remarks provide forthright feedback
that will enable Sears to achieve excellence in everything we do.

Once again, thank you for contacting us.

Sincerely,

Dylan C.
National Customer Relations
Sears Holdings Corp.

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I wonder if any of the messages that has been responded to by Sears and Kmart customer service reps have actually been forwarded to upper management or if the customer service reps are given a standard response to send back possibly slightly altered and then just delete the email and move on to the next one.

I might sound like a cynic but it is just a feeling that I have.

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Any time I have gone into either of those stores, it's been a ghost town. I honestly have no idea how they pay the bills as it is.

I never bought anything because they were overpriced and/or didn't have what I needed. Now I have one more reason never to give them a dime.

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Sleepless wrote:

I wonder if any of the messages that has been responded to by Sears and Kmart customer service reps have actually been forwarded to upper management or if the customer service reps are given a standard response to send back possibly slightly altered and then just delete the email and move on to the next one.

I might sound like a cynic but it is just a feeling that I have.

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I had this same feeling, I did not have any luck getting a different email address today, but I have a new number to call tomorrow to see if I can get the emails for members of the board of directors.

Once I have them I will post them here Most Ricky-Tic!

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No problems with Sears and K-mart accepting my OC while shopping down here -- Arizona.

As always in your local ....YMMV!

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GWbiker wrote:

No problems with Sears and K-mart accepting my OC while shopping down here -- Arizona.

As always in your local ....YMMV!

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While that is good GWbiker, the fact remains that they (as a company) have an Anti Gun policy!

Whether or not your particular store enforces it or not, If a company as a whole has an Anti Gun policy, why would you want to support that company? It just doesn't make sense to me... If for some reason I was asked to leave a store for open carrying anywhere I would choose to not shop at any of their locations, and let their higher ups know why... Doesn't that makes sense...

I do almost all my shopping and business in Bullhead City AZ, here is an example... There are two Safeway stores and two Smith's stores here, say I get asked to leave one of the Safeway stores because I am open carrying, am I going to go finish my shopping at the other Safeway store or go to one of the Smith's stores instead?

I am going to one of the Smith's stores and I am also sending off letters and calling Safeway to let them know they lost my business and why! I am also letting them know they will likely lose the business of anyone else I can inform about the incident...

Thankfully both Smiths and Safeway have no problem with Open Carry (to my knowledge)

United we Stand, Divided we FALL...

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You have to realize that a few letters/phone calls from a half-dozen to a dozen "Average Joes" isn't going to have much of an effect on a large corporation like Sears Holding. What needs to happen is organizations such as Grass Roots North Carolina, Virginia Citizens Defense League and similar groups to get involved. They bring numbers large enough to threaten a noticiable purse string tightening for the company. Similarly, they offer large numbers of potential customers that might choose to shop due to good will towards a gun friendly company. Contact your state/local 2A groups and see if you can get something happening.

It really shouldn't matter if you shop there or not, it is an infringement upon your 2A rights. The more of these companies that can be converted to being "gun friendly" or, at least, "tolerant," the better.

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OCDO may have 40,000 2A activists, assume across 50 states presumes 800 per state, assume 10 stores per state is 80 per store and a drop in the bucket. If all state level 2A orgs had the same numbers but unique members then it would be a larger drop in the bucket.

Personally, I already don't shop bigbox brick stores. Likely others too.

Look at the lies that the NRA tells about their membership numbers - for the same reasons.

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Just read this on Facebook (Anything about Guns page)

I notified Sears that i would no longer be a customer of thiers due to them kicking out a law abiding citizen using thier right to arm themself. confirmation of thier ignorance:

Dear Customer,

WEAPONS
...Policy

It is the policy of Sears Holdings Corporation (SHC) that individuals are prohibited from using or possessing firearms or weapons of any kind (including using any tool, supply, product or other resource in a manner that implies that it is a weapon)., concealed or otherwise, at any time while on Company premises (including parking lots) or while engaged in conducting business on behalf of SHC, unless specifically permitted by state law.

Sincerely,
Monica W,
Retail Customer Care
Sears Holdings Corporation

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Now it appears this is out of their employee manual, but it was clearly addressed to a Customer implying that it applies to him as a customer as well.

If you look closely the last line has a little bit of important info in it... "unless specifically permitted by state law." This is in conflict with what everyone else was told about the no firearms policy!! We need clarification from Sears once and for all!

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This is what was just posted by another gun owner who is local to me, who helped out in this situation more then i was able to.

So consider the boycott over, and thank you to everyone that joined in and sent emails, we have a new response from Sears!

SCJeffro said:

After making about 6 calls and talking to 10 different people, the 2nd to last last being a VP of something or other who referred me to the investigator/case manager who sent this email...

Quote:
Hello,

Its Emerald, your case manager, and this is the Sears cooperate policy regarding fire arms. Please call or email me to confirm you have gotten this information. Your case number is xxxxxxx.


Subject: RE: Request for fire arm/weapon policy


Here is the response from Sears Senior Counsel:


Our corporate policy regarding customers who openly carry firearms on our store premises is that as long as the law of the state in which our store is located legally permits the open carrying of firearms (i.e. carrying a firearm on one's person in plain sight), customers will be permitted to openly carry firearms within our stores.


Emerald Sloan
Blue Ribbon Service Case Manager
Sears Holdings Corporation
Toll Free: 1-888-266-4043 extension 75
Email: BlueRibbonService2@searshc.com

Schedule: Monday - Saturday 8:00 AM - 5:00 PM (CST) off Wednesday and Sunday
I have removed my case number (as it is attached at SEARS to my email, home address and phone number through my old SEARS account)

So there you go, I feel this is enough for me to stop the SEARS boycott, in fact maybe you can print it out and take it to the store that kicked you out and tell the manager and Security guy to contact the Sears Senior Counsel themselves if they have questions!

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Great! Cuz, I really liked Sears! So, no more boycott.

(Except for the Sears in Eastdale Mall, where, if you have read the Alabama forum, you know I have been told explicitly not to OC anymore--in the Mall that is, not Sears.)

Good work.

Suggestion: someone should start a thread containing corporate policy letters and emails and get it pinned.

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Looks like a win for us.

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eye95 wrote:

Suggestion: someone should start a thread containing corporate policy letters and emails and get it pinned.

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I think that would be a GREAT idea to have for the main forum for any and all of the major chains that operate nationwide and/or over large regions (like I know people on the West Coast have never heard of a Piggly Wiggly). Then each state could sticky any major chains that operate just in their state.

Let's not forget to include such chains as banks, sporting goods stores (BassPro, Sportsmans warehouse, etc), Real Estate agencies (ReMax, Century 21, etc) and all the other possibilities.