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Thread: Disguised open carry?

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    Hi,

    I am just curious but what defines open carry legally (not opinion) is it that the holster is visable or the weapon itself? I read the law and it said that the holster must be visable whether it's a scabbard, case, or holster but that opens the doors tomore questions like there are gun holsters for small weapons that look more like cell phone cases or other cases that fit on your belt, so now under AZ law would those holster be considered open carry? I realize that none of this will even be valid after the new bill becomes law but I'm just curious for now, and no I probably won't use one but would like to know if it's an option.



    Thanks

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    As far as i know the holster has to be easily recognized as being a holster for a weapon, so a disguised holster, like a fanny pack type thing, or that pouch that the taurus tcp comes with, would not be legal for open carry. I could be wrong but thats what i uderstand.

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    as of july 29th this year its open or conceileddoesnt matter where you put it

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    Regular Member AZkopper's Avatar
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    Now: NO (without CWP)

    After July 29th: OK (it is considered concealed).



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    How about something like this for a belt buckle?





    Yes, it's real. North American Arms, .22 LR. Push the button to release the weapon.

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    Friend of mine has that exact gun, he carries it every day, tucks his shirt in and has never had a problem from LE. So i assume its fine, not to mention really cool, not that id ever be seen wearing a belt buckle like that.

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    Regular Member azcdlfred's Avatar
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    exp15 wrote:
    I am just curious but what defines open carry legally (not opinion) is it that the holster is visable or the weapon itself? I read the law and it said that the holster must be visable whether it's a scabbard, case, or holster but that opens the doors tomore questions like there are gun holsters for small weapons that look more like cell phone cases or other cases that fit on your belt, so now under AZ law would those holster be considered open carry? I realize that none of this will even be valid after the new bill becomes law but I'm just curious for now, and no I probably won't use one but would like to know if it's an option.
    Like others have pointed out, this discussion is moot as of July 29, however.....

    Under current law (ARS 31-3102.G), to not be committing "weapons misconduct" by carrying concleaed without a CCW permit, a weapon must be in a belt holster and the holster, not the gun, must be "wholly or partially visible." That means that thigh rigs and shoulder holsters are illegal unless one has a CCW permit. Also if your IWB is not visible, that could be a violation. In 1994, the state appeals court ruled that "wholly or partially visible" really meant "obvious under ordinary observation." That means if you have a gun strapped on your right hip and the cop coming from your left side doesn't see it - you are carrying a concealed weapon.

    Regarding the "conveyance" (holster), the court ruled in 1994, in a fanny pack case, that the "conveyance" must put others on notice that you are carrying a weapon.

    All of this nonsense goes away on July 29 because the misconduct sections regarding open and vehicle carry are eliminated along with the concealed carry permit requirement for law-abiding adults (21 and over). So, after July 29, you can use whatever "convenyance" you want to conceal your firearm and it doesn't matter how visible it is because both open and discreet carry have been restored in Arizona.

    Fred



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    why are thigh rigs illegal??

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    >meso.40< wrote:
    why are thigh rigs illegal??
    Are they a "belt holster?" If so I am wrong. I was focused on the fact that they are strapped onto one's thigh. Are they actually attached to a belt?

    Fred

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    well some are, they normally have 2 straps attached to the belt to hold them up more securely.

    So a shoulder holster is also illegal even if you arent covering it up in any way?

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    Regular Member azcdlfred's Avatar
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    >meso.40< wrote:
    So a shoulder holster is also illegal even if you arent covering it up in any way?
    The current, soon to expire, law specifically states "belt holster." I've never heard of anyone getting arrested for being a wannabe Don Johnson, probably because cops (1) are generally nice,and (2) don't really understand the law as it is written.

    Fred


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    azcdlfred wrote:
    >meso.40< wrote:
    So a shoulder holster is also illegal even if you arent covering it up in any way?
    The current, soon to expire, law specifically states "belt holster."* I've never heard of anyone getting arrested for being a wannabe Don Johnson, probably because cops (1) are generally nice,*and (2) don't really understand the law as it is written.

    Fred
    ....and (3) this is Arizona.

    Fixed it for ya'...

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    I swear... some of you people would try to complicate soup. If you're too dumb to figure things out... don't carry guns. OK? Gun in holster... anywhere... Can be seen... most angles... open carry. Gun hidden under or inside something... concealed. Now.. as for that buckle gun... cute... prob'ly illegal. Why have it? Worthless as a weapon. We don't carry toys or conversation pieces... we carry weapons. If you so timid you can't OC a real weapon that looks like a real weapon... then don't carry the damn things.

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    Dang, Reb. And I thought *I* was a cranky old guy.

    *GRIN*

    Though it does sometimes seem as if folks do want to complicate things...

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    Lookit the title of this thread... 'Disguised Open Carry'. Uh... that's conceled... or... I dunno. Are these people nuts? It's not enough to be in one of the most gun friendly states in the union... they gotta get cute.



    Carry the freakin' gun... like a gun!!!!

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    Sonora Rebel wrote:
    I swear... some of you people would try to complicate soup. If you're too dumb to figure things out... don't carry guns. OK? Gun in holster... anywhere... Can be seen... most angles... open carry. Gun hidden under or inside something... concealed. Now.. as for that buckle gun... cute... prob'ly illegal. Why have it? Worthless as a weapon. We don't carry toys or conversation pieces... we carry weapons. If you so timid you can't OC a real weapon that looks like a real weapon... then don't carry the damn things.
    Simple soup is... water.



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    exp15 wrote:
    Hi,

    I am just curious but what defines open carry legally (not opinion) is it that the holster is visable or the weapon itself? I read the law and it said that the holster must be visable whether it's a scabbard, case, or holster but that opens the doors tomore questions like there are gun holsters for small weapons that look more like cell phone cases or other cases that fit on your belt, so now under AZ law would those holster be considered open carry? I realize that none of this will even be valid after the new bill becomes law but I'm just curious for now, and no I probably won't use one but would like to know if it's an option.



    Thanks
    Uhh, if a gun is successfully disguised... it's concealed.

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    Reb:

    Two years on this forum and several years on other gun sites has led me to believe, there are people in this world who ask for direction on the Internet before taking a dump in the AM.



  19. #19
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    GWbiker wrote:
    Reb:

    Two years on this forum and several years on other gun sites has led me to believe, there are people in this world who ask for direction on the Internet before taking a dump in the AM.

    I've noticed that as well...

  20. #20
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    Sonora Rebel wrote:
    GWbiker wrote:
    Reb:

    Two years on this forum and several years on other gun sites has led me to believe, there are people in this world who ask for direction on the Internet before taking a dump in the AM.

    I've noticed that as well...
    It takes all kinds. Remember, everybody is ignorant. Just about different things.

  21. #21
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    Sonora Rebel wrote:
    Lookit the title of this thread... 'Disguised Open Carry'. Uh... that's conceled... or... I dunno. Are these people nuts? It's not enough to be in one of the most gun friendly states in the union... they gotta get cute.



    Carry the freakin' gun... like a gun!!!!
    This one and the post before it, I give you big cudos for pointing that out before I did.

    Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

    Clyde

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    GWbiker wrote:
    Reb:

    Two years on this forum and several years on other gun sites has led me to believe, there are people in this world who ask for direction on the Internet before taking a dump in the AM.

    It took you that long to realize that. :what: Back before the Internet I knew some CEO's of major companies that couldn't doit without a consultant telling thenthat it was time along with a complete report approving of it. Bill Clinton couldn't or wouldn't have a BM without taking a public opinion poll but now a B? was a different story. :shock:

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    PT111 wrote:
    Bill Clinton couldn't or wouldn't have a BM without taking a public opinion poll but now a B? was a different story. :shock:
    This is probably not a good time to remind you that Clinton's middle name was Jefferson. You might just start using his initials whenever you mention him.

    As for that buckle gun, it would make a great last-ditch gun, and a lot more accessable at my age than an ankle holster.

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    JKelly wrote:
    PT111 wrote:
    Bill Clinton couldn't or wouldn't have a BM without taking a public opinion poll but now a B? was a different story. :shock:
    This is probably not a good time to remind you that Clinton's middle name was Jefferson. You might just start using his initials whenever you mention him.

    As for that buckle gun, it would make a great last-ditch gun, and a lot more accessable at my age than an ankle holster.
    I had completely forgotten about how applicable his middle name is. Wonder if there is a connection.

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