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Thread: Long Gun OC or AK "hand gun" BS IMHO

  1. #1
    Regular Member zekester's Avatar
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    I have been holding my tongue on this for a long time and I am sure it has be talked about before, but taking an "AK" to any event is just plain stupid IMHO.

    Yes, we want to promote the right to carry, but to me, carrying a long gun or a modified AK is exactly what the anti's want to see to diminish or curtail our right to protect our 2A.


    In Missouri, which we are fighting for pre-emption,we discourage long guns and if anyone would show up with one, the event wouldend immediately. The sheepers are bad enough, we don't want the LEO to show up with the Swat Team just because some idiot....( and if you really read these threads youknow what I am talking about ) to take it beyond what needs to be done to promote this issue.

    I guess I am just saying, PLEASE use common sense.


    I believe you hurt the cause by displaying an overwhelming show of "force".

    You may not see it this way, but the sheep and the LEO see this exactly this way!


    I am so sick of seeing news reports of the OC crowd carrying "AK-47s"....when all we really want is the right protect our right.


    Now, please do not take this thewrong way, you AK people out there.....you have every right to do so, I am just asking that youlet us get this movement going and then carry to hearts content.

    There are other states that do not have the ability to do what you do at the moment....so PLEASE...let us catch up, because if you do not......not only will I not be able to carry my AK......you MAY lose your right to do so also.

    Thanks for letting me voice my opinion on this board.

    Z


    GOD gave me rights!!!....The Constitutuion just confirms it!!

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    Ak "hand gun"?

    got a pic of it

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    Hard to advocate for an activity that is "uninfringed", and operates on the basis of equality when you yourself infringe upon other peoples rights and force your opinion of what to carry on them.

    Am I right?



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    Personal responsibility is a facade created by religious people in particular...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    Religion uses is as a tool, they did not create it.
    The wheels on the bus go round and round...round and round.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
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    Regular Member zekester's Avatar
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    slowfiveoh wrote:
    Hard to advocate for an activity that is "uninfringed", and operates on the basis of equality when you yourself infringe upon other peoples rights and force your opinion of what to carry on them.

    Am I right?


    Yes, I do agree 100%.....but it would be nice if we keep it to a minimum until us " backward" states could catch up.

    I am not advocating the not carrying long guns nor the modified AK....All I am asking is, if your trully for the OC movement, it would behove all of us to take ALL the country in concederation. We have to fight this battle too. It is just difficuilt when you see news stories with people carrying long guns, when we ( Missouri), are just now fighting the OC laws to begain with.

    Again....JMO...and a suggestion....will it change...perhaps not....but us in MO are fighting an up hill battle, and any help .....is help to all!!

    Z
    GOD gave me rights!!!....The Constitutuion just confirms it!!

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    Regular Member Dreamer's Avatar
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    Here's a pic, specs, and a source for purchase via FFL transfer...

    http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/storeproduct866.aspx


    It is our cause to dispel the foggy thinking which avoids hard decisions in the delusion that a world of conflict will somehow mysteriously resolve itself into a world of harmony, if we just don't rock the boat or irritate the forces of aggression—and this is hogwash."
    --Barry Goldwater, 1964

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    Regular Member zekester's Avatar
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    Dreamer wrote:
    Here's a pic, specs, and a source for purchase via FFL transfer...

    http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/storeproduct866.aspx


    Thank you for posting this,

    If I went to envent in MO....the swat team would be all over this, now would they be wrong? Most certianly.....but if I had just my Glock, or my 1911....I would get questioned, perhaps detained, but the local GOV would not change the law.

    Without pre-emption...it would be possible that they could ban anything they want to...

    Just asking for patience, until the next session....we are working on it.

    BUT WHY, STIR THE POT?


    Excercise your rights by all means, just remember, there are others that do not have the same rights as you do!!!
    z

    GOD gave me rights!!!....The Constitutuion just confirms it!!

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    zekester wrote:
    Yes, I do agree 100%.....but it would be nice if we keep it to a minimum until us " backward" states could catch up.

    I am not advocating the not carrying long guns nor the modified AK....All I am asking is, if your trully for the OC movement, it would behove all of us to take ALL the country in concederation. We have to fight this battle too. It is just difficuilt when you see news stories with people carrying long guns, when we ( Missouri), are just now fighting the OC laws to begain with.

    Again....JMO...and a suggestion....will it change...perhaps not....but us in MO are fighting an up hill battle, and any help .....is help to all!!

    Z
    Well put, but please remember that the exposure of a gun in general to people who have been brainwashed to believe they are devices of pure, automatic destruction, will not be well received anyways.

    Many people purchased their PLR's or AK's and frankly it's all they have to carry.

    It is not helpful whatsoever to make a "big deal" out of their activity, when they are likely carrying for the same precise purpose you are. Are there some "showboats"? Oh yeah, sure there are! I can think of people carrying XD's and M&P's that were clowns too, though.

    It is also not helpful that you would request these same people leave their firearm at home, while advocating equality in our ability to defend ourselves.

    Lastly, normalizing "regular guns" by itself is a categorization that perpetuates unhelpful stereotypes by propping them up, and supporting them.

    It does not help that gun owners, for whatever reason, categorize AK or AR pistols as something "inappropriate", when "uninfringed", "equal", and "self defense" are the terms and/or purpose of the movement.

    As much as you believe the antis would have a field day with somebody carrying an AK or AR based pistol or long gun, you had better be prepared to believe that they see the commentary against such activities by recognized, and reputable "gun-rights advocates", or RTKBA supporters, as likewise, extremely helpful.

    I mean, if the "gun guys" think AK and AR pistols are "something different", and SHOULD be kept out of sight, then what more of a reputable source than that?

    Right?

    Gotta consider all angles.
    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    Personal responsibility is a facade created by religious people in particular...
    On "Personal Responsibility just after the previous, in the same exact thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    Religion uses is as a tool, they did not create it.
    The wheels on the bus go round and round...round and round.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    You think that I am ill-equipped...hit me with your best shot Einstein, I am calling you out.


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    Free will is only slightly a conscious exercise...

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    Regular Member zekester's Avatar
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    Again,

    I agree 100%......

    But then again you do not live in a state the thinks that if you have a toenail out of place that they can get you for a felony.

    Now of course Ihave embelished this a bit.....ok...alot....and MO actually has pretty liberal gun laws, I am just saying......when MY legislators see news reports about the AK or AR in a public place they FREAK out....

    We are doing our best to pass a premption law, but for now, we are stuck with what we have.

    I will say again, this is nothing about ANYONE IN THEIR RIGHT TO CARRY WHAT EVER THEY HAVE THE RIGHT TO CARRY, this is about a little help form those that have the right to do so,to help those of us that do not.

    Yes it will take time, and yes I am asking alot.

    I am asking those that have a right to carry an AK or AR....to PLEASE...in the case of Missouri, which has no bearing on your life at the moment, to curtail an opendisplay of your constitutional right.

    I would never ask this upon ANYONE.....but then again you are not in my shoes at the moment.

    Great debate BTW>

    Z
    GOD gave me rights!!!....The Constitutuion just confirms it!!

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    So long as we cower at the feet of our oppressors, all will be well.
    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    Personal responsibility is a facade created by religious people in particular...
    On "Personal Responsibility just after the previous, in the same exact thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    Religion uses is as a tool, they did not create it.
    The wheels on the bus go round and round...round and round.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    You think that I am ill-equipped...hit me with your best shot Einstein, I am calling you out.


    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    Free will is only slightly a conscious exercise...

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    Regular Member zekester's Avatar
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    slowfiveoh wrote:
    So long as we cower at the feet of our oppressors, all will be well.
    Not exactly.....

    Well, Not at ALL....

    I am looking at the over all picture, and I cannot see wher an Ak or an Ar.....regardless of rights can propel this movement what so ever.

    The public preceptiion is what it is, correct or not.

    The public preception of these types of weapons, is a negative preception in regards to this cause.

    again....jmo
    GOD gave me rights!!!....The Constitutuion just confirms it!!

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    zekester wrote:
    Not exactly.....

    Well, Not at ALL....

    I am looking at the over all picture, and I cannot see wher an Ak or an Ar.....regardless of rights can propel this movement what so ever.

    The public preceptiion is what it is, correct or not.

    The public preception of these types of weapons, is a negative preception in regards to this cause.

    again....jmo
    So...

    You advocate for the carry of pistols, which has already caused unnecessary panic and illegal detainment/arrests, because of an ill-informed society and law enforcement.

    Is this correct?


    One guy got ripped out of a movie theater. He had just a regular ol wheel gun, and was sippin a soda and watching a movie when he got attacked, and unlawfully detained. Oh yeah, he was an Airman in our countries fine Air Force.

    Another was pulled over for a dinky-by-comparison 1911 on his hip, while riding a motorcycle.

    A man who served his country, and is a staunch advocate for RTKBA, is denied the possession of a basic pistol in California because his sheriff has way too much authority in whether he can, or cannot, conceal carry.


    Yet some dude somewhere, stepped out of his house with a gun on his hip.

    Frankly, I believe the smiling face of John Q Public, carrying around an AK or AR based pistol isn't a bad thing. It proves more than shooing them away until its safe.

    Just saying.


    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    Personal responsibility is a facade created by religious people in particular...
    On "Personal Responsibility just after the previous, in the same exact thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    Religion uses is as a tool, they did not create it.
    The wheels on the bus go round and round...round and round.

    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    You think that I am ill-equipped...hit me with your best shot Einstein, I am calling you out.


    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    Free will is only slightly a conscious exercise...

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    i think its better a gun is in a holster then slung over someone back

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    Regular Member zekester's Avatar
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    No sir....

    This is strictly about the carry of Long Guns, and yes the AK or AR in particular....

    The public will be "alarmed" persay, with any weapon if the are not familiar with it, but these type of weapons, the AK and AR, are more alarming than most.

    You have to admit that they are more of a military type weapon, therefore it will make the general public feel that there is a "military presence".....Is that what we wish to convey?
    GOD gave me rights!!!....The Constitutuion just confirms it!!

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    Regular Member zekester's Avatar
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    NavyLT wrote:
    zekester wrote:
    No sir....

    This is strictly about the carry of Long Guns, and yes the AK or AR in particular....

    The public will be "alarmed" persay, with any weapon if the are not familiar with it, but these type of weapons, the AK and AR, are more alarming than most.

    You have to admit that they are more of a military type weapon, therefore it will make the general public feel that there is a "military presence".....Is that what we wish to convey?
    Rest assured, zekester, that the very founders of this forum agree with you:

    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum1/1.html

    11) This web site is focused on the right to openly carry properly holstered handguns in daily American life. Do not start OFF TOPIC threads or discussions such aspromoting the carry of long guns. Long guns are great! OCDO co-founders John & Mike and most of the folks on this forum own at least one long gun - but due to urban area issues of muzzle control, lack of trigger guard coverage, and the fact that the long gun carry issue distracts from our main mission to promote the open carry of handguns in daily life, we will leave long gun carry activism in the capable hands of the future founders of web sites about long gun carry.
    THANK YOU ....THANK YOU......THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    And rest assured I personally have nothing against long guns, I was merley expressing the difficulty of our struggle at my level, and would like to have help and cooperation from all fronts.

    I hope to have not offended anyone. I surely hope that we are all in this together, for without that, we are nothing more than by ourselves.

    Z
    GOD gave me rights!!!....The Constitutuion just confirms it!!

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    Regular Member zekester's Avatar
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    Ok.....I will try to clarify...

    All I am saying, is with this movement....long guns and modifications should be an after thought.

    Handguns, at this moment whould be the focus....loaded or otherwise....

    Yes!!!!!!!!!! By all means fight the battle.....but please....and I am serious, please....expalin to me where an exposed AK47, slung on the back of someone, where the only place the general public has seen it is on TV in the hands of the terrorist, Al Queda...or other third world idiots, will EVER....and I mean EVER help this cause.

    They are scared enough...

    In your case, I should be able to carry a Stinger missle if I can leagally carry one...Not that you couldn't, but how does that help the states without a premption. It just makes us look bad when we try to change it in Missouri, where you could come here and carry a dang Stinger if you want to.

    But if you carry it now.....I won't, you wont....and no one else will either.....ANYWHERE

    Carry what ever you want, but untill we ALL can carry it together.....they will break us apart and tell us we can't even carry oru kids....



    GOD gave me rights!!!....The Constitutuion just confirms it!!

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    i want a rpg to open carry on the las vegas strip just so no one f#$%% with me

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    Regular Member Broondog's Avatar
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    can i still keep an AK in my truck for varmints and such?


    sorry, i couldn't resist.


    really though, i can just imagine the amount of cops that would show up if i decided to go grocery shopping with an underfolder slung across my back.


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    They're all the same to the anti's. If you"give up" the AK pistol,
    then they'll want you to "give up" something else and something else,
    until all that's left is swine's poison dart gun!

    Me personally, I don't care if you carry a bazooka.:P

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    I have no problem with someone towing a howitzer behind their vehicle to a BBQ, putting an AR/AK over their shoulder while buying groceries at Walmart or wearing their 1911 in a retention holsterat the cinema.

    As long as it's a lawful assembly in the first place, these all seem reasonable to me.

    Infringing is infringing, Once you start withone type of weapon, then someone will wish to add another. Then ammo. Then holster restrictions. Then caliber.

    "Shouldn't those cop-killer Five-Sevens be banned? Look what they did at Ft. Hood!"

    "That Brit cabbie killed 12 people with a .22 and a single shot shotgun! We should ban those since they are capable of so much carnage!"

    "Shoulder holsters are scary! We should only let plainclothes police officers, who are highly trained in their use, wear them."

    "Shouldn't belt holsters have buttoned flaps over them? That way they wouldn't be able to be drawn so quickly if there was an unpleasantness in progress..."

    Create a list and itwill most assuredly grow and grow and grow.


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    Campaign Veteran GLOCK21GB's Avatar
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    I know a guy that has one of them AK pistiols, made a cool kydex & Velcro holster for it. Technically it is a pistol & if it's holsered what are you going to say at your OC event...no sorry you can't bring that pistol in to this OC event ?? slippery slope people, once you start to discriminate against your own kind...your done for.

    Honestly, if that's the pistol you decide to Holster, I see nothing wrong with it. Yes, It will get looks but thats the nature of the beast.
    http://youtu.be/xWgVGu3OR4U AACFI, Wisconsin / Minnesota Carry Certified. Action Pistol & Advanced Action pistol concepts + Urban Carbine course. When the entitlement Zombies begin looting, pillaging, raping, burning & killing..remember HEAD SHOTS it's the only way to kill a Zombie. Stockpile food & water now.

    Please support your local,county, state & Federal Law enforcement agencies, right ???

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    Glock34 wrote:
    I know a guy that has one of them AK pistiols, made a cool kydex & Velcro holster for it. Technically it is a pistol & if it's holsered what are you going to say at your OC event...no sorry you can bring that pistol in to this OC event ?? slippery slope people, once you start to discriminate against your own kind...your done for.
    This site already does. I'm shocked this thread hasn't been locked yet. OH.... that's right it's anti long gun so that must be OK. Said it before say it again this site should be OCOHDO(Open Carry Of Handguns Dot Org).
    AUDE VIDE TACE

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    zekester wrote:
    Yes!!!!!!!!!! By all means fight the battle.....but please....and I am serious, please....expalin to me where an exposed AK47, slung on the back of someone, where the only place the general public has seen it is on TV in the hands of the terrorist, Al Queda...or other third world idiots, will EVER....and I mean EVER help this cause.
    The sky is falling, the sky is falling!

    Your premise is factually incorrect. Follow the link for proof... Unless you want us to believe this college educated grandma is a terrorist.

    http://news.yahoo.com/video/greenvil...ocial-20164693


    "The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun, is a good guy with a gun."

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    im an anti.......anti religion that is

    guns and bibles dont mix

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    Regular Member hopnpop's Avatar
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    VERY interesting talk here. I've been on the fence on the long OC topic. I think there are better times and places to OC long guns than others. I think that long arm OC is fine for, say, our OCDO picnics and 2Amarches... but have no business being carried into Ponderosa or IHOP. I believe that we should be able to legally OC long arms, but I think someone should use good judgement as to where and when they do so. Whoever said it's a slippery slope hit the nail on the head - it IS a slippery, hypocritical slope. I hate being hypocritical but I see the reactions that the carry of an AR or AK creates.

    I want OC to become commonplace, too. But the fact is that while we've been making wonderful progress in desensitizing the public to the sight of guns being OC'd, and holstered handguns are creating less and less concern... the sight of an AR or AK still scares the crap out of the masses. IMO, scaring the public isn't beneficial to our cause. And yes, I see the aspect that our "cause" isn't handgun-specific, which is where the hypocrisy comes in.

    Another thing that I think interesting is about perception. I've found it a little funny, actually, at how the public percieves these rifles. As an example, let's say I'm enjoying a meal at ___________, while OCing a Springfield XD-M with a spare magazine. No reaction from the restaurant patrons. Then someone walks in with an AR slung across his back. The sight of the AR causes people to feel uncomfortable and leave, and probably resulting in a couple of MWAG calls. Now, what I find funny is that between my XD-M and spare mag, I've actually got more firepower than the guy with the AR and only one 30-rd mag. But which causes fear and overreaction? The AR. I just think it ironic.

    Back to the point. I'm not firmly against long arm OC, but MY bottom-line is that there's better times and places to do it. I don't think it's a good idea to be walking into restaurants and convenience stores with it, while 2A marches, shoots, picnics are great places to long OC. That's my $.02.
    No one has ever walked away from a gunfight complaining that he brought too much ammo.

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