OT: Can a person shoot an armed Bounty Hunter ( Bail enforcement) that breaks in unannounced?

massivedesign · Jun 10, 2010

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END_THE_FED wrote:

yeah I think that's the case unless ones mom or dad "co signed" for the bond.

Not the case. If the skip is at a friends house, neighbors house, your house etc, and there is an arrest warrant issued, we could go in the house / structure / property. Doesn't matter who co-signed.

The co-signers are basically financially responsible for the bond/bail. If the skip cannot be found, then it defaults back to the co-signers to give the Bail Bondmen Company all the $$ they are out (plus penalties and fees).

It's a financial business... We have had co-signers give us the rest of the $$ in cash, which then ends their contract with the Bail Company. And the bail company releases interest in the warrant. it's actually pretty crappy, because the skip is still out there. But now it's the PD's problem to find him.

Some co-signers put a house on the line to get a child out, who then skips. I have seen and served many forced forclosures because of this... sad.

The only way a skip can be resolved (if you actually skip);
1) Get Caught
2) Turn yourself in
3) Have somebody buy out your contract (the remaining 90% of the $$)
4) Become deceased

END_THE_FED · Jun 10, 2010

imported post

massivedesign wrote:

END_THE_FED wrote:

yeah I think that's the case unless ones mom or dad "co signed" for the bond.

Click to expand...

Not the case. If the skip is at a friends house, neighbors house, your house etc, and there is an arrest warrant issued, we could go in the house / structure / property. Doesn't matter who co-signed.

The co-signers are basically financially responsible for the bond/bail. If the skip cannot be found, then it defaults back to the co-signers to give the Bail Bondmen Company all the $$ they are out (plus penalties and fees).

It's a financial business... We have had co-signers give us the rest of the $$ in cash, which then ends their contract with the Bail Company. And the bail company releases interest in the warrant. it's actually pretty crappy, because the skip is still out there. But now it's the PD's problem to find him.

Some co-signers put a house on the line to get a child out, who then skips. I have seen and served many forced forclosures because of this... sad.

The only way a skip can be resolved (if you actually skip);
1) Get Caught
2) Turn yourself in
3) Have somebody buy out your contract (the remaining 90% of the $$)
4) Become deceased

Correct me if im wrong but I was under the impression that if its the skips house or a cosigner you could basically go in it whenever you want(because he signed off on that when he got the bond), but if its another house you can still enter (because you have an arrest warrant) but you need to have RAS that the skip is in the house.
Basically I thought that you can go into the skips house because you wanna see if he is there, but if its another house you have to "know" ( or at least have RAS) that he is there.

Obviously if the law doesn't oblige this then common sense, respect, and the bondman's personal and business self interest does. (as you indicated earlier)

I was curious about something
Lets say a bondman puts up a bond for someone, lets say $100,000 and the guy skips.

A few days later the bondsman gets a cashiers check in the mail for $90,000 with a note indicating it is for the guys bail (or some one walks in with one). I would assume that the S.O.P at this point is the bondsman deposits the check, waits for the bank to verify its real, and then considers the matter closed. I was wondering, Is he under any legal obligation to accept the check? Could he decide he would rather see the guy go to jail and then just get the money back from the court? I know most of the time they would just take the cash but do they have to?

PT111 · Jun 10, 2010

imported post

I know of one case (involved one of my relatives) where a fellow was released on $250,000 bail. He posted the 10% personally and a friend signed a surety bond for the rest. On the day he was supposed to show up the friend walked into the judges office with $225,000 in cash. Cashiers checks won't do it, has to be cash.

massivedesign · Jun 10, 2010

imported post

END_THE_FED wrote:

massivedesign wrote:

END_THE_FED wrote:

yeah I think that's the case unless ones mom or dad "co signed" for the bond.

Click to expand...

Not the case. If the skip is at a friends house, neighbors house, your house etc, and there is an arrest warrant issued, we could go in the house / structure / property. Doesn't matter who co-signed.

The co-signers are basically financially responsible for the bond/bail. If the skip cannot be found, then it defaults back to the co-signers to give the Bail Bondmen Company all the $$ they are out (plus penalties and fees).

It's a financial business... We have had co-signers give us the rest of the $$ in cash, which then ends their contract with the Bail Company. And the bail company releases interest in the warrant. it's actually pretty crappy, because the skip is still out there. But now it's the PD's problem to find him.

Some co-signers put a house on the line to get a child out, who then skips. I have seen and served many forced forclosures because of this... sad.

The only way a skip can be resolved (if you actually skip);
1) Get Caught
2) Turn yourself in
3) Have somebody buy out your contract (the remaining 90% of the $$)
4) Become deceased

Click to expand...

Correct me if im wrong but I was under the impression that if its the skips house or a cosigner you could basically go in it whenever you want(because he signed off on that when he got the bond), Yes, but when on a hunt, you are required to have the warrant on you anyhow. but if its another house you can still enter (because you have an arrest warrant) but you need to have RAS that the skip is in the house. Yes again, as mentioned in earlier posts, you need to be very confident that person is in there.
Basically I thought that you can go into the skips house because you wanna see if he is there, but if its another house you have to "know" ( or at least have RAS) that he is there. RAS is different than "know". Yes, we would need to have some sort of verifiable information (vehicle out front, informant, visual etc). We didn't just go kicking random doors playing Duck, Duck, Goose.

Obviously if the law doesn't oblige this then common sense, respect, and the bondman's personal and business self interest does. (as you indicated earlier)

I was curious about something
Lets say a bondman puts up a bond for someone, lets say $100,000 and the guy skips.

A few days later the bondsman gets a cashiers check in the mail for $90,000 with a note indicating it is for the guys bail (or some one walks in with one). I would assume that the S.O.P at this point is the bondsman deposits the check, waits for the bank to verify its real, and then considers the matter closed. I was wondering, Is he under any legal obligation to accept the check? Could he decide he would rather see the guy go to jail and then just get the money back from the court? I know most of the time they would just take the cash but do they have to? It's up to the Bail bondsmen to choose their own policies. You bounce a check, it's not going to do anything but add a felony for check writer anyhow. And yes, at any time a Bondsman (and even a co-singer) can change a mind, it's called revoking the bond. Basically, the co-signer or bondsman is not comfortable having the person out there on their dime.

Answered as best I could, in RED.

END_THE_FED · Jun 11, 2010

imported post

Thats basically what I thought thanks

Josh Green Rock · Aug 3, 2015

It would be safe to assume that if a defendant fails to appear in court a warrant will be issued. I've been a Bail Bondsman In Las Vegas since 1997 and in my experience it is rare for a warrant not to be issued in that situation.As to notification of the warrant being issued, there is no legal obligation to do so. Such notifications may be made as a matter of courtesy or for the convenience of the court and law enforcement in hopes that the defendant will turn themselves instead requiring a fugitive recovery effort.

Difdi · Aug 4, 2015

Josh Green Rock said:
It would be safe to assume that if a defendant fails to appear in court a warrant will be issued. I've been a Bail Bondsman In Las Vegas since 1997 and in my experience it is rare for a warrant not to be issued in that situation.As to notification of the warrant being issued, there is no legal obligation to do so. Such notifications may be made as a matter of courtesy or for the convenience of the court and law enforcement in hopes that the defendant will turn themselves instead requiring a fugitive recovery effort.

You do realize you revived a thread that has been dead for five years? Now we have zombies to deal with...

Freedom1Man · Aug 4, 2015

Difdi said:
You do realize you revived a thread that has been dead for five years? Now we have zombies to deal with...

I would rather have a thread like this revived than many threads on the same question.

Maybe with updates on any law changes or cases that might answer the question better.

Sent from my SM-G386T using Tapatalk

golddigger14s · Aug 4, 2015

Just do a Joe Biden, two blasts from a double barrel. It's all good.

Phoenix David · Aug 4, 2015

amzbrady said:
How about a spin, What about the police barging into your house unanounced? We have all read news articles where the police have busted down the wrong door by misreading an address. What if they come busting in, in a group of five with shotguns, in reality what are you going to notice first, the uniform or the shotgun coming through the door.

IMO it's best to make that decision in your mind and not announce it.

Personally think I that most on the this board are law abiding persons and would not expect the police to bust down the door.

MSG Laigaie · Aug 5, 2015

Nite of the living thread

PT111 said:
Bounty Hunters tend to play a little rougher than police. :exclaim:

This is Truth.

Aaron1124 said:
amzbrady wrote: I think it's incredibly unprofessional. How do you get a wrong address? That's not just a minor error. If that has happened, I hope the citizens filed a major lawsuit.

As said above, it happens all the time. Will it happen to you? Who knows? People make mistakes, sometimes deadly mistakes.

massivedesign said:
Back when I did it, the WACJTS didn't regulate us. and, well, it's a hell of a rush!

I always wore a vest with BIG letters on it. We did not inform LEOs until the raid was about to start. In Arkansas the LEOs would steal your pickups.

I am not a criminal. That said.........
Nobody knows who, or when they may come through your door and it matters not. When/if they come you may concede defeat and raise your hands and yield.
I have committed no crime (that I know of, there may be many) I am not "on bail". Unless I see a BUNCH of LEO vehicles in my driveway, there may be a bit of a firefight. I will accept a polite knock at the door, but not a rush raid.

So much has been said about this' a simple use of the search function will give you much info

Stretch · Aug 5, 2015

Bail bondsman arrested in Clark County for kidnapping...2014

http://www.columbian.com/news/2014/apr/17/three-arrested-fugitive-recovery-operation-gone-wr/

2015 Trial and Verdict:

http://www.columbian.com/news/2015/apr/14/vancouver-bail-bond-agent-found-guilty/

2015 Sentencing:

http://www.columbian.com/news/2015/apr/29/vancouver-bail-bondsman-sentenced-to-15-years/

leitung · Aug 21, 2015

massivedesign said:
sudden valley gunner wrote:

No, I would not have blamed them.... At no time during this thread have I said that people in the profession are immune, nor would I ever expect that. My main point was that "most" people in this profession will do TONS of due diligence to determine if a person of interest is behind that door. Any person who doesn't is careless and most likely to put himself in a very bad situation.

Back when I did it, the WACJTS didn't regulate us. We didn't have to go to a long training mini-boot camp. We did our own training, created our own policy and had a very good lawyer on retainer. Back then, there were a lot of people hunting, who should not have been. We got our contracts from the Bail Bondsmen and were an agent of them (and them only).

And, just to give you an idea... The cut (when we did it) was minimal.. If you had a bail of $10,000, the person only needed to put up 1k to the bail bondsmen, who would then put up the rest to release the person (the 1k is not refundable to the original person). When the accused returns to court etc, the bond is refunded back to the bondsmen and that 1k is his profit!! Now, if you skip, he is out 9k.. He hires us and gives us 10% of the OP's amount.. So, a 10k bail would net us $100 whopping bucks. Now, granted, 100k bail would give us 1k, but those didn't come very often.

All in all, in all the years of doing it (part time, evening weekends) our company made a profit of...... $20, total. After all the gas, meals insurance etc were paid.. $20... We didn't do it for the $$, we did it to protect the victims, to keep our neighborhood safe, and, well, it's a hell of a rush!

Exactly why I do it, for the rush and to get bad guys off the streets. None of the people I have gone after were ever "good people who made a mistake", most of these *** holes were serial and chronic offenders who don't give a darn about the justice system, innocent people, e.t.c. Most of them were dangerous, violent, thieves, drug users, pushers, e.t.c.

Yes, the supreme court ruled we can break into the defendants home to re arrest him and bring him up in the bondsman's discharge. It's also part of any bail contract. When you get out on bond, you are delivered to the custody of the surety. That means the bond company owns your butt.

In practice, my team never forces entry. Why?

1) It's dangerous as hell (obviously)
2) Liability
3) There is usually always a better way to handle it if your smart.

Yes, if you are on bond, we break into your house to get you, you shoot at us, chances are your going to get in more trouble, if not killed.

sudden valley gunner · Aug 21, 2015

leitung said:
Exactly why I do it, for the rush and to get bad guys off the streets. None of the people I have gone after were ever "good people who made a mistake", most of these *** holes were serial and chronic offenders who don't give a darn about the justice system, innocent people, e.t.c. Most of them were dangerous, violent, thieves, drug users, pushers, e.t.c.

Yes, the supreme court ruled we can break into the defendants home to re arrest him and bring him up in the bondsman's discharge. It's also part of any bail contract. When you get out on bond, you are delivered to the custody of the surety. That means the bond company owns your butt.

In practice, my team never forces entry. Why?

1) It's dangerous as hell (obviously)
2) Liability
3) There is usually always a better way to handle it if your smart.

Yes, if you are on bond, we break into your house to get you, you shoot at us, chances are your going to get in more trouble, if not killed.

That post may need to be redone. Those quoted words are not mine.

Drug users are bad guys?

Supreme court has ruled many things, they suck ass.

You do it for the rush. Not the type of person I'd want bringing people to justice.

The house is a castle, if you get shot don't blame the folks in the house you entered. If you killed over a silly warrant......bad form.

TedBundo · May 3, 2017

tannerwaterbury said:
Thanks for all the answers guys! Funny thing is, this thought crossed my mind while watching an episode of Dog the Bounty Hunter :lol:

I actually just checked the Florida statutes. It says in there (word for word) that "anybody is allowed to shoot a bail bondsman with their gun when they enter your home, provided that it is Dog the Bounty Hunter". That's not true but maybe it is? What? I'm confused. Totes McGotes

countryclubjoe · May 9, 2017

Regarding a 7 year old topic..

Brings to mind the best western movie ever made, in my humble opinion.. The Outlaw Josey Wales..

Bounty hunter to Josey Wales, there's a price on your head, a guy needs to make a living..

Josey Wales to bounty hunter,, DYING ANT MUCH OF A LIVING BOY!..

Bounty hunters are probably a necessary evil, while they are not required to follow the dictates of the constitution, should they decide to be judge, jury and executioner, they should also be expected to be shot down like a dog for such actions.. Dying ant much of a living, Boy..

My .02
Regards
CCJ

MSG Laigaie · May 9, 2017

Welcome to OCDO Ted. Yeah, you might get a flame or two for resurrecting the dead that was resurrected from the dead by someone else. They will get over it.

solus · May 9, 2017

did you read the latest reviver's post...

speaking of flamers, it might be the FL poster enjoys his spam flame grilled!

ipse

F350 · May 9, 2017

Hef said:
amzbrady wrote:
If you are honestly unaware that the "home invaders" you are shooting at are really LEO's, you aren't committing a crime by defending your home. If you know they're cops and you're shooting anyway, you're committing a crime.

No matter what the truth is, the legality of your actions will be decided in court.

Probably not; because likely YOU'LL BE DEAD!

OT: Can a person shoot an armed Bounty Hunter ( Bail enforcement) that breaks in unannounced?

massivedesign

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END_THE_FED

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PT111

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massivedesign

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END_THE_FED

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Josh Green Rock

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Difdi

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MSG Laigaie

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Stretch

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leitung

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sudden valley gunner

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TedBundo

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F350

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