Just Got Kicked Out of Valero Cornerstore in Falcon

The first encounter can be chalked up to the clerk being a hoplophobic numb skull.

The second identical encounter establishes a pattern of harassment - I'd seek his dismissal of employment.

Are these stores franchised or Corp. owned?

Sounds like it's time to pick a day when this tool is working and have about 15 guys/gals come in OCing and purchase items.

I don't know if I will seek his dismissal, I don't want anyone to have to try to find a job in this economy. But I'm not necessarily opposed to it at this point if it's the only way to avoid confrontations like this.

As far as them being a franchise or corporate, I'm assuming that it's corporate as the 1-800 number routes the call to a Texas center when you call, but I'm not 100% certain. I think scheduling a day to go into the store would probably be a bit of a problem as I've only ever seen the guy there at night.

The only advice I would offer is to get receipts from other stores, collect from your friends also. Make copies and send them to the store owner. Tell him that the totals represent money you have spent at his store, but (Enter store employees name) doesn't want you carrying a gun in the store which is legal under Co law. Tell the owner you would prefer to spend your money at a local store but you will not leave yourself, your family or your friends unprotected just to make a few convenient purchases. Then add that you and your friends will be more than happy to patronize his store if he changes his store policy to allow self-defense. Money speaks louder than words.

My son lived in Falcon for several years and that's why I stopped by to read the post.

I have e-mailed Valero's corporate office in San Antonio, informing them that an employee of this store has invoked a policy requiring customers to surrender their right under Colorado law to be armed for their personal safety as the price for transacting business at that location. Since it is Valero's policy not to provide any effective security to ensure the safety of its customers and employees, I will take my business elsewhere in the future.

Who are these customers that are allegedly being scared away - armed robbers ?

i wonder if the regional manager didnt talk to the guy behind the counter before you went in a second time, if he was already reprimanded once for his behavior he should be fired not listening to his manager but if he didnt hear anything about it and was just being his same old rude, arrogant self then he needs to be educated not terminated IMO...


And whats with everyone saying they are going to bring their guns over there just because they know it will cause a problem? Doesnt this go against advancing the cause? Do you really want antigun people to be saying "Yeah these gun nuts will all group up and show up to scare people with their guns if we say anything to them!"?

I mean if you stop at a store you know you may have a problem at because its convenient and you need to go out of your way to find another one then thats a different story.... but going out of your way to go to a store where you know you may have a problem is just silly and immature, and also dangerous because you are placing yourself in a situation where there could be a police response, which could lead to a few dead people... All because someone wanted to "test the waters" at a place they new they wouldnt be welcome...

Its one thing to stand up for yourself and your rights but its another thing entirely to go out of your way in hopes of getting some action.

Agreed. Instigating a confrontation is not going to advance respect for the RTKBA.

Let the $$$$'s flow elsewhere. "Shell" is better gas anyway ! Better gas - and probably cheaper than Valero.

Well, just got the call from Phil this time. He said "It's not a problem if law abiding citizens carry in the store, but at night when there are more problems with people getting robbed, maybe you should leave the gun in the car." I told him that I wouldn't be giving my business to the company anymore and that it was unfortunate. He apologized, but continued to say that it was his job to protect his employees and that it would be better left in the car. I explained that I wasn't going to leave myself or my family unprotected to appease anyone and he said that he understood but that it would be better left in the car still.

I'm not sure what to do from here, his argument was that even though you may be a law abiding citizen, the clerks don't know that.

I wouldn't pursue it further. Management apparently doesn't want his customers being exposed to non-LEO holstered firearms. C-Stores are a bit of a sensitive environment anyway , given that they are the "quintessential" choice of armed robbers. This way any armed robbers in the neighborhood won't be subjected to the alarming sight of LAC's walking in and out of the C-Store when they are trying to concentrate on their work.

I think now that it has risen to the confrontational stage, I would just take my business somewhere else. C-stores are unfathomable. They are all essentially "Shop 'n Pray" 's that they don't get robbed while you are in there. It's unfortunate that folks fail to comprehend that the no-gun policy is not applicable to criminals.

Also - you have been "tagged" -so to speak - and unless this operation wants to take issue with every lawfully armed customer that walks through their door - you have accomplished something by bringing the issue to a head. Let management of that store digest this experience, and perhaps their position will ease-up in the future.

That's pretty much what I planned to do. I won't be using their services any longer and I informed them of that. I fully intend to avoid them like the plague until something is done. I never have a problem with Safeway in Falcon and have been thoroughly welcomed by the Loaf 'n' Jug in Calhan so that is where my money will stay. Thanks for the support guys, this site has given me the skill set and information I need to handle these kinds of encounters. Not trying to detract from this company, but as I told Phil, I won't leave myself or family unprotected, not matter who it may offend.


However, while I doubt any other stores would have a problem with it, I do advise caution when using Valero stores as it appears that Phil is the regional manager and oversees the stores in Colorado. I may be under the wrong impression and it may just be in the Springs area, but I still think that a certain level of caution is warranted considering some of the clerks viewpoints.

ZackL said:

His exact words were "You can't do that without a permit and then you have to conceal it!"

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I once met such a moron at a recent store who apparently had no less of an understerstanding of Local, Federal, or State law than the Valero Cornerstone Facon dude.

WHAT a tool. This guy, a block from where I live, apparently is, well.

Whatever. Their stores, but mine and my friends' choice to shop elsewhere.

Last I figured, I spent about $17 a week at one of the stores. That might "only" be less thant $1,000, but multiply times the thousands of us who freqent this website ((if you haven't a clue, yet grab the stats at the bottom of the page.

:banghead:

Sorry, too late for you. I don't award winner's of the Darwin Awards.

NEXT!!!

Really. I'm getting sick and tire of people's idiocy out there. Our entire Constitution is available on many websites, and our CRS are available on Michies.

I think that the most important thing to remember is that it's nevera fight of the wills. It's simply a fight for our rights. When well-intentioned but sublimal ideas attempt to rob of us of those rights, people lose lives.

Wait a minute. I've read this thread several times before and a question finally popped into my mind. If they don't allow OC on their property, that's fine, their property they can do anything they want. However if they only 'allow' concealed carry, they are in effect giving you permission to conceal carry on their property, correct? Even if one does not have a ccw, you can legally conceal on private property with owners permission, correct? So if you're oc'ing and told not to, you can coverup, right?

ZackL said:

Well, I just talked to the store manager and a customer service rep at corporate. The rep was unsure of the rule, she seemed to think that it was more in line with state law. However, she was in Texas and only had concealed to go off of. The manager said that it was corporate policy to only allow concealed weapons in the store.

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bogidu said:

Wait a minute. I've read this thread several times before and a question finally popped into my mind. If they don't allow OC on their property, that's fine, their property they can do anything they want. However if they only 'allow' concealed carry, they are in effect giving you permission to conceal carry on their property, correct? Even if one does not have a ccw, you can legally conceal on private property with owners permission, correct? So if you're oc'ing and told not to, you can coverup, right?

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You better get that in writing first!

YES - Valero's HQ is in SAN ANTONIO, TEXAS. Management apparently does not appreciate the fact that TEXAS LAW does not accompany their operations North of the Red River. How about some RESPECT FOR COLORADO LAW !

The arrogance of this company to substitute TEXAS LAW for COLORADO LAW - WHILE DOING BUSINESS IN COLORADO !

I don't frequent Valero fuel-stops in Colorado or Texas because their gas is inferior to Shell, while usually more expensive.

ZackL said:

Well, just got the call from Phil this time. He said "It's not a problem if law abiding citizens carry in the store, but at night when there are more problems with people getting robbed, maybe you should leave the gun in the car."

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Uhhhh....that's precisely when I *don't* leave my gun in my car!

bogidu said:

Wait a minute. I've read this thread several times before and a question finally popped into my mind. If they don't allow OC on their property, that's fine, their property they can do anything they want. However if they only 'allow' concealed carry, they are in effect giving you permission to conceal carry on their property, correct? Even if one does not have a ccw, you can legally conceal on private property with owners permission, correct? So if you're oc'ing and told not to, you can coverup, right?

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If the property is not posted against the carrying of firearms, then you're free to CC there under Colorado state law, provided you have a CHP.

They can still request you open jackets, purses, etc., but they cannot, legally, demand it, but they can make your compliance a condition of entry. If you refuse, you're free to leave. <--- I would consider this tact economic suicide, as gas stations/convenience stores are prolific.

If they discover you're carrying anyway, and they ask you to leave, that's best, for if you refuse, then you're criminally tresspassing.

mahkagari said:

Uhhhh....that's precisely when I *don't* leave my gun in my car!

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No kidding! However, this underscores the mindset most sheeple have towards guns. Ba-aa-aa...

Ok, but for someone who does not have a CHP, concealed carry is still legal on private property with the owners permission. In this scenario the employee seems to authorizing non-chp holders to 'coverup'.

since9 said:

If the property is not posted against the carrying of firearms, then you're free to CC there under Colorado state law, provided you have a CHP..

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I don't think that's actually the case. While he wants LAC's to cover up, it would be impossible for him to affirm that you can carry on the store property as, while it is still private property, it is in the public domain and therefore you must abide by the laws governing public areas. This is, as always, just my interpretation of the laws and case law, but I do think that it would be illegal to conceal, even with permission as you're not working there.

ZackL said:

...it is in the public domain...

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The legal term is "semi-public space." This is private property, whether Wal-Mart, Starbucks, or a movie theater, that's generally open to public use, provided they're paying customers.

...therefore you must abide by the laws governing public areas.

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Absolutely, which is why Starbucks, Wal-Mart and others who allow open carry respond to requests about whether or not they allow open carry by saying "We adhere to the local and state laws."

This is, as always, just my interpretation of the laws and case law, but I do think that it would be illegal to conceal, even with permission as you're not working there.

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So long as we're in a semi-public space, we must adhere to local and state laws, regardless of what the owner says.