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Thread: Can non residents OC in MI?

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    Last edited by sonic; 03-31-2011 at 10:05 AM.

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    sonic wrote:
    I live in Ohio and just started OC'ing.* I make trips up into Michigan to see my folks a few times a year and wondered if I am legal to OC out of state.* I do not have a CC permit.
    Does Ohio give you any type of permit at all?

    If not, no carry.

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    sonic wrote:
    I live in Ohio and just started OC'ing. I make trips up into Michigan to see my folks a few times a year and wondered if I am legal to OC out of state. I do not have a CC permit.
    Is the gun registered in your state or do you meet the requirments of (8)? If so you can carry under this statute.

    28.422 License to purchase, carry, possess, or transport pistol; issuance; qualifications; applications; sale of pistol; exemptions; nonresidents; basic pistol safety brochure; forging application; implementation during business hours.Sec. 2.
    (1) Except as otherwise provided in this section, a person shall not purchase, carry, possess, or transport a pistol in this state without first having obtained a license for the pistol as prescribed in this section.

    MISSING PORTION

    (8) An individual who is not a [highlight= #88ffff]resident[/highlight] of this state is not required to obtain a license under this section if all of the following conditions apply:
    (a) The individual is licensed in his or her state of residence to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol.
    (b) The individual is in possession of the license described in subdivision (a).
    (c) The individual is the owner of the pistol he or she possesses, carries, or transports.
    (d) The individual possesses the pistol for a lawful purpose as that term is defined in section 231a of the Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.231a.
    (e) The individual is in this state for a period of 180 days or less and does not intend to establish residency in this state.
    (9) An individual who is a nonresident of this state shall present the license described in subsection (8)(a) upon the demand of a police officer. An individual who violates this subsection is guilty of a misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment for not more than 90 days or a fine of not more than $100.00, or both.

    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    Please, no one start an ethics argument based on this. But your only legal and preempted by state law option is to carry a long gun. This causes a web of legal restrictions to be aware of, and police most certainly would be more likely to hassle you, but it can be done by an unlicensed non resident, so it's a lawful option you have.

    Other modes of self defense such as knives and eye irritant spray are legal in some places, and banned in others because there is no state preemption on anything but guns.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

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    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
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    sonic wrote:
    Ohio has no permit to open carry, only CC requires a permit.
    It doesn't have to be a license to carry. Does OH license you to purchase or transport pistols? That counts too.

    Bronson
    Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. Thomas Paine

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    sonic wrote:
    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    sonic wrote:
    I live in Ohio and just started OC'ing.* I make trips up into Michigan to see my folks a few times a year and wondered if I am legal to OC out of state.* I do not have a CC permit.
    Does Ohio give you any type of permit at all?

    If not, no carry.
    You must obtain a permit for CC but for OC there is nothing.* Just need to make sure you are legal to own a handgun....* 21yrs old and have had a background check.* I just need to know if MI lets out of state people open carry while in MI.* Does Mi require a permit to OC?
    As an out-of-stater, You must have some sort of permit to carry a handgun in MI.

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    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
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    sonic wrote:
    Does Mi require a permit to OC?
    MI doesn't license OC but it does require you to be licensed to purchase, carry, or transport the pistol in order to OC.

    (a) The individual is licensed in his or her state of residence to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol.


    So in your instance you are out of luck. With no concealed license from OH you obviously cannot CC here and without some type of license that shows you are legally allowed to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol then you also cannot OC. As an exapmple, Illinios requires itsresidents to obtain a FOID card which allows them to purchase firearms and ammunition but it does not allow them to carry the firearm. In MI this FOID card would allow an IL resident to OC one of their legally owned pistols since it qualifies as a license to purchase.

    Bronson
    Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. Thomas Paine

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    sonic wrote:
    I live in Ohio and just started OC'ing. I make trips up into Michigan to see my folks a few times a year and wondered if I am legal to OC out of state. I do not have a CC permit.
    Since Ohio doesn't have a registration, then you can get either an Ohio CPL or a out of state permit and then you would be okay in Michigan with both CC and OC.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    Venator wrote:
    sonic wrote:
    I live in Ohio and just started OC'ing.* I make trips up into Michigan to see my folks a few times a year and wondered if I am legal to OC out of state.* I do not have a CC permit.
    Since Ohio doesn't have a registration, then you can get either an Ohio CPL or a out of state permit and then you would be okay in Michigan with both CC and OC.
    No.

    The permit has to be from his home state to be valid in MI. Michigan only honors resident permits.

    (a) The individual is licensed in his or her state of residence to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol.
    (b) The individual is in possession of the license described in subdivision (a).

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    zigziggityzoo wrote:
    Venator wrote:
    sonic wrote:
    I live in Ohio and just started OC'ing. I make trips up into Michigan to see my folks a few times a year and wondered if I am legal to OC out of state. I do not have a CC permit.
    Since Ohio doesn't have a registration, then you can get either an Ohio CPL or a out of state permit and then you would be okay in Michigan with both CC and OC.
    No.

    The permit has to be from his home state to be valid in MI. Michigan only honors resident permits.

    (a) The individual is licensed in his or her state of residence to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol.
    (b) The individual is in possession of the license described in subdivision (a).
    Aah, he could only OC then.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
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    Venator wrote:
    Since Ohio doesn't have a registration, then you can get either an Ohio CPL or a out of state permit and then you would be okay in Michigan with both CC and OC.
    Is it the registration that's needed or some type of licensure to purchase, carry, or transport? I don't see registration without licensure meeting the requirements that MI has.

    Also,good luckfinding a state that will issue a non-resident permit if you don't already have a resident permit from your home state (if they are available).I didn't check all of the states so there may besome that will issue anon-resident permit if you don't have a resident permit...but I didn't happen to run across them.

    Bronson
    Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. Thomas Paine

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    Bronson wrote:
    Venator wrote:
    Since Ohio doesn't have a registration, then you can get either an Ohio CPL or a out of state permit and then you would be okay in Michigan with both CC and OC.
    Is it the registration that's needed or some type of licensure to purchase, carry, or transport? I don't see registration without licensure meeting the requirements that MI has.

    Also,good luckfinding a state that will issue a non-resident permit if you don't already have a resident permit from your home state (if they are available).I didn't check all of the states so there may besome that will issue anon-resident permit if you don't have a resident permit...but I didn't happen to run across them.

    Bronson
    That is what the statue suggests.

    A few states issue non-resident CPLs without one from your state. I know Flordia does.

    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

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    Michigan does not recognize non resident out of state CC permits.

    FYI for Illinois people with FOID cards.

    Mr

    MCL 28.422 was recently amended to exempt residents of other states from pistol registration requirements (allowing them to possess a pistol in Michigan) if all of the following requirements are met:

    1. The person is licensed by their state of residence to purchase, transport, or carry a pistol,

    2.The person is in possession of the license while in Michigan,

    3.The person owns the pistol possessed in Michigan,

    4.The person possess the pistol for a lawful purpose as defined in MCL 750.231a, and

    5.The person is in Michigan less than 180 days and does not intend to establish residency here.

    A non-resident must present the license issued by their state to a police officer upon demand. Failure to do so is a 90-day misdemeanor.
    Before this amendment, only CPL holders from other states could lawfully possess a pistol in Michigan.

    You may transport the pistol in your vehicle as long as you are the registered owner of the firearm and the pistol is unloaded and in a closed case in the trunk of the vehicle. If the vehicle does not have a trunk, the pistol may be in the passenger compartment of the vehicle unloaded and inaccessible to the occupants of the vehicle. (MCL 750.231a)

    Also, "open carry" is legal in Michigan because there is no law prohibiting it. However, make sure you do not carry in and of Michigan's pistol/firearm free zones found in MCL 750.234d.

    Best Regards,


    Tpr. Chris Hawkins
    Michigan State Police
    Executive Division
    714 S. Harrison Rd
    East Lansing, MI 48823



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    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Before I begin, there are some here who would argue that your understanding is correct, some who would say that it is incorrect... I am presenting this information for educational purposes only. I am not a lawyer nor is this to be taken as "legal advice", just my opinion.

    The officer's statements are "mostly" true; Michigan does not recognize non resident out of state CC permits for an exception to the Concealed Carry law. http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?mcl-750-231a

    Additionally, he is correct that MCL 28.422 (Pistol Registration) was recently amended to exempt residents of other states from pistol registration requirements (http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?mcl-28-422)

    However, this is not the only place where an exemption to MCL 28.422 is given. Another exemption is given in MCL28.432... Link: http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?mcl-28-432 I've included the text below.

    So, since the law provides BOTH of the exceptions to MCL 28.422 (Pistol registration), it appears that with a NON_RESIDENT CPL, although you could not carry the pistol concealed, you could Open Carry and apparently would also be exempt form the OC place restrictions... see http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?mcl-750-234d


    MCL28.432, "Inapplicability of MCL 28.422; citation as “Janet Kukuk act”.
    Sec. 12.
    (1) Section 2 does not apply to any of the following:
    (a) A police or correctional agency of the United States or of this state or any subdivision of this state.
    (b) The United States army, air force, navy, or marine corps.
    (c) An organization authorized by law to purchase or receive weapons from the United States or from this state.
    (d) The national guard, armed forces reserves, or other duly authorized military organization.
    (e) A member of an entity or organization described in subdivisions (a) through (d) for a pistol while engaged in the course of his or her duties with that entity or while going to or returning from those duties.
    (f) A United States citizen holding a license to carry a pistol concealed upon his or her person issued by another state.
    (g) The regular and ordinary transportation of a pistol as merchandise by an authorized agent of a person licensed to manufacture firearms or a licensed dealer.
    (h) Purchasing, owning, carrying, possessing, using, or transporting an antique firearm. As used in this subdivision, "antique firearm" means that term as defined in section 231a of the Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.231a.
    (i) An individual carrying, possessing, using, or transporting a pistol belonging to another individual, if the other individual's possession of the pistol is authorized by law and the individual carrying, possessing, using, or transporting the pistol has obtained a license under section 5b to carry a concealed pistol or is exempt from licensure as provided in section 12a.
    (2) The amendatory act that added subsection (1)(h) shall be known and may be cited as the "Janet Kukuk act".


    History: 1927, Act 372, Eff. Sept. 5, 1927 ;-- CL 1929, 16761 ;-- CL 1948, 28.432 ;-- Am. 1964, Act 216, Eff. Aug. 28, 1964 ;-- Am. 2000, Act 381, Eff. July 1, 2001 ;-- Am. 2004, Act 99, Imd. Eff. May 13, 2004 ;-- Am. 2006, Act 75, Eff. July 1, 2006 ;-- Am. 2008, Act 195, Eff. Jan. 7, 2009
    Popular Name: CCW



    750.234d Possession of firearm on certain premises prohibited; applicability; violation as misdemeanor; penalty.
    Sec. 234d.
    (1) Except as provided in subsection (2), a person shall not possess a firearm on the premises of any of the following:
    (a) A depository financial institution or a subsidiary or affiliate of a depository financial institution.
    (b) A church or other house of religious worship.
    (c) A court.
    (d) A theatre.
    (e) A sports arena.
    (f) A day care center.
    (g) A hospital.
    (h) An establishment licensed under the Michigan liquor control act, Act No. 8 of the Public Acts of the Extra Session of 1933, being sections 436.1 to 436.58 of the Michigan Compiled Laws.
    (2) This section does not apply to any of the following:
    (a) A person who owns, or is employed by or contracted by, an entity described in subsection (1) if the possession of that firearm is to provide security services for that entity.
    (b) A peace officer.
    (c) A person licensed by this state or another state to carry a concealed weapon.
    (d) A person who possesses a firearm on the premises of an entity described in subsection (1) if that possession is with the permission of the owner or an agent of the owner of that entity.
    (3) A person who violates this section is guilty of a misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment for not more than 90 days or a fine of not more than $100.00, or both.

    History: Add. 1990, Act 321, Eff. Mar. 28, 1991 ;-- Am. 1992, Act 218, Imd. Eff. Oct. 13, 1992 ;-- Am. 1994, Act 158, Eff. Aug. 15, 1994

    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

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