Somebody here missing their gun in Milwaukee?

PavePusher · Jun 9, 2010

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QuikDrawMcGraw wrote:

This is NOT the first time an Open Carrier had a handgun taken at gunpoint. Numerous times across the country, that never hit the news. 1

This is exactly the point I have made in previous posts. CCW has its own advantages and this story clarifies one of them.

In high crme areas filled with brazen criminals, it is far better to CCW. IF you are going to Open Carry, you better have a CC handgun to get your OC handgun back. 2

1. If it "never hits the news", how do you know about it? Got any sources/links/stats for your assertion?

2. As should be common knowledge by now, CCW is ILLEGAL inWisconsin for the common Citizen. Did you miss the memo, or are you only here on vacation from your bridge?

Shotgun · Jun 9, 2010

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QuikDrawMcGraw wrote:

This is NOT the first time an Open Carrier had a handgun taken at gunpoint. Numerous times across the country, that never hit the news.

Much more commonly it's at LEO's gunpoint.

Shotgun · Jun 9, 2010

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JGEARHOBBER wrote:

I wonder if it was a Blackhawk Serpa?

I understand that it was, but that's largely irrelevant, as is the level of retention. For all it matters, it could have been locked in a safe, but when a person suddenly has a gun pointed at his head one tends to comply with whatever demands are made. As far as suggestions of Krav Maga and any other Kung fu-like moves, go ahead and take your chances if you want, you might get lucky.

professor gun · Jun 9, 2010

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Shotgun wrote:

JGEARHOBBER wrote:

I wonder if it was a Blackhawk Serpa?

Click to expand...

I understand that it was, but that's largely irrelevant, as is the level of retention. For all it matters, it could have been locked in a safe, but when a person suddenly has a gun pointed at his head one tends to comply with whatever demands are made. As far as suggestions of Krav Maga and any other Kung fu-like moves, go ahead and take your chances if you want, you might get lucky.

Have you spent any time studying Krav Maga or other disarm techniques? They are designed as a last ditch effort when you have no other alternatives. And Kung Fu is very different.

Shotgun · Jun 9, 2010

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professor gun wrote:

Shotgun wrote:

JGEARHOBBER wrote:

I wonder if it was a Blackhawk Serpa?

Click to expand...

I understand that it was, but that's largely irrelevant, as is the level of retention. For all it matters, it could have been locked in a safe, but when a person suddenly has a gun pointed at his head one tends to comply with whatever demands are made. As far as suggestions of Krav Maga and any other Kung fu-like moves, go ahead and take your chances if you want, you might get lucky.

Click to expand...

Have you spent any time studying Krav Maga or other disarm techniques? They are designed as a last ditch effort when you have no other alternatives. And Kung Fu is very different.

Yes. And the key phrase is "last ditch effort" no matter what your skill level or martial arts discipline or style. And hope your opponent is a noob. I doubt the guy in Milwaukee who knowingly robbed an armed individual was a noob.

Packer fan · Jun 9, 2010

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http://www.targetfocustraining.com/

I have been training with this just in case and it does work. I have shown my girls how to use the principles and I can't stop them. Well worth the money.

Yes, you may soil your pants but if you simply follow this guys advices and you will have a chance.

No, this is not a martial art it is straight street fighting or "violence." :what:

J.Gleason · Jun 10, 2010

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All for just less than $800.00.

The best thing people can do is get together with some people you trust and practice, practice, practice.

Using dummy guns or airsoft guns of course. Your brain and body learn by repetition.

It is safe and a fun way to spend the afternoon. You could even make this a weekly session and include something new every week.

Nothing good comes without hard work and effort.

McX · Jun 10, 2010

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in lieu of recent events, and other bits i am hearing, i have re-evaluated my condition 3 carry practice, and will now go to condition 1 with safety on. the ciminals ain't nice, so therefor it's no more mister nice guy for me either.:shock: and we all know damn well; the copy cats shall come!

paul@paul-fisher.com · Jun 10, 2010

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McX wrote:

in lieu of recent events, and other bits i am hearing, i have re-evaluated my condition 3 carry practice, and will now go to condition 1 with safety on. the ciminals ain't nice, so therefor it's no more mister nice guy for me either.:shock: and we all know damn well; the copy cats shall come!

I was just thinking that. I was 'assuming' I'd have time to pull my weapon, drop the safety and then rack the slide to chamber a round before I needed to be ready to shoot. Not so much it seems.

Wisconsin Carry Inc. - Chairman · Jun 10, 2010

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in lieu of recent events, and other bits i am hearing, i have re-evaluated my condition 3 carry practice

ditto

McX · Jun 10, 2010

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i requested my 'employee' here to carry condition 3 now too. 2 guns in the shop are better than one. he sees what i see, and did it immediately.

Wisconsin Carry Inc. - Chairman · Jun 10, 2010

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This is precisely why when we are out together my girlfriend and I BOTH carry.

A rogue brazen criminal can't put a gun to both of our heads.

She's got my back I've got hers. Our family will always be safe.

When we get a state-legislature that actually wants to protect Wisconsin residents and not criminals I'll likely carry 2 guns, one concealed.

In the meantime, blame for this incident lies with 3 entities. I'd say each EQUAL to blame. The Wisconsin Legislature, Governor Jim Doyle, and the thug criminal who committed this act.

Shotgun · Jun 10, 2010

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paul@paul-fisher.com wrote:

I was just thinking that. I was 'assuming' I'd have time to pull my weapon, drop the safety and then rack the slide to chamber a round before I needed to be ready to shoot. Not so much it seems.

As I've been saying in older posts, that's not a good assumption in my opinion. In view of the proximity of the participants in most gunfights, to assume you'll have both the time and space required to draw and chamber a round is taking a risk. Plus you'll more than likely need a free hand to rack the slide. Although it's possible to manipulate the slide against your belt, holster, shoe, or other object as we practice in one-handed reload drills-- if you're fending off an individual, you may not have a hand to spare, and trying to rack a slide against something while getting pounded or otherwise roughed up is going to be nearly impossible. That's why I prefer and recommend a firearm that is ready to shoot the instant it clears the holster.

scorpio_vette · Jun 10, 2010

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anybody ever wonder if this was staged to make us look bad??? just curious.

paul@paul-fisher.com · Jun 10, 2010

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scorpio_vette wrote:

anybody ever wonder if this was staged to make us look bad??? just curious.

That's an awfully big risk. The perp could of gotten himself shot.

Wisconsin Carry Inc. - Chairman · Jun 10, 2010

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scorpio_vette wrote:

anybody ever wonder if this was staged to make us look bad??? just curious.

Yes I wondered, no it wasn't staged.

bigdaddy1 · Jun 10, 2010

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I posted in the J/S that the whole story sounded fishy to me. How many people really fall for the can I have a cigarette ploy? I dont know if anyone here knows the man involved, but what happened to situational awareness? I think that the two men may have known each other. I am suspicious.

OCglock1988 · Jun 10, 2010

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if the OC would have ran for cover when the thug pulled his gun do you think the robber would have engaged him and shot him in the back? What if it was just a kid with a spraypainted pellet gun? what happens then?

Wisconsin Carry Inc. - Chairman · Jun 10, 2010

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OCglock1988 wrote:

if the OC would have ran for cover when the thug pulled his gun do you think the robber would have engaged him and shot him in the back? What if it was just a kid with a spraypainted pellet gun? what happens then?

I think no matter what a person answers from behind their keyboard across the internet, its a whole different mindset when you have a gun to your head.

I'll be honest (with myself and others) and say I don't know what I would do "for sure". I THINK I would assume he's probably going to shoot me anyway so I'd take my chances and NOT give up my firearm and distract him/stall just enough to give me an opportunity to engage him/protect myself.

But I'm sitting behind a keyboard. I think anything said behind a keyboard ought be taken with a grain of salt.

paul@paul-fisher.com · Jun 10, 2010

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Wisconsin Carry, Inc. - Chairman wrote:

I think anything said behind a keyboard ought be taken with a grain of salt.

+1

If you do the pre 9/11 hijacking response you give the person what they want and hopefully they go away. Post 9/11, there could be an ulterior motive so it might be better to fight back and get it over with out in the open instead of the perp now having 2 guns and forcing you to a more private setting to have his way with you.

Somebody here missing their gun in Milwaukee?

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