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Thread: OCed at Covington Fred Meyer and encountered...

  1. #1
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    Stopped by Fred Meyer with my wife at about 7:00 - 7:30 this evening to pick up some milk. Not a word from anybody, as usual. At least not yet. I paid for my milk, and went to leave, but as I was making my way toward the exit door (near the electronics section), I was stopped by a group of four Scotsmen, armed and OCing swords. They were all in kilts, too. One of the bunch approached me and acknowledged my firearm. He said "Nice Ruger, buddy" (In a fairly thick accent). I told him "Thanks!", while at the same time, being impressed that he was able to determine that it was a Ruger at the distance he was at. I also acknowledged his sword (well, dirk), as I'm an ancient weapons collector myself. The one who initiated conversation with me was carrying a dirk, in a sheath placed on his belt, where as the other three had what appeared to be broadswords, sheathed over their shoulder.

    We casually talked for about 5 minutes. He introduced himself and his "brothers" to me (not sure if they were his literal brothers, or good friends), and we chatted about firearms, swords, and weaponry in general. He asked me if I've ever gotten any grief from anyone while carrying out in public, and I told him only a couple of times, and that I actually just started openly carrying after a couple years of concealing. I told him that I felt it not only helped from a self defense stand point, but as a way to help non firearm owners to get accustomed to the idea and sight of open carry. They all agreed with me, and said that they actually get quite a bit of questioning (although more so from an inquisitive perspective rather than giving them grief).

    All in all, a very cool experience. I'm actually surprised we weren't approached by an employee, trying to figure out what we were up to. Not even sure if we were noticed, albeit being in front of the electronics department.

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    Modern and antique...bet that woulda been a nice sight to see....
    "And shepherds we shall be, for Thee, my Lord, for Thee.
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    It was definitely cool. It was a bit surreal at first, because it's honestly not something I see every day.

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    Regular Member amzbrady's Avatar
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    Better than vikings, looking to see whats in your wallet.
    If you voted for Obama to prove you are not a racist...
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    amzbrady wrote:
    Better than vikings, looking to see whats in your wallet.
    LOL That would have been great.

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    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
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    ...?

    I thot the RCWs said you couldn't carry a knife or sword with a blade over xxx in the first place?
    It is very wise to not take a watermelon lightly.

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    Metalhead47 wrote:
    ...?

    I thot the RCWs said you couldn't carry a knife or sword with a blade over xxx in the first place?
    No blade length restriction in the RCW's, but since knife laws aren't preempted, some cities have length restrictions.


    Edited to add: Covington does not appear to have any restrictions beyond those set by the state.
    No right is held more sacred, or is more carefully guarded, by the common law than the right of every individual to the possession and control of his own person, free from all restraint or interference of others, unless by clear and unquestionable authority of law. Union Pacific Rail Co. vs Botsford as quoted in Terry v Ohio.


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    Metalhead47 wrote:
    ...?

    I thot the RCWs said you couldn't carry a knife or sword with a blade over xxx in the first place?
    No RCWs on the blade length. It's something else we were talking about as well. They're aware of the cities they can't go to with their weapons. I know Seattle is one.

    I will post the RCWs in regards to blades and "dangerous weapons" in a few minutes

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    RCW 9.41.250Dangerous weapons — Penalty — Exemption for law enforcement officers.
    (1) Every person who:

    (a) Manufactures, sells, or disposes of or possesses any instrument or weapon of the kind usually known as slung shot, sand club, or metal knuckles, or spring blade knife, or any knife the blade of which is automatically released by a spring mechanism or other mechanical device, or any knife having a blade which opens, or falls, or is ejected into position by the force of gravity, or by an outward, downward, or centrifugal thrust or movement;

    (b) Furtively carries with intent to conceal any dagger, dirk, pistol, or other dangerous weapon; or

    (c) Uses any contrivance or device for suppressing the noise of any firearm,

    is guilty of a gross misdemeanor punishable under chapter 9A.20 RCW.

    (2) Subsection (1)(a) of this section does not apply to:

    (a) The possession of a spring blade knife by a law enforcement officer while the officer:

    (i) Is on official duty; or

    (ii) Is transporting the knife to or from the place where the knife is stored when the officer is not on official duty; or

    (b) The storage of a spring blade knife by a law enforcement officer.

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Basically, paragraph 1, subsection A states a list of weapons that cannot be possessed or carried at ALL, regardless of if it's openly or concealed. Subsection B states a list of weapons that cannot be carried in a manner that shows intent to conceal. You'll see that there is a list of a few weapons, followed by the term "or other dangerous weapons".
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    RCW 9.41.270Weapons apparently capable of producing bodily harm — Unlawful carrying or handling — Penalty — Exceptions.
    (1) It shall be unlawful for any person to carry, exhibit, display, or draw any firearm, dagger, sword, knife or other cutting or stabbing instrument, club, or any other weapon apparently capable of producing bodily harm, in a manner, under circumstances, and at a time and place that either manifests an intent to intimidate another or that warrants alarm for the safety of other persons.

    (2) Any person violating the provisions of subsection (1) above shall be guilty of a gross misdemeanor. If any person is convicted of a violation of subsection (1) of this section, the person shall lose his or her concealed pistol license, if any. The court shall send notice of the revocation to the department of licensing, and the city, town, or county which issued the license.

    (3) Subsection (1) of this section shall not apply to or affect the following:

    (a) Any act committed by a person while in his or her place of abode or fixed place of business;

    (b) Any person who by virtue of his or her office or public employment is vested by law with a duty to preserve public safety, maintain public order, or to make arrests for offenses, while in the performance of such duty;

    (c) Any person acting for the purpose of protecting himself or herself against the use of presently threatened unlawful force by another, or for the purpose of protecting another against the use of such unlawful force by a third person;

    (d) Any person making or assisting in making a lawful arrest for the commission of a felony; or

    (e) Any person engaged in military activities sponsored by the federal or state governments.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Paragraph 1 clearly states that it is unlawful for a person to carry, draw, display, or exhibit any dangerous weapon capable of producing bodily harm, in a way, and under circumstances that manifests an intent to intimidate, or warrants alarm. This is basically the general rule for all of the dangerous weapons that are not completely prohibited from carry all together. The law says the same thing for a blade, as it does a holster, and considering it's been considered that a firearm, secured in a holster, does not warrant alarm for safety of others. The same can be said for a sword, dirk, dagger. Again, you have to remember that it is unlawful to carry a dangerous weapon with intent to conceal.


    Of course, the exceptions outlined in this section are clearly straight forward.



    Disclaimer:

    All of this is my opinion as a private citizen of Washington State, and is my interpretation of the law to the best of my abilities.








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    Alright guys here is another question that I am sure has been covered here many times before. My sister in law has this little swiss army knife knock off that she carries. Is it okay for her to carry it while at her college? The thing can't have a blade longer than 2". How about pepper spray? As I am not a college student (and never have been), I do not know anything about colleges.

    I have a feeling I am going to be pretty irritated when I get the answer.....

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    Quilbilly wrote:
    Alright guys here is another question that I am sure has been covered here many times before. My sister in law has this little swiss army knife knock off that she carries. Is it okay for her to carry it while at her college? The thing can't have a blade longer than 2". How about pepper spray? As I am not a college student (and never have been), I do not know anything about colleges.

    I have a feeling I am going to be pretty irritated when I get the answer.....
    There are no State Laws that prohibit the carry of these items on college grounds. Colleges and Universities set their own rules. While the college may (or may not) have rules that prohibit the carry of these items, they are not unlawful to carry.

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    Thank you Aaron. I am checking out her college now.

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    Not a problem.

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    Aaron1124 wrote:
    Quilbilly wrote:
    Alright guys here is another question that I am sure has been covered here many times before. My sister in law has this little swiss army knife knock off that she carries. Is it okay for her to carry it while at her college? The thing can't have a blade longer than 2". How about pepper spray? As I am not a college student (and never have been), I do not know anything about colleges.

    I have a feeling I am going to be pretty irritated when I get the answer.....
    There are no State Laws that prohibit the carry of these items on college grounds. Colleges and Universities set their own rules. While the college may (or may not) have rules that prohibit the carry of these items, they are not unlawful to carry.
    Yes, the general rule that colleges go by is if you violate their policy you are asked to leave, and if you don't then they can file a criminal trespass against you.

    This is one of the big reasons why concealed weapons aren't allowed on most campuses. It's crap in my opinion.
    "War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself." -John Stuart Mill

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    Most "general rules" on campuses are written in the WAC's. Typically if you work for the school or attend classes there you can be fired or suspended/expelled if caught with prohibited items such as weapons.

    For the average citizen who does not work there nor attend classes, the criminal trespass issue would apply, and only then, if you refuse to leave when asked.

    This is the case with the UW. In fact, their WAC is very specific that if you are found to have a weapon on campus a "Uniformed, campus police officer" must ask you to leave. It would appear that no one else has the authority to do this on the UW campus.
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    Aaron1124 wrote:
    amzbrady wrote:
    Better than vikings, looking to see whats in your wallet.
    LOL That would have been great.
    LMAO

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    Metalhead47 wrote:
    ...?

    I thot the RCWs said you couldn't carry a knife or sword with a blade over xxx in the first place?
    Not if you're a Scotsman

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    Scotsmen are exempt!! lol

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    Aaron1124 wrote:
    Quilbilly wrote:
    Alright guys here is another question that I am sure has been covered here many times before. My sister in law has this little swiss army knife knock off that she carries. Is it okay for her to carry it while at her college? The thing can't have a blade longer than 2". How about pepper spray? As I am not a college student (and never have been), I do not know anything about colleges.

    I have a feeling I am going to be pretty irritated when I get the answer.....
    There are no State Laws that prohibit the carry of these items on college grounds. Colleges and Universities set their own rules. While the college may (or may not) have rules that prohibit the carry of these items, they are not unlawful to carry.
    If the college is a state or community school then they CANNOT restrict her from carrying pepper spray. RCW 9.91.160 subsection 2

    (2) No town, city, county, special purpose district, quasi-municipal corporation or other unit of government may prohibit a person eighteen years old or older, or a person fourteen years old or older who has the permission of a parent or guardian to do so, from purchasing or possessing a personal protection spray device or from using such a device in a manner consistent with the authorized use of force...............
    http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.91.160

    EDIT: to fix link
    A wise and frugal Government, which shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government.- Thomas Jefferson March 4 1801

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    Quilbilly wrote:
    Alright guys here is another question that I am sure has been covered here many times before. My sister in law has this little swiss army knife knock off that she carries. Is it okay for her to carry it while at her college? The thing can't have a blade longer than 2". How about pepper spray? As I am not a college student (and never have been), I do not know anything about colleges.

    I have a feeling I am going to be pretty irritated when I get the answer.....
    At my school (WWU), damn near every guy I know carries a locking folder with blade lengths from 2.5" - 4". I carry a 3" Kershaw folder everyday, and have been known to carry a SOG Seal Pup on my belt from time to time. Never had any troubles, and I've been doing it for three years now.

    There are no RCWs that restrict the carry of knives or pepper spray on campuses, and any regulation of those items on campus is dependent on the school.

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    Regular Member krazichinaman's Avatar
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    Aaron1124 wrote:
    Quilbilly wrote:
    Alright guys here is another question that I am sure has been covered here many times before. My sister in law has this little swiss army knife knock off that she carries. Is it okay for her to carry it while at her college? The thing can't have a blade longer than 2". How about pepper spray? As I am not a college student (and never have been), I do not know anything about colleges.

    I have a feeling I am going to be pretty irritated when I get the answer.....
    As mentioned it all depends on which college she goes to and their WACs and student codes. I was the the Students for Concealed Carry for Campus leader at the University of Washington - Seattle and had a few run in with the campus police. http://www.seattlepi.com/local/360420_guns24.html

    Long story short, they released this bulletin because of me.:celebrate

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    Interesting read

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