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Thread: courthouse procedure

  1. #1
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    I carry a CZ-52,( Yes I know it overpenetrates and etc but I have my reasons) I carry one in the chamber hammer down. not cocked. This is a single action gun. If I am going to check it at the courthouse what is the procedure and is there an unloading area?

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    correct me if I am wrong, but WA does not make provision for a weapons check at GOV facilities like some states do... so it would be dependent upon the municipality and the courthouse to determine when, if and where you could disarm and check your weapon.

    ... probably something you want to find out before you walk through the metal detectors...

    :what:



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    Semper Paratus wrote:
    I carry a CZ-52,( Yes I know it overpenetrates and etc but I have my reasons) I carry one in the chamber hammer down. not cocked. This is a single action gun. If I am going to check it at the courthouse what is the procedure and is there an unloading area?
    You don't have to if you don't want to. When I checked my firearm, they didn't care. Infact, they probably don't want you even fiddling around with it at all. Just put it in the lock box unless otherwise instructed. If you are asked to unload it, politely ask them what method they would feel comfortable with.

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    daddy4count wrote:
    correct me if I am wrong, but WA does not make provision for a weapons check at GOV facilities like some states do... so it would be dependent upon the municipality and the courthouse to determine when, if and where you could disarm and check your weapon.

    ... probably something you want to find out before you walk through the metal detectors...

    :what:

    All courts short of the Washington State Supreme court MUST provide either a lock box, or designated official within the court to keep and safely store your weapon during your visit to the court.


    RCW 9.41.300Weapons prohibited in certain places — Local laws and ordinances

    (1) It is unlawful for any person to enter the following places when he or she knowingly possesses or knowingly has under his or her control a weapon:

    ...
    ...
    ...

    (b) Those areas in any building which are used in connection with court proceedings, including courtrooms, jury rooms, judge's chambers, offices and areas used to conduct court business, waiting areas, and corridors adjacent to areas used in connection with court proceedings. The restricted areas do not include common areas of ingress and egress to the building that is used in connection with court proceedings, when it is possible to protect court areas without restricting ingress and egress to the building. The restricted areas shall be the minimum necessary to fulfill the objective of this subsection (1)(b).

    For purposes of this subsection (1)(b), "weapon" means any firearm, explosive as defined in RCW 70.74.010, or any weapon of the kind usually known as slung shot, sand club, or metal knuckles, or any knife, dagger, dirk, or other similar weapon that is capable of causing death or bodily injury and is commonly used with the intent to cause death or bodily injury.

    In addition, the local legislative authority shall provide either a stationary locked box sufficient in size for pistols and key to a weapon owner for weapon storage, or shall designate an official to receive weapons for safekeeping, during the owner's visit to restricted areas of the building. The locked box or designated official shall be located within the same building used in connection with court proceedings. The local legislative authority shall be liable for any negligence causing damage to or loss of a weapon either placed in a locked box or left with an official during the owner's visit to restricted areas of the building.

    The local judicial authority shall designate and clearly mark those areas where weapons are prohibited, and shall post notices at each entrance to the building of the prohibition against weapons in the restricted areas




    http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41.300


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    All courts short of the Washington State Supreme court MUST provide either a lock box
    I have heard this before, and it makes perfect sense to me... but I've never seen an actual statute or law requiring it...

    anybody know the RCW ?

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    Ha! There it is!

    Awesome, thanks...

    I've read that RCW before, but apparently not far enough!!!!!



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    daddy4count wrote:
    All courts short of the Washington State Supreme court MUST provide either a lock box
    I have heard this before, and it makes perfect sense to me... but I've never seen an actual statute or law requiring it...

    anybody know the RCW ?
    I am assuming the entire Washington State Supreme Court is used for court proceedings. I have not found an RCW that singled out the Washington State Supreme Court. Although, I did receive an email from Justice Alexander of Washington State Supreme Court and from a member of the Washington Legislature.


    "Dear Mr. Braun:

    In response to your e-mail message I can indicate that we do not currently maintain a lockbox for weapons here at the Temple of Justice. We have declined to provide a lock box for the following reasons:

    (1) This building is entirely a court facility and, therefore, pursuant to RCW 9.41.300(b) no one should be entering the building with a weapon.
    (2) The local legislative authority has not provided the court with a lock box.
    (3) The court’s receptionists are not law enforcement officers and, thus, would be uncomfortable handling weapons handed over to them by visitors to the building.

    Chief Justice Gerry Alexander
    WA State Supreme Court"
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    "Dear Aaron, Thank you for your inquiry. In response to your email, Rep. Upthegrove asked me to work with policy staff of the House Judiciary Committee to answer your question. It appears that the lock box requirement does not apply to the Supreme Court. The law is silent on courts that are not governed by a "local legislative authority." It would apply to counties (superior and district courts) and cities (municipal courts). The law does not distinguish between the Supreme Court and other locations "used in connection with court proceedings." Therefore, it would still be illegal to bring a weapon to the Supreme Court. I hope this is the information you need. Please don't hesitate to contact us if we can be of further assistance. Sincerely, _________________________________________ Rachel Smith Legislative Assistant to Rep. Dave Upthegrove"



    Then, I also received the following email:





    "The WA Supreme Court is not exempt from RCW 9.41.300 and there is a WAC, WAC 236-12-470 that prohibits a person from carrying a firearm on the capitol grounds or into any building located on the capitol grounds, including the WA Supreme Court.

    As we discussed, the language of RCW 9.41.300 provides that a person visiting a court with a concealed pistol license shall be provided with a place to store his or her weapon or the court shall designate a person with whom the person can safely leave his or her weapon. I was hoping to provide the constituent with the information regarding with whom he could leave his weapon when visiting the WA Supreme Court. Unfortunately, I was not able to get this information. The WSP has indicated that a person visiting the WA Supreme Court should leave his or her firearm locked in his or her car.

    Below is the text of the WAC I mentioned prohibiting weapons on campus.

    _____________________________________________


    WAC 236-12-470 Prohibiting access to state capitol buildings and grounds while armed with dangerous weapons or with devices used to disrupt state business.(1) No person shall carry any firearm or other dangerous weapon as described in chapter 9.41 RCW on the state capitol grounds or in any building on the state capitol grounds: Provided, That this regulation shall not apply to duly authorized federal, state, and local law enforcement officers or to any federal, state, and local government employee authorized to carry firearms in the course of their public employment; and: Provided, That a person may carry a firearm in accordance with chapter 9.41 RCW."




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    The last email I receive in which I posted, seemed that they didn't know the law, because it was highly incorrect.

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    and: Provided, That a person may carry a firearm in accordance with chapter 9.41 RCW.
    Um... I'm no lawyer so this is all Greek to me... but doesn't the last sentence pretty much nullify the previous ones?

    Or am I reading it wrong... because "carry a firearm in accordance with chapter 9.41" would imply to me that legal carry at the Capital is... legal.

    In accordance with 9.41 would be a CPL or open carry, yes?

    So nobody can carry a gun on Capital grounds... unless they are a cop, authorized state employee, or have a CPL?

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    Pretty sure it's all legal......


    Live Free or Die!

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    So nobody can carry a gun on Capital grounds... unless they are a cop, authorized state employee, or have a CPL?
    We have carried in the Capitol Building, on the grounds and even carried at one of the legislative session where Washington's Cease Fire head asked the State Patrol officer if they would check all the weapons to see if they were loaded. The officers reply "we have no legal authority to do that."



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    RIGHT ON

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    The law regarding the State Capital basically says that you cannot illegally carry a firearm on the property

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    Aaron1124 wrote:
    The law regarding the State Capital basically says that you cannot illegally carry a firearm on the property
    So you can't do illegal things? Genious! They should pass a law outlawingarmed robbery then!
    Live Free or Die!

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    gogodawgs wrote:
    Aaron1124 wrote:
    The law regarding the State Capital basically says that you cannot illegally carry a firearm on the property
    So you can't do illegal things? Genious! They should pass a law outlawing band robbery then!
    Why should bands have more protection than anyone else?
    No right is held more sacred, or is more carefully guarded, by the common law than the right of every individual to the possession and control of his own person, free from all restraint or interference of others, unless by clear and unquestionable authority of law. Union Pacific Rail Co. vs Botsford as quoted in Terry v Ohio.


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    Nice! Good posts! Great info guys!

    Thanks!
    Young Kim, NRA Endowment Member
    NRA Certified Instructor (pistol)
    NRA Range Safety Officer

    www.shootonthemove.org

    "Shoot Safetly, Shoot Often and Share Your Sport!"
    Jim Scoutten, Shooting USA

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    NavyLT wrote:
    Aaron1124 wrote:
    The law regarding the State Capital basically says that you cannot illegally carry a firearm on the property
    Washington State Ferries are also posted "No Illegal Firearms!"...
    Same with many public transit vehicles..

    Very interesting stuff. I wonder if it's labeled there to try and fool law abiding citizens who may not be aware of what it actually means.

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    Aaron1124 wrote:
    NavyLT wrote:
    Aaron1124 wrote:
    The law regarding the State Capital basically says that you cannot illegally carry a firearm on the property
    Washington State Ferries are also posted "No Illegal Firearms!"...
    Same with many public transit vehicles..

    Very interesting stuff. I wonder if it's labeled there to try and fool law abiding citizens who may not be aware of what it actually means.
    Yes and it makes the liberal politicians feel good.
    Live Free or Die!

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    Thank you for the information I need to go to the corthouse to get AZ documents changed to WA documents so I can get my ex-wifes name off my truck title.

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    My wife and I just went to the Kitsap court today to do her passport photo. I was wearing my usual Ruger Vaquero gunslinger rig. I just stuck my head in the door and said "Can i check my gun at the door please?" The gentleman came over and opened the little box, i placed it in, and he took my name and info to ensure it would be returned to the proper owner. After the pictures, they validated me as the signer of the box and arm, and I put My rig back on, holstered the Ruger, and out the door.

    - It was just that easy.

    Bat
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    You know, I want to get one of those cowboy rigs so bad...just way down the list after the 1911, P83, P64, Pa63, 2" .38 S&W....

    The other thought is to get a conversion cylinder for my .36 Navy....the balance on the Navy is just so nice.

  22. #22
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    The other thought is to get a conversion cylinder for my .36 Navy....the balance on the Navy is just so nice.
    ________________________________
    I just checked the price on that and they are a bit PRICEY.
    Perhaps if you would use a real computer you wouldn't have to apologize for not being able to do so many things on the internet!

  23. #23
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    Marys Pistols has a western rig for a 1911, however its a bit small for me.


    Then there is this rig....


  24. #24
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    yes, the cylinder is a bit pricey, but it's better than buying the whole pistol all over again, since I already have the Navy.

    Buffalo Arms company has then for $225 - $289, depending on which brand you go with.

    Of course, a Colt single action army (Cimarron brand) only runs $433....

  25. #25
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    Aaron1124 wrote:
    daddy4count wrote:
    All courts short of the Washington State Supreme court MUST provide either a lock box
    I have heard this before, and it makes perfect sense to me... but I've never seen an actual statute or law requiring it...

    anybody know the RCW ?
    I am assuming the entire Washington State Supreme Court is used for court proceedings. I have not found an RCW that singled out the Washington State Supreme Court. Although, I did receive an email from Justice Alexander of Washington State Supreme Court and from a member of the Washington Legislature.

    "Dear Mr. Braun:

    In response to your e-mail message I can indicate that we do not currently maintain a lockbox for weapons here at the Temple of Justice. We have declined to provide a lock box for the following reasons:

    (1) This building is entirely a court facility and, therefore, pursuant to RCW 9.41.300(b) no one should be entering the building with a weapon.
    (2) The local legislative authority has not provided the court with a lock box.
    (3) The court’s receptionists are not law enforcement officers and, thus, would be uncomfortable handling weapons handed over to them by visitors to the building.

    Chief Justice Gerry Alexander
    WA State Supreme Court"
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    "Dear Aaron, Thank you for your inquiry. In response to your email, Rep. Upthegrove asked me to work with policy staff of the House Judiciary Committee to answer your question. It appears that the lock box requirement does not apply to the Supreme Court. The law is silent on courts that are not governed by a "local legislative authority." It would apply to counties (superior and district courts) and cities (municipal courts). The law does not distinguish between the Supreme Court and other locations "used in connection with court proceedings." Therefore, it would still be illegal to bring a weapon to the Supreme Court. I hope this is the information you need. Please don't hesitate to contact us if we can be of further assistance. Sincerely, _________________________________________ Rachel Smith Legislative Assistant to Rep. Dave Upthegrove"


    Then, I also received the following email:

    "The WA Supreme Court is not exempt from RCW 9.41.300 and there is a WAC, WAC 236-12-470 that prohibits a person from carrying a firearm on the capitol grounds or into any building located on the capitol grounds, including the WA Supreme Court.

    As we discussed, the language of RCW 9.41.300 provides that a person visiting a court with a concealed pistol license shall be provided with a place to store his or her weapon or the court shall designate a person with whom the person can safely leave his or her weapon. I was hoping to provide the constituent with the information regarding with whom he could leave his weapon when visiting the WA Supreme Court. Unfortunately, I was not able to get this information. The WSP has indicated that a person visiting the WA Supreme Court should leave his or her firearm locked in his or her car.

    Below is the text of the WAC I mentioned prohibiting weapons on campus.
    _____________________________________________

    WAC 236-12-470 Prohibiting access to state capitol buildings and grounds while armed with dangerous weapons or with devices used to disrupt state business.(1) No person shall carry any firearm or other dangerous weapon as described in chapter 9.41 RCW on the state capitol grounds or in any building on the state capitol grounds: Provided, That this regulation shall not apply to duly authorized federal, state, and local law enforcement officers or to any federal, state, and local government employee authorized to carry firearms in the course of their public employment; and: Provided, That a person may carry a firearm in accordance with chapter 9.41 RCW."
    So....back on topic (despite the neat holsters and pics!)...it sounds like the assistant to Rep Dave Upthegrove andthe Honorable Chief Justice Gerry Alexander both"mis-spoke" whensaying the WA Supreme Court is pretty much exempt from the laws? The main reason to provide lock boxes is the fact that guns ARE prohibited in the Court!

    And wouldn't the "local legislative authority" for the Supreme Court be the WA Legislature and the WSP? Doesn't some "body or bodies" protect the Supremes, set the rules, finance the building and maintenance, etc?

    If the laws are so confusing that even a member of the Supreme Court can't evenunderstand them as others do, but I guess that is why the exist.

    Gary

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