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Open Carry? Not any more. For this guy.

oldkim

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Kent, Washington, USA
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Just goes to show that even an armed civilian isn't truly safe. Just means you need to stay on your toes but if a robber has the jump on you and your staring down the wrong end..... hmmm.

Lucky for him the robber didn't shoot him outright.

The robber knows going in it's a high risk robbery (man with gun). It definitely pushes up the risk factor for everyone involved. Meaningthe robbermust be willing to shoot since he knows you havea gun.

Situational awareness? I didn't see the situation of how he got robbed. Meaning under what conditions (dark, alone or secluded area, snuck up behind him, etc).

Goes to show that - someone that is going to commit a crime - sometimes there is no stopping it. Glad he made it alive.You can always buy another gun. I don't know about not everOC'ing.... But it's a personal choice as many will argue Pro/Con.

This is just one story. It's hard to get numbers on how many crimes have been deterred by someone that has OC'd. No hard numbers to compare.
 

BigDave

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This is a risk anyone of us face when we choose to carry and a strong reminder to never let down your guard down and seek training so we can prepare ourselves if it does happen.
 

USMC1911

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May 9, 2010
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OC'ing is one thing, being mentally prepared to react when the feces hits the oscillating machine is a whole other thing! I run "What If" scenarios every where I go and with everyone I meet along the way. It's not just a Boy Scout saying, it is a saying to live by, "Always be prepared" !
 

Son_of_Perdition

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SW , Washington, USA
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Hum?

Thinking out loud here... I wonderif a person could make a holster that looks like a wallet that completely conceals a little Kel Tec or derringer .45 ACP?If you were to be robed youcould pull out your wallet/Gun and put one threw their eye. The bad guy wouldn't be the wiser. He would just think you were going to give him your wallet?
 

G20-IWB24/7

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So, in the last two weeks, we've had examples of people not practicing situational awareness (as they should) and failing to conduct themselves in public in a manner that does not "warrant alarm for the safety of others." (Ruby's thread @ the Ben's Loans incident)

Lesson out of all of this....YOU CAN SCREW UP. These people did.

It just means that while OCing/CCing we all need to make sure we are well-aware of our surroundings andconducting ourselves in a manner that is beyond question in the eyes of 9.41.270.

If there's anything good go come out of these two instances, it shows the rest of us examples of what NOT to do...

-G20
 

Son_of_Perdition

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1245A Defender wrote:
i think there is a law against "wallet guns",, even with a CPL...
That's interesting. However, I didn't mean to imply that the wallet was a gun or that the gun was concealed in an actual wallet. Only that a holster for a vary small gun looks square and proportionally shaped like a wallet but in no way have any wallet like paraphernalia in it. Such as money, licence or credit cards. I thought that there wasn't a legal holster definition in regards to shape or size. But I could be wrong.
 

G20-IWB24/7

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Son_of_Perdition wrote:
1245A Defender wrote:
i think there is a law against "wallet guns",, even with a CPL...
That's interesting. However, I didn't mean to imply that the wallet was a gun or that the gun was concealed in an actual wallet. Only that a holster for a vary small gun looks square and proportionally shaped like a wallet but in no way have any wallet like paraphernalia in it. Such as money, licence or credit cards. I thought that there wasn't a legal holster definition in regards to shape or size. But I could be wrong.


[align=left]Sorry about the crappy cut/paste job, but this is what I found in an ATF newsletter dated 1997. If your gun can fire without being removed from the holster, it is an NFA item, but if you have to remove it first, it's just a pocket holster that prints like a wallet...[/align]

[align=left]http://www.atf.gov/publications/newsletters/ffl/ffl-newsletter-1997-08.pdf (page 5-6)[/align]

[align=left]WALLET GUNS[/align]


[align=left]ATF has received numerous inquiries regarding wallet guns and wallet holsters. As defined in section 5845(e) of the National Firearms Act (NFA), the term “any other weapon” includes certain concealable weapons. Various types of disguised weapons such as cane guns, belt buckle guns, and briefcase guns (with remote control firing mechanisms) fall within the “any other weapon” category. It is unlawfil to make, possess, or transfer such firearms without complying with the provisions of the NFA.[/align]

[align=left]During the 1970’s, ATF determined that various small handguns combined with certain “wallet holsters” fall into the “any other weapon” category and are subject to the provisions of the NFA. These wallet holsters are generally rectangular in shape, are designed to disguise the appearance of the handgun, and are designed to allow the weapon to be fired while it is contained within the wallet. The handgun combined with the wallet holster constitutes an NFA firearm.[/align]
[align=left]A conventional pistol or revolver which is possessed without the wallet holster would not be an NFA firearm. A wallet holster alone is not subject to NFA controls and cannot be registered or transferred a- a firearm. Firearms contained in conventional holsters, trouser pockets, purses, gun cases, or various other forms of carrying cases have not been determined to fall within the definition of an “any other weapon,” even though it maybe possible to discharge a firearm while it is carried in such a manner. In order for an individual to lawfully “make” a wallet gun, that is to say, acquire both the handgun and the wallet holster, the person must first submit an Application to Make and Register a Firearm (ATF Form 1), pay a $200.00 making tmq and receive approval of the application. The serial number appearing on the handgun should be used to register the firearm. Transfer of a wallet gun requires an approved transfer application and payment of a $5 transfer tax. A transfer will not be approved unless the wallet gun has been registered to the transferor. [/align]
[align=left]Mere sale or possession of the wallet holster without the handgun is not a violation of the NFA. However, 18 U.S.C. section 2 provides that a person who aids or abets another person in the commission of an offense is also responsible for the offense. Therefore, sale or distribution of a wallet holster with knowledge that it will be used to make an unregistered NFA firearm may also place the seller or distributor of the holster in violation of the NFA.
[/align]
 

Machoduck

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Notice that the linked story took place in Wisconsin, where a concealed pistol of any type (back-up, primary, whatever) is illegal. If the victim of this robbery wanted to protect himself with a gun he had to open carry by law.

MD
 

SayWhat

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, ,
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Son_of_Perdition wrote:
1245A Defender wrote:
i think there is a law against "wallet guns",, even with a CPL...
That's interesting. However, I didn't mean to imply that the wallet was a gun or that the gun was concealed in an actual wallet. Only that a holster for a vary small gun looks square and proportionally shaped like a wallet but in no way have any wallet like paraphernalia in it. Such as money, licence or credit cards. I thought that there wasn't a legal holster definition in regards to shape or size. But I could be wrong.

DeSantis Nemesis is about as close as you can get.

DSN38.jpg
 

Metal_Monkey

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Jul 23, 2008
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Everett/Lynwood, Washington, USA
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Goes to show what criminals are made of. If they gun down police officers in coffee shops in daylight..... you are nothing. I personally can't believe that there are people that OC without a BUG. Without one...you better be quick with the steel:celebrate
 

fire suppressor

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Jul 13, 2008
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Kitsap County
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60% of criminals won't bother people if they know they are armed, that still leaves 40% who might still be braven to try this.
[/quote]
Got me thinking about that statistic. Is that a real statistic from some were? A actual study on this would be interesting
 

gogodawgs

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Oct 25, 2009
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Federal Way, Washington, USA
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fire suppressor wrote:
60% of criminals won't bother people if they know they are armed, that still leaves 40% who might still be braven to try this.

Got me thinking about that statistic. Is that a real statistic from some were? A actual study on this would be interesting[/quote]


http://www.nraila.org/issues/articles/read.aspx?id=117

I believe the number is actually higher. Yes they surveyed prisoners on armed/unarmed victims.
 
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