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Thread: Right to Keep and Bear Light Sabers

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    Legal yes... recommended? No... not if you have kids or tend to do silly things while inebriated.

    :shock:

    Those suckers are amazing... will absolutely super heat most objects to the point of ignition! Including your fingers so watch out!

    Not really a light saber... since physics does not allow for a beam of energy to terminate AND remain... but it looks like one and has a beam that is visible in all but bright lighting and WILL burn sh*t!

    F'n cool... dangerous but cool

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    Not legal in the US. US consumer products are limited to about 5/1000 of a watt.

    More power than that and you need a laser safety officer, a laser safety plan, state or federal license, and protective measures. Basically any laser that has enough power to blind or injure requires licensure.

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    nonameisgood wrote:
    Not legal in the US. US consumer products are limited to about 5/1000 of a watt.

    More power than that and you need a laser safety officer, a laser safety plan, state or federal license, and protective measures. Basically any laser that has enough power to blind or injure requires licensure.
    You're speaking out of your ass.

    They simply may not be sold as laser pointers

    http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/script...cfm?FR=1040.10


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    Regular Member Jack House's Avatar
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    One more said: "I must have this. Birthday present anyone? I will KILL things, with FIRE."
    Well, they just lost all credibility.

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    Regular Member Batousaii's Avatar
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    Ya - thats hardcore... not too long there may be real laser rifles or pistols.

    http://www.wickedlasers.com/index.php?refer=23037

    Scifi of yesterday becomes reality of today.

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    Campaign Veteran Cavalryman's Avatar
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    My objection to these things is not precisely with the device itself, but that it is being marketed in a way that downplays the fact that this thing is a weapon. It's too powerful to be reasonably called a toy, it isn't useful as a laser pointer, a laser level, a laser gunsight, or any of the other myriad of things that we use lasers for. It scorches things and burns out retinas without apparently having any other useful application. Sure, lots of things that were designed for other applications can be used as weapons, but so far as I can tell, this device doesn't have any other use. I don't necessarily think it should be prohibited, but it should be marketed in such a way as to make it clear that it is a weapon.

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    Batousaii wrote:
    Ya - thats hardcore... not too long there may be real laser rifles or pistols.

    http://www.wickedlasers.com/index.php?refer=23037

    Scifi of yesterday becomes reality of today.

    Bat
    Nice referrer ID there. Advertising like that is usually considered in bad taste.

    Cavalry man, they actually market some of their lasers as weapons:
    "enough to overwhelm an opponent's vision at up to 1km." http://www.wickedlasers.com/lasers/S...Pro-82-37.html
    "If we were to ever consider citizenship as the least bit matter of merit instead of birthright, imagine who should be selected as deserved representation of our democracy: someone who would risk their daily livelihood to cast an individually statistically insignificant vote, or those who wrap themselves in the flag against slightest slights." - agenthex

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    http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/script...cfm?FR=1040.10

    Just because you want to do whatever you like, living in a civil society requires certain concessions to the public good. Lasers are regulated since they can injure at a distance, without warning or notice. Eye injury by laser is usually permanent and can be quite serious.

    Unlike in the movies, a laser doesn't stop being dangerous four feet beyond the tip of your saber.

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    Regular Member Batousaii's Avatar
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    Chide me for doing it, then a sentence later do it yourself? I'd consider that rather impolite. I dont work for them so i have no reason to advertise. I simply thought it would be interesting reading as they are likely to be advanced into formidable weapons, maybe sooner than we expect.Small arms developmenthas always been a great interest of mine, and i thought you (all) might enjoy seeing the item and manufacturer that the thread was related to.

    -Tawnos,i would not have expected that of you, abitsurprised tobe honest.

    :?


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    There are far more powerful industrial lasers available, including lasers that cut through steel like butter. But how long before somebody tries this: take ten of these things, or more, (they're less than $200 each) put them in a home made frame to focus all the beams on the same point. Voila, 10 times the energy on the same point. Not a portable weapon, but credibly a stationary one. How many would a varmint hunter need to fry a prairie dog at 1000 yards?

    These things are dangerous as "consumer" devices and they're apparently being irresponsibly marketed as toys. Laser energy carries quite a distance. I don't see any reasonable consumer application and lots of opportunity for mischief.

    But should they be banned or heavily regulated? Guns are dangerous if misused and most of us feel guns are over-regulated.

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    Batousaii wrote:
    Chide me for doing it, then a sentence later do it yourself? I'd consider that rather impolite. I dont work for them so i have no reason to advertise. I simply thought it would be interesting reading as they are likely to be advanced into formidable weapons, maybe sooner than we expect.Small arms developmenthas always been a great interest of mine, and i thought you (all) might enjoy seeing the item and manufacturer that the thread was related to.

    -Tawnos,i would not have expected that of you, abitsurprised tobe honest.

    :?

    Not sure what you mean? Generally, when you see "?refer=#" it's a GET request to the server that indicates who the referrer/salesman is who linked to that particular product. In contrast, when there's a link that ends in .html, such as http://www.wickedlasers.com/lasers/S...Pro-82-37.html it's simply a webpage lookup and retrieval - no information sent where it increments a salesman's #. Notice that if you mouse over any of the links on the left, inside the site, you'd find the direct links match the format I sent. Additionally, going to the main page without the ?refer part will still take you to the same page.

    Basically, wherever you got that link from, someone was duping you into advertising for them.
    "If we were to ever consider citizenship as the least bit matter of merit instead of birthright, imagine who should be selected as deserved representation of our democracy: someone who would risk their daily livelihood to cast an individually statistically insignificant vote, or those who wrap themselves in the flag against slightest slights." - agenthex

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    But should they be banned or heavily regulated?
    Why should they be banned or regulated? The 2A says the right to bear arms, it does not say the right to bear items that use gunpowder. I see no difference between these and a 1911 or M-16 as far as 2A goes and the right to kep and bear them.



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    markand wrote:
    SNIP But should they be banned or heavily regulated?
    It isn't even a question worthy of discussion.

    "Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no substitute for a good blaster at your side."--old Corellian pirate proverb.

    I'll keep my lead-slinging blaster until an electronic version comes into use. Preferrably one that looks a lot like a broomhandle Mauser.


    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

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    Regular Member Jack House's Avatar
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    Cavalryman wrote:
    My objection to these things is not precisely with the device itself, but that it is being marketed in a way that downplays the fact that this thing is a weapon. It's too powerful to be reasonably called a toy, it isn't useful as a laser pointer, a laser level, a laser gunsight, or any of the other myriad of things that we use lasers for. It scorches things and burns out retinas without apparently having any other useful application. Sure, lots of things that were designed for other applications can be used as weapons, but so far as I can tell, this device doesn't have any other use. I don't necessarily think it should be prohibited, but it should be marketed in such a way as to make it clear that it is a weapon.
    Battery operated lighter, anyone?

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    Cavalryman wrote:
    My objection to these things is not precisely with the device itself, but that it is being marketed in a way that downplays the fact that this thing is a weapon. It's too powerful to be reasonably called a toy, it isn't useful as a laser pointer, a laser level, a laser gunsight, or any of the other myriad of things that we use lasers for. It scorches things and burns out retinas without apparently having any other useful application. Sure, lots of things that were designed for other applications can be used as weapons, but so far as I can tell, this device doesn't have any other use. I don't necessarily think it should be prohibited, but it should be marketed in such a way as to make it clear that it is a weapon.
    Its not (yet)a species of objectthat the military uses (or at least acknowledges that they use) as a weapon. It is being marketed more as a toy than a weapon. Why is it entitled to any 2A protection at all under Miller and Heller? Should it not be regulable as an extremely dangerous toy, like fireworks for example?

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    Regular Member Batousaii's Avatar
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    PT111 wrote:
    But should they be banned or heavily regulated?
    Why should they be banned or regulated? The 2A says the right to bear arms, it does not say the right to bear items that use gunpowder. I see no difference between these and a 1911 or M-16 as far as 2A goes and the right to kep and bear them.

    I tend to agree here, the 2A does not say "right to keep and bear guns" .. in says "ARMS". In my view, that would include Swords, knives, and lasers. If you can carry it and store it safely, you should not be infringed.
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    The Donkey wrote:
    Cavalryman wrote:
    My objection to these things is not precisely with the device itself, but that it is being marketed in a way that downplays the fact that this thing is a weapon. It's too powerful to be reasonably called a toy, it isn't useful as a laser pointer, a laser level, a laser gunsight, or any of the other myriad of things that we use lasers for. It scorches things and burns out retinas without apparently having any other useful application. Sure, lots of things that were designed for other applications can be used as weapons, but so far as I can tell, this device doesn't have any other use. I don't necessarily think it should be prohibited, but it should be marketed in such a way as to make it clear that it is a weapon.
    Its not (yet)a species of objectthat the military uses (or at least acknowledges that they use) as a weapon. It is being marketed more as a toy than a weapon. Why is it entitled to any 2A protection at all under Miller and Heller? Should it not be regulable as an extremely dangerous toy, like fireworks for example?
    Wasn't Reagan's Star Wars exactly this, just on a different scale? To say that it has to be exactly the same as what the military uses is going to exclude a lot of civilian weapons. NASA even used a laser to shoot an object left on the moon by one of the Apollo missions. And don't forget about laser guided missles and bombs.

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    Jefferson's contemporary writings say that he intended to apply it to weapons of the "type and kind in use" by the militia/military of the time. I'm not one to say that we should apply Jefferson's personal writings to our legal or constitutional interpretations in most cases, but when trying to interpret the written words, it is helpful to know how the terminology was used at the time.

    I think the development of weapons should probably not be done by selling the prototype as a toy. And if they want to claim status as a weapon, then they need to be regulated as a weapon. Guns are regulated and dangerous weapons are frequently prohibited entirely.

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    The Donkey wrote:
    Cavalryman wrote:
    My objection to these things is not precisely with the device itself, but that it is being marketed in a way that downplays the fact that this thing is a weapon. It's too powerful to be reasonably called a toy, it isn't useful as a laser pointer, a laser level, a laser gunsight, or any of the other myriad of things that we use lasers for. It scorches things and burns out retinas without apparently having any other useful application. Sure, lots of things that were designed for other applications can be used as weapons, but so far as I can tell, this device doesn't have any other use. I don't necessarily think it should be prohibited, but it should be marketed in such a way as to make it clear that it is a weapon.
    Its not (yet)a species of objectthat the military uses (or at least acknowledges that they use) as a weapon. It is being marketed more as a toy than a weapon. Why is it entitled to any 2A protection at all under Miller and Heller? Should it not be regulable as an extremely dangerous toy, like fireworks for example?
    That's kinda my point. I didn't say they should be considered firearms. There are lots of weapons that aren't firearms. My objection is that this device that has significant potential for injuring and maiming people is apparently being marketed as a toy.

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    This is not a light sabre in the sense of what we remember from Star Wars. Light Sabres, from the Lucas perspective, had limited range.

    This is not an arm. It is a weapon of mass destruction that can be used to burn homes and destroy personal protection with great ease, and I'm surprised the Chinese haven't dropped the hammer down on them.

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    Citizen wrote:
    It isn't even a question worthy of discussion.

    "Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no substitute for a good blaster at your side."--old Corellian pirate proverb.
    Proof that a long time time ago in a galaxy far away people knew the value of being armed.

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    Citizen wrote:
    markand wrote:
    SNIP But should they be banned or heavily regulated?
    It isn't even a question worthy of discussion.

    "Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no substitute for a good blaster at your side."--old Corellian pirate proverb.

    I'll keep my lead-slinging blaster until an electronic version comes into use. Preferrably one that looks a lot like a broomhandle Mauser.

    "I find your lack of faith disturbing........"
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