Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: Newberry Volcano National Park and gun law?

  1. #1
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Roseville, California, USA
    Posts
    486

    Newberry Volcano National Park and gun law?

    Hello Oregon,

    We will be visiting Bend in a week. We will drive through Newberry Volcano Park. Do I need to dismatle my gun?

    Here is the text from an email sent by a nice person at the Deschutes National Forest regarding my inquiries about gun restrictions and plinking sites on the Deschutes:

    "You may want to contact Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife for the rules and regulations on hunting in Oregon the local number is 541-388-6363 or you can go out on our web and go through Links.

    I just looked quickly at the locations that you sent me. These are for National Parks and monuments. National Parks and Monuments are under the Department of Interior as is Bureau of Land Management. Obama may have made the law for just the National Parks.

    Newberry and Deschutes are Forest Service under the Department of Agriculture. We have about 3 monument that we as a agency administer. Because we are a different agency we do not have the same rules as the National Park System. National Parks are usually just one interesting place such as Devil's Tower, Grand Canyon, Yellowstone etc. The National Parks system is to preserve that one land mark. Where the Forest Service is multi use such as wilderness, OHV, hunting fishing, boating, Timber, etc. We are more in to the uses and preserving the ability to use the land in a carrying way.

    Newberry Volcano was designated a Wildlife Refuge back before it was Forest Service land. When the state had control of the crater and Dillman Cave (Lava River Cave). For the past 60 years that I have lived here and recreated their has been a sign as you enter the edge of the caldera at Paulina Falls. Telling you there is no hunting inside the caldera, no visible transportation of a dead animal through there either and guns must be taken apart while in the caldera area.

    Hope this help you understand that the law may have only been for certain agencies. "

    Is Newberry Volcano Park a "no-gun" zone? Is Newberry not covered under the same legislation that the National Parks are under?

    I am trying to research this issue, but have not found the pertinent citations at this time.

    thanks for your help,

    markm
    Last edited by MarkBofRAdvocate; 07-03-2010 at 12:11 PM.

  2. #2
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Cottage Grove, Oregon, USA
    Posts
    348
    national parks fall under local gun laws as of this year...... if its legal to open carry in the state the park is, you may do so in the park..... if its legal to carry a loaded weapon in the vehicle in that state, you may do so in the national park.

  3. #3
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Roseville, California, USA
    Posts
    486
    Quote Originally Posted by Teddybearfrmhell View Post
    national parks fall under local gun laws as of this year...... if its legal to open carry in the state the park is, you may do so in the park..... if its legal to carry a loaded weapon in the vehicle in that state, you may do so in the national park.
    Thanks Teddybearfrmhell,

    According to the FS agent who wrote me, she states that National Forest facilities are exempt from the law. Only NPS and Fish and Wildlife refuges are included. I am trying to find the wording of the law, but am not being successful.

    Thanks

    markm

  4. #4
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Cottage Grove, Oregon, USA
    Posts
    348
    Quote Originally Posted by MarkBofRAdvocate View Post
    Thanks Teddybearfrmhell,

    According to the FS agent who wrote me, she states that National Forest facilities are exempt from the law. Only NPS and Fish and Wildlife refuges are included. I am trying to find the wording of the law, but am not being successful.

    Thanks

    markm
    some of tha actual facility buildings ARE exempt.... but the parks , forests, refuges etc are legal....do a search on national park gun law changes

  5. #5
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Roseville, California, USA
    Posts
    486
    Quote Originally Posted by Teddybearfrmhell View Post
    some of tha actual facility buildings ARE exempt.... but the parks , forests, refuges etc are legal....do a search on national park gun law changes
    Hey Teddy,

    Yea, and that's the rub, all I find are references to NPS and F&WS facitilities, and not to Forest Service facilities. Newberry is a national monument that is administered by the Deschutes National Forest, and not NPS.

    markm

  6. #6
    Moderator / Administrator
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Fairfax County, Virginia, USA
    Posts
    8,711

    State park gun law NOT relevant to discussion of federal park/forest carry!

    Quote Originally Posted by Teddybearfrmhell View Post
    national parks fall under local gun laws as of this year...... if its legal to open carry in the state the park is, you may do so in the park..... if its legal to carry a loaded weapon in the vehicle in that state, you may do so in the national park.
    Um, no - please do NOT tell people this - that was the Bush reg - the Coburn amendment controls - if legal to carry in FEDERAL parks under state law, then its legal under federal law - has NOTHING to do with state law re state parks. national forests and BLM lands follow same rule.

  7. #7
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Roseville, California, USA
    Posts
    486
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    Um, no - please do NOT tell people this - that was the Bush reg - the Coburn amendment controls - if legal to carry in FEDERAL parks under state law, then its legal under federal law - has NOTHING to do with state law re state parks. national forests and BLM lands follow same rule.
    Hey Mike,

    Thanks for the clarification. I know I read that the FS was included in the pertinent aspects of the Coburn ammendment; however, I am having some difficulty finding the federal language that states NPS, F&WS, BLM, and FS.

    Before I go to Newberry Volcano National Monument, I will need to allocate some time where I can search full time.

    I was hoping that somebody would have a link--no such luck!

    markm

  8. #8
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Cottage Grove, Oregon, USA
    Posts
    348
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    Um, no - please do NOT tell people this - that was the Bush reg - the Coburn amendment controls - if legal to carry in FEDERAL parks under state law, then its legal under federal law - has NOTHING to do with state law re state parks. national forests and BLM lands follow same rule.
    if you read my post, i do NOT address state parks...i said if it is legal to carry in the state that the park is in, then it is legal to carry in that park..... if you are going to correct me, please make sure you are correcting what i said, not just what you misread.

  9. #9
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Roseville, California, USA
    Posts
    486
    Hey Teddy, you did word your post correctly!

    Here is the loophole for Newberry:

    SA 1068. Mr. COBURN proposed an amendment to the bill H.R. 627, to amend the Truth in Lending Act to establish fair and transparent practices relating to the extension of credit under an open end consumer credit plan, and for other purposes; as follows:

    (7) Congress needs to weigh in on the new regulations to ensure that unelected bureaucrats and judges cannot again override the Second Amendment rights of law-abiding citizens on 83,600,000 acres of National Park System land and 90,790,000 acres of land under the jurisdiction of the United States Fish and Wildlife Service.

    (8) The Federal laws should make it clear that the second amendment rights of an individual at a unit of the National Park System or the National Wildlife Refuge System should not be infringed.
    (b) Protecting the Right of Individuals To Bear Arms in Units of the National Park System and the National Wildlife Refuge System.--The Secretary of the Interior shall not promulgate or enforce any regulation that prohibits an individual from possessing a firearm including an assembled or functional firearm in any unit of the National Park System or the National Wildlife Refuge System if--
    (1) the individual is not otherwise prohibited by law from possessing the firearm; and (2) the possession of the firearm is in compliance with the law of the State in which the unit of the National Park System or the National Wildlife Refuge System is located."

    (I emphasized National Park System with bold, underline, and italics)

    The Forest Service believes that Newberry is not part of the National Park System.

    Interesting, I wonder if Coburn and Congress meant to exclude Newberry National Monument?

    markm

  10. #10
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Cottage Grove, Oregon, USA
    Posts
    348
    "New Gun Rules in National Parks
    Friday February 19, 2010
    The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service (FWS) has announced that new rules allowing the possession of firearms on National Wildlife Refuges and National Parks will take effect on Feb. 22, 2010.
    "After this date (Feb. 22, 2010), the law allows an individual to lawfully possess a firearm within the boundaries of a national wildlife refuge in accordance with federal, state and local firearms laws," stated the FWS in a press release. "Visitors will be allowed to possess firearms on National Wildlife Refuges provided they comply with applicable provisions of federal, state and local law."

    The new rule results from an amendment to the Credit Cardholders' Bill of Rights Act of 2009, allowing people to carry loaded firearms in national parks and wildlife refuges.

    Persons with state-issued firearms "carry" permits will be allowed to carry firearms on refuges as long as they do so in compliance with the laws of the state that issued the permit.

    According to the FWS, the new law will apply to all 551 units of the National Wildlife Refuge System, as well as the National Monuments and the 392 units of the National Park System.

    The new law affects only the possession of firearms, not the use of firearms. "The law does not allow visitors to fire or discharge the firearms in any way, brandish the weapon in the view of others, or any other use of the firearm," stated the FWS.

    Possession of firearms will still be prohibited in federally-operated visitor centers, administrative office buildings, maintenance offices and workshops, field and backcountry offices, ranger stations and fee collection stations."


    which part of the above srticle excludes your destination?

  11. #11
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Granite State of Mind
    Posts
    4,509
    There's no such thing as "Newberry Volcano National Park", which is probably where your confusion began. It's U.S. Forest Service property, and USFS assimilates the laws of whatever state they're operating in.

    Stay out of government buildings, follow Oregon law, and you're good.

  12. #12
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Roseville, California, USA
    Posts
    486
    Quote Originally Posted by KBCraig View Post
    There's no such thing as "Newberry Volcano National Park", which is probably where your confusion began. It's U.S. Forest Service property, and USFS assimilates the laws of whatever state they're operating in.

    Stay out of government buildings, follow Oregon law, and you're good.
    Sorry KBCraig:

    You have not read the thread. The FS is reporting that guns must be taken apart in order for them to be in NEWBERRY NATIONAL VOLCANIC MONUMENT! FURTHERMORE, the FS is reporting that they are exempt from the Coburn amendment. NOTWITHSTANDING, the signs are still up at the entrances to NEWBERRY NATIONAL VOLCANIC MONUMENT that state such. The monument encompasses 50,000+ acres of land.

    If you are correct, where is the Oregon statute that creates a blanket-ban on firearms at the monument?

    Here is what you missed: "...guns must be taken apart while in the caldera area."

    I am sorry for using the word PARK, when I should have used MONUMENT instead!

    Here is the link for the monument: http://www.fs.fed.us/r6/centraloregon/newberrynvm/

    My complaint is with bureaucratic pukes who won't cite the laws that restrict natural rights--rights that are gauranteed by our Constitution.

    thanks,
    markm

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •