Spartacus
Banned
Only a pea-brain would compare the needs of legitimate organizations receiving voluntary contributions with burdensome taxation and permit/license fees.
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Concealed carry debate continues at state level - River Falls Journal
- Thread starter Doug Huffman
- Start date
Only a pea-brain would compare the needs of legitimate organizations receiving voluntary contributions with burdensome taxation and permit/license fees.
BerettaFS92Custom
Regular Member
Beat Down
Actually it has changed his way of thinking. he now rides in an armored car, has 50 bodyguards armed with SAW weapons and that is good for him. For us lowly peons.. well you get the picture We do not deserve to have preservation of life only the elite are allowed such an item....
Actually it has changed his way of thinking. he now rides in an armored car, has 50 bodyguards armed with SAW weapons and that is good for him. For us lowly peons.. well you get the picture We do not deserve to have preservation of life only the elite are allowed such an item....
paul@paul-fisher.com
Regular Member
I believe 'pea brain' :banghead: was implying that if there is mandatory training, some states use phrases such as 'NRA approved training' so these 'volunteer' groups benefit by not having Constitutional Carry.
I believe Doug is many things, I believe his brain is not the size of a pea.
Nutczak
Regular Member
Thank you Chauktaw!
That was my argument and point too.
You people that are willing to settle for a permitting system seem to forget that the right to keep and bear arms is deeply rooted in the foundation of this once great nation.
Permits to gain permission to exercise a right? :They can all bit my shiny metal ass" (Bender, circa 2002)
M
McX
Guest
well put nutczak!
J.Gleason
Banned
Again, the great Fartacus has spoken
Spartacus
Banned
I concur, although I doubt it is any larger than a walnut. His affectation of cloaking simple language in a mist of archaic speech in a futile attempt to cover a wider range of meaning is annoying to say the least.
I see your point Paul, but since we have about a one percent chance of getting constitutional carry at least at first, we may have to live and work with these organizations.
Gleason, you are a fly on my ass. Shoo!
J.Gleason
Banned
Fartacus there is a funny thing about that black spec on the top of bird 5hit. It is still bird5hit and your the black spec.
hardballer
Regular Member
Exactly why we need Constitutional Carry. No added bureaucracy. No permits. No licenses. The Constitution is the law. The statutes are breaking the law.
I believe that the NRA is collapsing under the weight of it's own self importance. They are now far more interested in making deals that benifit the NRA at the expense of 'the people'. They don't get my $$$ any longer.
I agree that Doug may have a brain larger than a pea. I further posit he may actually be of value as a fellow supporter of the Constitution and Open Carry. It is not constructive to disparage a member of this group in public. I appreciate hearing anything a fellow member has to say but would appreciate disparaging comments be kept to a 'private message' thank you. I don't mind the heat of criticism. I just may not always agree.
+1000000 There is no question that Constitutional Carry is legal, The statutes preventing us from such, are in violation of the Constitution. I am not sure how that is squared but I believe it is because we have simply allowed it. We, all of us have allowed these illegal statutes to stand because we just did not participate. Didn't think it was important. Didn't want it to interfere with acquiring my SUV or whatever toy was more important at the time that took your eyes off the Constitution and our freedom and liberty.
J., I know Spartacus and would; without hesitation, stand with him just as I would with you. Let's get this solidarity thing figured out. A united front will win this battle and the others yet to come. I have an idea, let us all direct this passion; like a laser beam, at the protagonist in this drama. The curtain has not yet fallen and our goals not yet reached. We've a lot of work to do and precious little energy to do it with.
J.Gleason
Banned
J., I know Spartacus and would; without hesitation, stand with him just as I would with you. Let's get this solidarity thing figured out. A united front will win this battle and the others yet to come. I have an idea, let us all direct this passion; like a laser beam, at the protagonist in this drama. The curtain has not yet fallen and our goals not yet reached. We've a lot of work to do and precious little energy to do it with.[/QUOTE]
Hey I have tried, his constant insults and dissenting remarks toward everything I say and certain members here say deserve a response now and then. Just because you help with a picnic doesn't make you an all knowing elitist. His constant bashing on what others have done to help is only a testament to his one sided way of thinking that only the efforts he puts forward are the ones worth recognizing. He deserves what he gets when he acts that way. I guess being in the presence of other elitists gave him a big head.
Even when I leave it alone he comes back for more with another member.
Hey I have tried, his constant insults and dissenting remarks toward everything I say and certain members here say deserve a response now and then. Just because you help with a picnic doesn't make you an all knowing elitist. His constant bashing on what others have done to help is only a testament to his one sided way of thinking that only the efforts he puts forward are the ones worth recognizing. He deserves what he gets when he acts that way. I guess being in the presence of other elitists gave him a big head.
Even when I leave it alone he comes back for more with another member.
M
McX
Guest
i'm an elitist. were all elitists here. we take on the social responsibility of being armed, knowing the laws to the letter, obeying the laws, being good citizens, helping, supporting, and advising each other. we all stand tall, alot taller than most!
Doug Huffman
Banned
I don't know if you have watched the 'rules' changing. They are.
I suggest using these changes as a watershed in the rhetoric here, and with the Ignore_Kist, flagging offensive posts for stated reasons (see the little exclamation mark icon in the lower left of a post box?
I suggest using these changes as a watershed in the rhetoric here, and with the Ignore_Kist, flagging offensive posts for stated reasons (see the little exclamation mark icon in the lower left of a post box?
Doug Huffman
Banned
jpm84092
Regular Member
Civil Rights
I compare the right to open carry and the right to concealed carry to the Civil Rights movement of the 1960s and 1970s. The Constitution, particularly after the 14th Amendment, made it clear that Black people could vote and own firearms, but yet there was Selma Alabama and places like it - and who could forget those folks wearing those sheets. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. made eloquent speeches, but a modicum of equality under the law for blacks took decades.
The Nine Wise Ones (at least 5 of them) have affirmed the right to own firearms, for the lawful purpose of protecting one's person, family, and dwelling, is a Civil Right. SCOTUS, in Heller v DC and McDonald v Chicago, did not mention carry methods, but I am sure there will be a case soon. Fortunately, none of the 4 conservatives or Justice Kennedy appear to be retiring anytime soon. For historical perspective, Dr. King's speeches were ignored by many in this country, but the perseverance of both Blacks and Whites insured continued progress toward the goal of true equality under the law. This process had some elements in the Congress (Civil Rights Act) and the Courts, but it was the perseverance of many who made the difference. My former neighbors, you will get much further taking baby steps toward full equality (Constitutional Carry) than simply demanding it outright and expecting it to happen. Go ahead and demand full accountability, but do not fight battles that you will lose and in doing so set the cause back. Persevere, and win the hearts and minds of the anti-gun nuts.
Teach your neighbors the truth about what happens in CCW States. There are no Wild West Shootouts among neighbors. Indeed, an armed society is a polite society. Most people in Utah are very polite, and it is not because they are Mormon.
Teach them that when seconds count, the Police are minutes away. Teach them that restrictive gun laws do not stop criminals; indeed the opposite happens. Teach them that CCW permit holders become super law abiding citizens (that is actually what happens here - you can tell the permit holders, they screw up traffic on the freeway by going the speed limit).
While I live in Utah now, I grew up in Janesville, Wisconsin. I am delighted with the progress to date in WI. When I was younger, open carry was technically legal, but anyone who complained or was frightened resulted in the person carrying being cited for misdemeanor disorderly conduct. Today, the trend is different and that is progress.
I wish to remind my former neighbors that while AK, VT, and AZ may have Constitutional Carry, AK and AZ offer permits anyway. This is so that their citizens can protect their families and themselves when traveling outside their State. My former neighbors, you are actually in much better shape than many in the USA. New York and New Jersey issue CCW permits, but they are "may issue" States and getting one is nearly impossible. Same with Kommiefornia. And, NY and NJ are not open carry tolerant.
Encourage your State legislators to pass concealed carry. Discourage them from very stringent requirements and especially from having reciprocity with "resident only" permits. This will only draw retaliation from States that do not restrict non-resident permits or who themselves issue non-resident permits. Remind them that you will not be appreciative of any restriction that draws the ire of other States and in doing so affects your ability to protect yourself, your family, and your property while traveling. Once Wisconsin has a CCW permit, you still may need out-of-state non-resident permits to be free to travel most of the country while exercising your Civil Right to protect yourself, your family, and your possessions.
Then, get the Wisconsin Legislature to pass a "Castle Doctrine" policy. This will make it very clear to potential felons that if they are injured while attempting to murder you, your spouse, and your children, they have no civil tort recourse.
I have heard it said that open carry is more of a deterrent to bad guys than concealed carry. I am not going to attack that belief, but my experience here in a strong concealed carry State differs. Here in Utah, the bad guys think twice, then again, and then again, before attacking anyone who is not obviously terrified. That can get you dead out here in the West.
I wish you all the best of luck. If Wisconsin gets a Concealed Carry law and that law allows non-resident permits, I will fly back and be first in line to get one. Then, I will put it into my wallet next to my Utah, Nevada, Pennsylvania, and Florida permits.
Jim
I compare the right to open carry and the right to concealed carry to the Civil Rights movement of the 1960s and 1970s. The Constitution, particularly after the 14th Amendment, made it clear that Black people could vote and own firearms, but yet there was Selma Alabama and places like it - and who could forget those folks wearing those sheets. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. made eloquent speeches, but a modicum of equality under the law for blacks took decades.
The Nine Wise Ones (at least 5 of them) have affirmed the right to own firearms, for the lawful purpose of protecting one's person, family, and dwelling, is a Civil Right. SCOTUS, in Heller v DC and McDonald v Chicago, did not mention carry methods, but I am sure there will be a case soon. Fortunately, none of the 4 conservatives or Justice Kennedy appear to be retiring anytime soon. For historical perspective, Dr. King's speeches were ignored by many in this country, but the perseverance of both Blacks and Whites insured continued progress toward the goal of true equality under the law. This process had some elements in the Congress (Civil Rights Act) and the Courts, but it was the perseverance of many who made the difference. My former neighbors, you will get much further taking baby steps toward full equality (Constitutional Carry) than simply demanding it outright and expecting it to happen. Go ahead and demand full accountability, but do not fight battles that you will lose and in doing so set the cause back. Persevere, and win the hearts and minds of the anti-gun nuts.
Teach your neighbors the truth about what happens in CCW States. There are no Wild West Shootouts among neighbors. Indeed, an armed society is a polite society. Most people in Utah are very polite, and it is not because they are Mormon.
Teach them that when seconds count, the Police are minutes away. Teach them that restrictive gun laws do not stop criminals; indeed the opposite happens. Teach them that CCW permit holders become super law abiding citizens (that is actually what happens here - you can tell the permit holders, they screw up traffic on the freeway by going the speed limit).
While I live in Utah now, I grew up in Janesville, Wisconsin. I am delighted with the progress to date in WI. When I was younger, open carry was technically legal, but anyone who complained or was frightened resulted in the person carrying being cited for misdemeanor disorderly conduct. Today, the trend is different and that is progress.
I wish to remind my former neighbors that while AK, VT, and AZ may have Constitutional Carry, AK and AZ offer permits anyway. This is so that their citizens can protect their families and themselves when traveling outside their State. My former neighbors, you are actually in much better shape than many in the USA. New York and New Jersey issue CCW permits, but they are "may issue" States and getting one is nearly impossible. Same with Kommiefornia. And, NY and NJ are not open carry tolerant.
Encourage your State legislators to pass concealed carry. Discourage them from very stringent requirements and especially from having reciprocity with "resident only" permits. This will only draw retaliation from States that do not restrict non-resident permits or who themselves issue non-resident permits. Remind them that you will not be appreciative of any restriction that draws the ire of other States and in doing so affects your ability to protect yourself, your family, and your property while traveling. Once Wisconsin has a CCW permit, you still may need out-of-state non-resident permits to be free to travel most of the country while exercising your Civil Right to protect yourself, your family, and your possessions.
Then, get the Wisconsin Legislature to pass a "Castle Doctrine" policy. This will make it very clear to potential felons that if they are injured while attempting to murder you, your spouse, and your children, they have no civil tort recourse.
I have heard it said that open carry is more of a deterrent to bad guys than concealed carry. I am not going to attack that belief, but my experience here in a strong concealed carry State differs. Here in Utah, the bad guys think twice, then again, and then again, before attacking anyone who is not obviously terrified. That can get you dead out here in the West.
I wish you all the best of luck. If Wisconsin gets a Concealed Carry law and that law allows non-resident permits, I will fly back and be first in line to get one. Then, I will put it into my wallet next to my Utah, Nevada, Pennsylvania, and Florida permits.
Jim