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The Catholic Virginian Weighs in on "New Gun Law" (7/12/2010)

Haz.

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I come from a land downunder.
God, save me from your alleged followers!

"Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." (Luke 22:36).

The sword in Christs day was the hand gun of today.
 

Don Barnett

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Good Idea

Perhaps KofC should respond to this editorial also.

For those who may not be familiar with this publication, please see http://www.catholicvirginian.org/index.html

The demographics of this publication are significant: 73,000 circulation, bi-weekly to every household in the Diocese of Richmond, which covers the entire southern half of Virginia.

Since the Catholic Virginian is a publication of the Diocese of Richmond, then I would defer to a Knights of Columbus Assembly, or Council, in that area. I fall under the Diocese of Arlington.
 

Don Barnett

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Perhaps the Writer Would Like to See My Vanity Tags

I don't want to say exactly what my plates say as this would ID exactly who I am, but they have my favorite firearm plus the number of them that I own.

This brought up a discussion between my wife and I as to why that number is cited:

She: "Did you have to get that number because there were that many (one less) before you wanting to cite that model firearm?"

Me: "No, that's how many of those guns I have."

She: "Does that number include the one you bought me and the one you carry all the time?"

Me: "No, you have a Taurus and I carry a Smith and Wesson."

She: "Then you have more guns that I realized you have. How many?"

Me: "I lost count; I don't know."

She: "M-m-m-m."

The plates are Knights of Columbus specialty plates.
 

2a4all

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When Steve Neill asked the question in the article, "Why can't people just avoid places that might be dangerous?", the "Luby's Cafeteria" answer would be just perfect. It there any way to respond to the article?

You can write a letter to the editor. I don't think they have an on-line comment feature.
 

JamesCanby

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To: Mr. Steve Neil, The Catholic Virginian
Subject: Response to your most recent editorial
Date: 07/12/2010

Dear Mr. Neil:

As a matter of course, I deeply resent you exercising your enumerated and constitutionally protected right to free speech in order to disparage my enumerated and similarly protected right to keep and bear arms.

You appear to be woefully uninformed about Virginia dining establishments. There are no “bars” in the state of Virginia, only restaurants that may serve alcohol in addition to food; a subtle distinction, but a real one, nonetheless. You are also naive in the extreme if you believe that concealed weapons were not present in these establishments previously. True, law-abiding citizens were prevented from so carrying, but as news reports over the years have made clear, those who disregard other laws have had no qualms about disregarding a concealed carry ban either.

You are also woefully uninformed regarding Virginia's gun laws. You state that “Many people do not realize that Virginia law allows people with proper permits to carry a gun in the open.” This is laughably, demonstrably false. One needs no permit whatsoever to openly carry a firearm in Virginia. So long as age restrictions are met, and you are not a convicted felon, you can walk into any gun shop, and legally purchase a firearm. You may then legally place it in a holster and walk down the street with no requirement for any sort of a permit. You are only required to obtain a permit should you wish to carry your firearm in a concealed manner.

As to your question: “but why else would you go to a bar? Those who frequent bars don’t go for soft drinks or iced tea.” I can tell you that when I frequent a dining establishment I go for the food and, in most cases, companionship either with my wife of many years, or with friends and associates. I rarely drink even at home, so it is fallacious of you to assume that I go to an establishment merely to get drunk and cause trouble. Indeed, in the news report you quoted in your opinion piece, it was noted that 60 gun owners gathered in a restaurant in suburban Richmond to celebrate the repeal of an unnecessary restriction. It should also be noted that the gathering was peaceful. No one got drunk, no one “busted a cap”, no one was disorderly, and no one was arrested or charged with so much as a misdemeanor. So much for the “why else would you go to a bar” fallacy that you promote as insight.

As to why I would not simply avoid going where I expect trouble, I would ask you to explicitly point to any establishment, even one’s own home, where uninvited trouble is guaranteed to be absent. There are a number of famous cases in this country where people engaging in no risky behavior whatsoever found themselves in the middle of a criminal activity. Luby’s Cafeteria in Texas comes to mind, as does Virginia Tech, Columbine High School, the Amish School in Pennsylvania. None of the individuals murdered in these and other incidents had given their murderer even the slightest provocation. All were in supposedly “safe” locations. All were unarmed and unable to defend themselves.

Even staying away from public places is insufficient to completely avoid contact with criminally-minded individuals – witness numerous news article articles regarding home invasions, burglaries and the like. You are similarly not guaranteed safety merely walking down the street, as is readily apparent when reading news of muggings, rapes, robberies and murders committed in public places.

Make no mistake – the firearm others and I carry is not a magic talisman – it will not ward off evil any more than will holding up a cross in the face of a determined attacker. Like a seat belt in your car, however, it can increase the odds of survival if carried consistently. In short, I do not carry a weapon in order to start a fight – I carry it for my own protection and that of my loved ones should unanticipated and unprovoked danger appear suddenly.

You claim that people are intimidated when they observe a fellow citizen openly carrying a firearm. I have two responses to that. The first is that it is as much my right to carry a weapon to defend myself, as it is your right to publish an uninformed, biased op-ed piece. The only reason people are fearful is that we have for too long consented to being disarmed in public - buying into the false notion that the police can protect us. As more ordinary citizens embrace their right to protect themselves, the distress will fade away as the general public comes to realize that most weapons carriers are in fact peaceable citizens like themselves. Secondly, if by wearing my firearm openly I intimidate someone and thereby dissuade an attack, I say that’s a good thing, and am proud to have done even a small bit of public service.

This was well written. Let us know if you get any kind of response.
 

SouthernBoy

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Wow, I just read this and it is full of disinformation, outright errors, and garbage. The sad thing is that those who receive this periodical will accept this as gospel (pun intended) and believe all that is stated in the editorial. This is what makes it so difficult to counter the arguments one receives from people who ingest such misguided dogma.
 

2a4all

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Wow, I just read this and it is full of disinformation, outright errors, and garbage. The sad thing is that those who receive this periodical will accept this as gospel (pun intended) and believe all that is stated in the editorial. This is what makes it so difficult to counter the arguments one receives from people who ingest such misguided dogma.

You haven't been paying attention. Not all of us "accept this as gospel". That's why I started the thread.
 

TFred

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LTE responses to Steve Neill's editorial have been published in the July 26. 2010 issue.

http://www.catholicvirginian.org/archive/2010/2010vol85iss20/pages/letters.html
Thanks for the follow up. I'm glad to see that they were willing to publish four letters opposing the editorial. I bet they got a ton of mail!

First two letter-writers are typical, no clue that there are no bars in Virginia. I really wish people would figure this out.

The first letter writer makes all great points until the very end when he literally backtracks on everything he just said!

He did make me laugh though, as he reminded me of the age-old joke about the British police, who don't (well at least they didn't used to) carry firearms.

What do the British cops yell out after a fleeing criminal?
"STOP... Or I'll yell STOP AGAIN!"​


:banghead:

TFred
 
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user

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I believe the Romans have a mission regarding the ability of just plain folks to defend themselves. They didn't fare as well as they'd have liked during the last big religious wars, because the "Protestant" peasants of Germany took to arms to resist. Do you suppose there's any correlation between Catholicism and gun control? Let's see... Maryland, New York, New Jersey, Illinois (especially Chicago), Massachussetts, California, Hawaii... I think I see a pattern, here.
 

darthmord

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I believe the Romans have a mission regarding the ability of just plain folks to defend themselves. They didn't fare as well as they'd have liked during the last big religious wars, because the "Protestant" peasants of Germany took to arms to resist. Do you suppose there's any correlation between Catholicism and gun control? Let's see... Maryland, New York, New Jersey, Illinois (especially Chicago), Massachussetts, California, Hawaii... I think I see a pattern, here.

You know this as well as any on here... it was never about safety or for the children.

It has and always will be about control and self-determination.
 

Don Barnett

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Here Is The Excerpt from the Catecism of the Catholic Church in That Regards

I believe the Romans have a mission regarding the ability of just plain folks to defend themselves. They didn't fare as well as they'd have liked during the last big religious wars, because the "Protestant" peasants of Germany took to arms to resist. Do you suppose there's any correlation between Catholicism and gun control? Let's see... Maryland, New York, New Jersey, Illinois (especially Chicago), Massachussetts, California, Hawaii... I think I see a pattern, here.

In Explaining the Commandment: Thou Shalt Not Commit Murder, the Roman Church says this:

Legitimate defense
2263 The legitimate defense of persons and societies is not an exception to the prohibition against the murder of the innocent that constitutes intentional killing. "The act of self-defense can have a double effect: the preservation of one's own life; and the killing of the aggressor. . . . The one is intended, the other is not."65
2264 Love toward oneself remains a fundamental principle of morality. Therefore it is legitimate to insist on respect for one's own right to life. Someone who defends his life is not guilty of murder even if he is forced to deal his aggressor a lethal blow:
If a man in self-defense uses more than necessary violence, it will be unlawful: whereas if he repels force with moderation, his defense will be lawful. . . . Nor is it necessary for salvation that a man omit the act of moderate self-defense to avoid killing the other man, since one is bound to take more care of one's own life than of another's.66
2265 Legitimate defense can be not only a right but a grave duty for one who is responsible for the lives of others. The defense of the common good requires that an unjust aggressor be rendered unable to cause harm. For this reason, those who legitimately hold authority also have the right to use arms to repel aggressors against the civil community entrusted to their responsibility.
 

2a4all

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Virginia Center for Public Safety opposes "guns in churches"

I just received my copy of this publication, and immediately turned to the LTEs. I found this gem (2nd letter), which mentions the VCDL. The other gun-related LTEs are worth a read, too.

http://www.catholicvirginian.org/archive/2010/2010vol85iss21/pages/letters.html

AFAIK, the VCDL does not condone violence; it promotes the fundamental right of self-defense. How do those who oppose violence defend themselves? Even less lethal weapons and hand to hand methods are violent.:banghead:
 

Haz.

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For the religious anties.

"Thou shalt no kill" (Exodus 20:13). . . . . . I'll drink to that.

"If a thief be found breaking up, and be smitten that he die, there shall no blood be shed for him."(Exodus 22:2).

In fact the Bible is chock full of Scriptures which teaches we are required to defend ourselves at all times.

"A righteous man falling down before the wicked is as a troubled fountain, and a corrupt spring." (Proverbs 25:26).

For those who oppose government instituted death penalty using religion as their lever. This is covered in Scripture as well.

Now if a criminal ignores the commandment "Thou shalt not kill," and does deliberately kill another innocent person God teaches that the death penalty be invoked;

"Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man." (Gen. 9:6). Haz.
 
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