Birmingham Police Force Open Carriers To Leave STARBUCKS!!!!

Hollowpoint38 · Jul 15, 2010

Sorry for the late posting, everybody. This took place on Sunday, July 11, 2010

I have been in Mobile working and unable to get online. Below is a video link where you can watch the video. The real interesting video is on "Video Part 4". Click the link below and your will be given the option to skip forward to part 4!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtX0shqCjFw

eye95 · Jul 15, 2010

It was hard to follow, but the complaint seemed to be that you all were "causing alarm."

So what? If you are doing nothing but passively exercising your rights, folks who are alarmed are responsible for that alarm--and for abating it if they don't like being alarmed.

If you are actively doing something with your handguns that alarms folks, like waving them around, then the cops should intervene. Other than for such action, I would contend that they don't have the power to do anything about it.

Hollowpoint38 · Jul 15, 2010

Admit~

The person who was alarmed was the female officer and thats it! She admits it!

Gundude · Jul 15, 2010

You gotta be kidding. You were doing nothing wrong. Did you get dinner and a movie first.....maybe a reach around. Fear of guns is a treatable mental disorder.
Next time, please stand up for your rights.

eye95 · Jul 15, 2010

Gundude said:
You gotta be kidding. You were doing nothing wrong. Did you get dinner and a movie first.....maybe a reach around. Fear of guns is a treatable mental disorder.
Next time, please stand up for your rights.

Don't be too judgmental. At least one of these guys is working through a recent ARREST for legally OCing.

FedFirefighter · Jul 15, 2010

Whats up Tim? Good to have you back. Oh, and nice haircut Jonathon. I think you all handled yourself very well and made the right choice considering the whole out on bail thing. It seemed like a very friendly exchange, I hope to come up and join y'all sometime.

kwikrnu · Jul 15, 2010

I commented on the video. Next time stand up for yourselves instead of getting kicked out and talking behind the cops.

eye95 · Jul 15, 2010

kwikrnu said:
I commented on the video. Next time stand up for yourselves instead of getting kicked out and talking behind the cops.

At the risk of repeating myself:

eye95 said:
Don't be too judgmental. At least one of these guys is working through a recent ARREST for legally OCing.

B1911 · Jul 16, 2010

Whens the next Birmingham Starbucks meet? I would really like to join

Thundar · Jul 16, 2010

Habeas Coffee, Habeas Coffee!!!

O.K., when they mess with gun rights they are messing with fundamental rights, but when they kick you out of your caffine junkie fix station they are inflicting cruel and unusual punishment.

Three bricks to the Birmingham Police:

1) Abusing the civil rights of open carriers, strike 1

2) Inflicting cruel and unusual punishment on caffiene addicts, strike 2

3) Allowing a police officer with hoplophobia mental disorder to carry a firearm, strike 3

Live Free or Die,
Thundar

Jeff Chandler · Jul 16, 2010

Looks like you guys handled it ok. We want the Police to be on our side, and part of the mission is to let them be educated that what we do is legal and non threatening. I'll bet that female officer has a different tact the next time she runs to an open carrier. They, police, have a certain responcibility to make sure that we are legal, and then their responcibility is to stand down, by either leaving or sit down and have a cup of coffee with us.

Vondelta · Jul 16, 2010

Please keep us updated on how you proceed with these uninformed LEOs. I hate to say it, but it seems that some LEOs need to be made examples of to educate the rest. It would be nice to have a few LEOs suspended without pay for a while. Maybe this would make others start thinking before tramping on our rights.

Vondelta · Jul 16, 2010

They, police, have a certain responcibility to make sure that we are legal, and then their responcibility is to stand down, by either leaving or sit down and have a cup of coffee with us.

I disagree Jeff. They have a responsibility to stop people who are committing crimes. If there is no crime being committed, or about to be committed, then they have the responsibility to allow us to exercise our rights, not harass us. What they are doing is profiling, nothing more, nothing less. When is the last time you saw a criminal sitting in Starbucks, chatting with friends, having coffee, with an OC firearm. All criminals I have seen carry concealed until they pull the firearm out to commit a crime.

macgulley · Jul 16, 2010

How would this play out if you had the Starbucks manager on your side? If the manager specifically told the cops you were welcome to open carry would they leave you alone?

cowboy67 · Jul 16, 2010

Macgulley...My take on it would be that yes the police would have had to leave the premises if they were inside the shop, but from the video, it looks to me that they were sitting on the sidewalk so I would think the manager would not have much say in the situation even though the cops were in the wrong.

Correct me if I am wrong...

aadvark · Jul 16, 2010

StarBucks Official Company Policy straight from StarBucks Corporate Office in Seattle, Washington is:
...tarBucks follws any and all applicable Federal and State Laws regarding Firearms.
...tarBucks has advised all/every/its Baristo/a(s) and all Managers not to interfere with Lawful Acts concerning Firearms by Customers while they are at StarBucks.
-Per Company Service Representative..., Tel. STARBUCKS.

Kingfish · Jul 16, 2010

As I have said before. You guys are going to need to either get OC spelled out in the AL constitution or in the code. I know it is distasteful but is it not better than people constantly getting harrased and arrested? Sure, you can sue one sheriff at a time but what is that going to take...20 years?

It would take one hell of an attitude change in AL for OC to be accepted otherwise.

Mike · Jul 16, 2010

Kingfish said:
As I have said before. You guys are going to need to either get OC spelled out in the AL constitution or in the code. I know it is distasteful but is it not better than people constantly getting harrased and arrested? Sure, you can sue one sheriff at a time but what is that going to take...20 years?

It would take one hell of an attitude change in AL for OC to be accepted otherwise.

I don't think this is abslutely necessary - else the old code text now preempted by subsequent statutes as a matter oif law would be enforced thru arrests and prosecutions - what you need is more open carry to secure open carry - that's what it took in all states.

What is the status of challenging the preempted open carry bans in the several Alabama cities banning handgun carry in city halls?

Jonathon Sometimes · Jul 16, 2010

Guys.

You do realize I was arrested in that exact spot one week ago for "disorderly conduct" for lawful OC.

I'm out on bail, and if arrested again, bail gets revoked. Then I lose job.

Kwik, you're an idiot. I supported you all this time, and when I OC'ed my AK RIFLE (not pistol) ON JULY 4TH AND WAS ARRESTED FOR DISORDERLY CONDUCT you call us pussies for dispersing the next week. You weren't arrested. I am in the process of litigation, yeah I said it, so now everybody knows.

We are standing up for our rights. It just isn't all on video.

Mike, preemption is the least of our concerns right now, but I'll check in on the Birmingham City Council pretty soon.

kwikrnu · Jul 16, 2010

Jonathon Norris said:
You do realize I was arrested in that exact spot one week ago for "disorderly conduct" for lawful OC.

I'm out on bail, and if arrested again, bail gets revoked. Then I lose job.

Kwik, you're an idiot. I supported you all this time, and when I OC'ed my AK RIFLE (not pistol) ON JULY 4TH AND WAS ARRESTED FOR DISORDERLY CONDUCT you call us pussies for dispersing the next week. You weren't arrested. I am in the process of litigation, yeah I said it, so now everybody knows.

We are standing up for our rights. It just isn't all on video.

Mike, preemption is the least of our concerns right now, but I'll check in on the Birmingham City Council pretty soon.

If you were lawfully carrying then let them arrest you again. Your Federal lawsuit can be amended and more defendants added. If you lose your job that is more damages. Was everyone in the group out on bail?

It is illegal to open carry a rifle on this forum, read the rules.

Birmingham Police Force Open Carriers To Leave STARBUCKS!!!!

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