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Thread: Knives

  1. #1
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    Knives

    hey all, i joined this site years ago, but have never once posted here.

    having been a FL LEO, for many moons, as well as my Dept.'s "Violent Crimes Investigator" (for a short period of time), i have a pretty good understanding of most of the weapons related state statutes. i realize that open carry is (for the most part) illegal, here, but open carry of non firearm weapons is NOT. i have gone back to OC'n a fixed blade knife, rather than concealing it, and wanted to hear from everyonelse on this subject.

    what have been your experiences with OC'n large, or atleast what sheeple would consider "large", knives? have you ever been detained, etc? any comments made?

    so far, i've have no problems, but i personally know of other LEO's who thought OC'n a large fixed blade was illegal and told someone they could not carry the knife they were wearing. don't fret, i enlightened that particular LEO.

    and to everyone who does not OC a fixed blade, please consider doing so to help increase the normality of using man's (sorry ladies, HUman's) oldest tool.

  2. #2
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    I was unaware that OC of large knives was allowed.

    In reference to ignorant or plain stupid LEO's I have run into several in Hernando county. I was discussing open carry legislation plans with one during a trip to my local dunkin donuts and he went so far to say "CCW holders are idiots, nuts, and have no business with guns, that's our job to have the guns, The last thing we need is for nut jobs to be running around with guns in the open." he also had no knowledge of 790 to speak of.

    I have very little faith in LEO's.

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    wow, that's bad because Hernando is pretty close to home for me

    it doesn't bother me that cops don't understand ALL laws, it's actually impossible to completely memorize ALL state statutes and still be the type of person that can effectively enforce them. what bothers me is the LEO's who don't understand the law, but just figure whatever they say IS the law. LE is a strange field in the sense that ONE bad encounter can change a person's opinion forever. it's not the same with say... convenient store clerks. you get a bad one, you go "wow, that guys a jerk" and buy gas somewherelse. with cops, you get a bad one, you hate cops. btw- i don't mean "YOU" just a figure of speach.

    when the 94-04 assault weapon ban was sunsetting, i was passing around a LEOnly petition to show oppostition to any replacement ban, i only ran across ONE cop who refused to sign it. the other 30 or so agreed that is was a stupid law. we're out there, bro, don't lose the faith just yet.

    but NO - there is no state statute prohibitting the open carry of non firearm weapons. you can walk down the street with a sword strapped to your back and the only crime is the illegal detainment you are likely to encounter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by injunwil View Post
    wow, that's bad because Hernando is pretty close to home for me

    it doesn't bother me that cops don't understand ALL laws, it's actually impossible to completely memorize ALL state statutes and still be the type of person that can effectively enforce them. what bothers me is the LEO's who don't understand the law, but just figure whatever they say IS the law. LE is a strange field in the sense that ONE bad encounter can change a person's opinion forever. it's not the same with say... convenient store clerks. you get a bad one, you go "wow, that guys a jerk" and buy gas somewherelse. with cops, you get a bad one, you hate cops. btw- i don't mean "YOU" just a figure of speach.

    when the 94-04 assault weapon ban was sunsetting, i was passing around a LEOnly petition to show oppostition to any replacement ban, i only ran across ONE cop who refused to sign it. the other 30 or so agreed that is was a stupid law. we're out there, bro, don't lose the faith just yet.

    but NO - there is no state statute prohibitting the open carry of non firearm weapons. you can walk down the street with a sword strapped to your back and the only crime is the illegal detainment you are likely to encounter.
    This is true, however there are many local ordnances that do. And there is no state preemption of these laws.

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    Cool

    You can open carry a machete here in Florida. Tell me that ain't the most intimidating weapon on earth!

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    i'm surprised this thread has gotten so little attention. it might be because i rarely frequent this forums, but i have to admit i am a little confused. i didn't think this was just a "gun site", i interpretted it as being an outlet for people willing to brave the dangers/inconveniences of excercising their rights.

    well, please tell me - who all, who isn't restricted by county or city ordinance, willing to bear the social stigma of carrying man's oldest tool w/o making an effort to hide it? i am! as long as the (unconstitutional) laws of this state prohibit us from OC'n our firearms, i feel we should make it a point to OC our knives. i don't encourage this as a way of thumbing our nose at LE (which i am LE). i encourage it as a way of helping educate the masses that thousands of responsible law abiding people use man's oldest tool for things other than committing crimes and that "A MAN WITH A KNIFE" is not something to immediately freak out about. help educate through exposure. also, in the unfortunate event it creates a situation with LE, it also gives us the chance to (RESPECTFULLY) enlighten them to the fact that, while it is not as common as we would like, it is NOT illegal.

    am i really alone in my willingness to OC a large fixed blade in public? i thought the whole sentiment here was - do what is legal without fear of harassment. why are there no efforts being made to organize an open carry (knife) event to help desensitize the sheeple to our edged tools?
    Last edited by injunwil; 08-31-2010 at 12:40 AM.

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    Regular Member MarlboroLts5150's Avatar
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    Out here in Hawaii, Guns are taboo, but most knives are just fine. I OC a 7 3/4" Ka-Bar here, and not planning on changing that, when I get to south Georgia/north Florida.

    You never know when you'll need a good knife.
    "My dedication to my country's flag rests on my ardent belief in this noblest of causes, equality for all. If my future rests under this earth rather than upon it, I fear not."

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    I open carry my Ka-Bar and Chris Reeves Shadow III, daily. While I conceal my Para Warthog + 2 mags.

    I favor my knife for almost any task that comes to mind over my Para. Insert simple logic here.

    I have never been approached or harrased by LE types.

    And fear what? To be arrested for following the law? What will surprise any of you in todays politicaly charged, government-be-all atmosphere?

    Wear it because you need it. Bear it because you want to.

  9. #9
    Regular Member Brimstone Baritone's Avatar
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    I keep a small bowie with me in the truck that I used to wear a lot before I bought my 1911. I like to wear it, but don't much because it makes me really wide. I get stuck in all these narrow-armed chairs.

    A good knife is a more versatile tool than a gun anyway, and it makes a good retention tool if someone were stupid enough to try a gun grab. I should get back in the habit.

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    I was approached by two LEO's today who I assume were detectives for the Highlands county sherrifs department today at my local Racetrac. I was OCing my S&W outback which is a large Khukri knife, I'd say that the blade is about 13 in with a 4 in hilt. I was inside paying for gas when these two officers asked me if they could speak to me outside. I agreed because I always try to be cooperative with LEO's were possible. So we step outside and one of the officers asks me about my knife and I said to him that I am well within my legal right to OC my knife, and he says to me " Son I could probably go through the FL statutes and slap you with some kind of cahrge but I'm trying to do you a favor so I don't ever want to see you carrying that knife again". I then informed said officer that I had asked an Orlando PD officer who was stationed at the gun show that I bought the knife at about the knife laws in FL and whether it was legal for me to OC this knife and he told me that it was legal. The officer then says " Here we go again, we've already been over this now I'm tryin to let you off lightly here but you're just digging yourself deeper and deeper. I don't want to see you with that knife on you EVER again or I will bring you up on charges." I eventually got tired of arguing with him and complied. I know that there are county specific laws as well as state laws so my question is, was he right?

  11. #11
    Regular Member rvrctyrngr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Khukri_Man View Post
    I was approached by two LEO's today who I assume were detectives for the Highlands county sherrifs department today at my local Racetrac. I was OCing my S&W outback which is a large Khukri knife, I'd say that the blade is about 13 in with a 4 in hilt. I was inside paying for gas when these two officers asked me if they could speak to me outside. I agreed because I always try to be cooperative with LEO's were possible. So we step outside and one of the officers asks me about my knife and I said to him that I am well within my legal right to OC my knife, and he says to me " Son I could probably go through the FL statutes and slap you with some kind of cahrge but I'm trying to do you a favor so I don't ever want to see you carrying that knife again". I then informed said officer that I had asked an Orlando PD officer who was stationed at the gun show that I bought the knife at about the knife laws in FL and whether it was legal for me to OC this knife and he told me that it was legal. The officer then says " Here we go again, we've already been over this now I'm tryin to let you off lightly here but you're just digging yourself deeper and deeper. I don't want to see you with that knife on you EVER again or I will bring you up on charges." I eventually got tired of arguing with him and complied. I know that there are county specific laws as well as state laws so my question is, was he right?
    Unless Highlands County has some ordinance prohibiting it, you broke no law. I don't see where the deputy said you were. He just didn't LIKE the fact that you were carrying the blade. Too bad for him.

    I'd be having a chat with the shift supervisor about the deputy's attitude.
    Director,
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    Detached reflection cannot be demanded in the presence of an uplifted knife.
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    Brown v. United States, 1921

  12. #12
    Regular Member ADulay's Avatar
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    This discussion on knives brings me back to my working days in Indiana where I open carried a decent knife 7 days a week.

    Never really thought about it and only a few people actually asked me about it.

    At yesterday's Open Carry Fishing event down here in Fort Myers, there was one younger guy who had a pretty good sized knife on him and it obviously wasn't for fishing (he had others for that) and nobody appeared to mention it.

    Now that you bring this subject up, I don't really see many knives, but I'll keep my eyes out for them and see what I can come up with this month.

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    Regular Member Gil223's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by injunwil View Post
    i'm surprised this thread has gotten so little attention. it might be because i rarely frequent this forums, but i have to admit i am a little confused. i didn't think this was just a "gun site", i interpretted it as being an outlet for people willing to brave the dangers/inconveniences of excercising their rights.
    Perhaps the interest would have been greater if you had posted this in the "Social Lounge", rather than "Florida". I only came into this thread because I have an interest in edged weapons as well as firearms and OC/CC.

    Utah has very liberal, almost non-existent, knife carry laws - the Utah State law is pre-emptive. No county or lesser municipality can restrict size or manner of carry without approval from the State Legislature. I have edged tools ranging from a Victorinox (Swiss Army) "Gentleman's Pocket Knife" to a two-handed broadsword. Not having an excess of cash, all are mass-production blades - some appear exotic, but none are "custom" knives. I rarely carry any of my larger knives/short swords unless I'm out of the city adventuring. Even then I carry a pistol as well. I don't carry a knife in populated areas in case somebody pulls a knife on me, at which time I will shoot them (we have an "equal force law" here in Utah, and if I don't have a knife on my person, I can't be expected to use "equal force", but rather "necessary force").

    I'm certain there are blade forums out here, but I haven't sought any out because I've discovered that most folks in such groups tend to own custom knives, made by "big name" independent craftsmen. We who have production grade blades, seem to be looked upon like Neiman-Marcus shoppers look upon those who buy at WalMart. Pax...
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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    I always have a small, or medium bowie with me. Knives have a broad range of uses besides self defense, been carrying a pocket knife since I was very young. I get such a headache whenever I hear of the school policies preventing students from possessing a small pocket knife. Everybody had them when I was in school, and nobody was stabbed. What has this country come to.
    INAL but best legal advice from a non lawyer is "Talk to a lawyer".

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    Regular Member sharkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gil223 View Post
    Perhaps the interest would have been greater if you had posted this in the "Social Lounge", rather than "Florida". I only came into this thread because I have an interest in edged weapons as well as firearms and OC/CC.

    Utah has very liberal, almost non-existent, knife carry laws - the Utah State law is pre-emptive. No county or lesser municipality can restrict size or manner of carry without approval from the State Legislature. I have edged tools ranging from a Victorinox (Swiss Army) "Gentleman's Pocket Knife" to a two-handed broadsword. Not having an excess of cash, all are mass-production blades - some appear exotic, but none are "custom" knives. I rarely carry any of my larger knives/short swords unless I'm out of the city adventuring. Even then I carry a pistol as well. I don't carry a knife in populated areas in case somebody pulls a knife on me, at which time I will shoot them (we have an "equal force law" here in Utah, and if I don't have a knife on my person, I can't be expected to use "equal force", but rather "necessary force").

    I'm certain there are blade forums out here, but I haven't sought any out because I've discovered that most folks in such groups tend to own custom knives, made by "big name" independent craftsmen. We who have production grade blades, seem to be looked upon like Neiman-Marcus shoppers look upon those who buy at WalMart. Pax...

    We have explicit knife pre-emption in AZ too thanks to the AZCDL.

    I don't think I'm skilled enough to carry a knife.

    <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLS3RGesIFQ" target="_blank"> I had too, LOL


    13-3120. Knives regulated by state; state preemption; definitions

    A. Except as provided in subsections C and D, a political subdivision of this state shall not enact any ordinance, rule or tax relating to the transportation, possession, carrying, sale, transfer, purchase, gift, devise, licensing, registration or use of a knife or knife making components in this state.
    B. A political subdivision of this state shall not enact any rule or ordinance that relates to the manufacture of a knife and that is more prohibitive than or that has a penalty that is greater than any rule or ordinance that is related to the manufacture of any other commercial goods.
    C. This section does not prohibit a political subdivision of this state from enacting and enforcing any ordinance or rule pursuant to state law, to implement or enforce state law or relating to imposing any privilege or use tax on the retail sale, lease or rental of, or the gross proceeds or gross income from the sale, lease or rental of, a knife or any knife components at a rate that applies generally to other items of tangible personal property.
    D. This section does not prohibit a political subdivision of this state from regulating employees or independent contractors of the political subdivision who are acting within the course and scope of their employment or contract.
    E. A political subdivision's rule or ordinance that relates to knives and that is inconsistent with or more restrictive than state law, whether enacted before or after the effective date of this amendment to this section, is null and void.
    F. For the purposes of this section:
    1. "Knife" means a cutting instrument and includes a sharpened or pointed blade.
    2. "Political subdivision" includes any county, city, including a charter city, town, municipal corporation or special district, any board, commission or agency of a county, city, including a charter city, town, municipal corporation or special district or any other local public agency.
    Last edited by sharkey; 10-14-2012 at 06:10 PM.

  16. #16
    Regular Member sharkey's Avatar
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    According to this sensational article we were actually first to have knife pre-emption.

    You guys just gave me an idea, I think knife carry is legal in bars in AZ where gun carry is not (sans concealed with a concealed weapons permit). Maybe I need to learn how to handle one and carry a big knife when I go drinking. Hmmmmm.

    As far as Florida, sorry.

    http://www.azcentral.com/community/g...gulations.html
    Last edited by sharkey; 10-14-2012 at 06:19 PM. Reason: forgot to link article .. doh!

  17. #17
    Regular Member rvrctyrngr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sharkey View Post
    According to this sensational article we were actually first to have knife pre-emption.

    You guys just gave me an idea, I think knife carry is legal in bars in AZ where gun carry is not (sans concealed with a concealed weapons permit). Maybe I need to learn how to handle one and carry a big knife when I go drinking. Hmmmmm.

    As far as Florida, sorry.

    http://www.azcentral.com/community/g...gulations.html
    Nothing illegal about OCing a fixed blade in a bar here.

    We WILL have a weapons preemption bill before the legislature this next session.
    Director,
    Florida Carry, Inc.

    Detached reflection cannot be demanded in the presence of an uplifted knife.
    -Justice Oliver Wendel Holmes
    Brown v. United States, 1921

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    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZO6Vettever View Post
    You can open carry a machete here in Florida. Tell me that ain't the most intimidating weapon on earth!
    Come at me bro!

    Bringing a knife to a gun fight, even a really big knife, is fail.

    Guns exist. This relegates knives to mere utility function, for those of us civilized enough to carry a gun...
    "The fourth man's dark, accusing song had scratched our comfort hard and long..." ...and he decided to GTFO of the failed nation before the cowards let The Hangman have him! Excuses for inaction are no badge of honor.

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  19. #19
    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZO6Vettever View Post
    You can open carry a machete here in Florida. Tell me that ain't the most intimidating weapon on earth!


    Quote Originally Posted by ixtow View Post
    Come at me bro!

    Bringing a knife to a gun fight, even a really big knife, is fail.

    Guns exist. This relegates knives to mere utility function, for those of us civilized enough to carry a gun...
    Where does he mention bringing a knife to a gun fight? Carrying a gun does NOT make one civilized, it is a tool, a person has to decide to be civilized that cannot be brought about by carrying a gun. A gun or a knife can both be used for self defense, shooting someone for just carrying a knife is not self defense and very much the same attitude as pro control people.
    INAL but best legal advice from a non lawyer is "Talk to a lawyer".

  20. #20
    Regular Member DamonK's Avatar
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    Re: Knives

    Quote Originally Posted by ixtow View Post
    Come at me bro!

    Bringing a knife to a gun fight, even a really big knife, is fail.

    Guns exist. This relegates knives to mere utility function, for those of us civilized enough to carry a gun...
    Actually, if you're within 5 ft of me, I'm not going for my gun. A gun does not make you invincible. Potentially in a bad situation, it can be a liability. I carry every day, but I don't count on having a gun to keep me safe. It is merely a tool that I incorporate into my battle plan.

    Sent from my DROID4 using Tapatalk 2

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    Quote Originally Posted by ixtow View Post
    Come at me bro!

    Bringing a knife to a gun fight, even a really big knife, is fail.

    Guns exist. This relegates knives to mere utility function, for those of us civilized enough to carry a gun...
    But, a good knife can come in handy- and serve as a good back-up to a sidearm, should something go wrong, run out of ammo, etc. I dont think anyone is suggesting "taking a knife to gunfight" on here.

    That aside, I began making, carrying and selling my own knives for over the last yr. or so. I always have a knife, of one type or other, on my person, with or without my sidearm. Often times, 2 or more ( Halligan neck knife, pocket-folder,plus on fixed-blade on the belt.)
    My larger ones, though, I mainly wear OC @/around the home. More for practical reasons, than any OC/CC concerns of the public, when out and about. Still working on sheath ideas for my larger ones, that are comfy to sit/drive/etc. with day-to-day.

    My latest pocket folder -Maple handles - just finshing this one, actually


    My larger one- bout 4.75" AUS8 blade


    This one, however, goes with me just about everywhere- handy little thing- I use it for odd tasks/chores around the home, and for cutting my leathers and hides for sheaths, and holsters-




    Another of my lil ones= with Purpleheart and Bocote handles - Maple handles for same, are in the works now.



    And, another of my big ones- this one, to be made with Purpleheart handles, is going to a Cav Scout troop in Afghanistan when she's finished.



    And the smaller twin of my Large one- a bit more practical for day-to-day OC carry -




    With Mahogany for the handles
    Last edited by j4l; 10-16-2012 at 02:09 PM.

  22. #22
    Regular Member rvrctyrngr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DamonK View Post
    Actually, if you're within 5 ft of me, I'm not going for my gun. A gun does not make you invincible. Potentially in a bad situation, it can be a liability. I carry every day, but I don't count on having a gun to keep me safe. It is merely a tool that I incorporate into my battle plan.

    Sent from my DROID4 using Tapatalk 2
    What he said.

    Bring a gun to my knife fight...you WILL lose!
    Director,
    Florida Carry, Inc.

    Detached reflection cannot be demanded in the presence of an uplifted knife.
    -Justice Oliver Wendel Holmes
    Brown v. United States, 1921

  23. #23
    Regular Member DamonK's Avatar
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    Re: Knives

    Quote Originally Posted by rvrctyrngr View Post
    What he said.

    Bring a gun to my knife fight...you WILL lose!
    You don't have a lot of close quarters experience do you? All I have to do is keep your strong side occupied, and you're done if you only have a gun. Guns are tools, nothing more. At distance, they are far superior. But in hand to hand, they are next to useless against someone that knows what they are doing. I don't bring knives to gunfights. I don't bring guns to knife fights. I bring myself with whatever tools I have available to any situation that I'm forced into.

    Guns don't make you invincible.

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  24. #24
    Regular Member RRobaldo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by j4l View Post
    But, a good knife can come in handy- and serve as a good back-up to a sidearm, should something go wrong, run out of ammo, etc. I dont think anyone is suggesting "taking a knife to gunfight" on here.

    That aside, I began making, carrying and selling my own knives for over the last yr. or so. I always have a knife, of one type or other, on my person, with or without my sidearm. Often times, 2 or more ( Halligan neck knife, pocket-folder,plus on fixed-blade on the belt.)
    My larger ones, though, I mainly wear OC @/around the home. More for practical reasons, than any OC/CC concerns of the public, when out and about. Still working on sheath ideas for my larger ones, that are comfy to sit/drive/etc. with day-to-day.

    My latest pocket folder -Maple handles - just finshing this one, actually


    My larger one- bout 4.75" AUS8 blade


    This one, however, goes with me just about everywhere- handy little thing- I use it for odd tasks/chores around the home, and for cutting my leathers and hides for sheaths, and holsters-




    Another of my lil ones= with Purpleheart and Bocote handles - Maple handles for same, are in the works now.



    And, another of my big ones- this one, to be made with Purpleheart handles, is going to a Cav Scout troop in Afghanistan when she's finished.



    And the smaller twin of my Large one- a bit more practical for day-to-day OC carry -




    With Mahogany for the handles
    Nice! Great to see a fellow knifemaker on the forum!

    I've been making my own blades for about 5 years, mostly O1 or 1095 high carbon fixed blades. More recently recently I've started venturing ventured into making liner lock folders. I'm also just now starting to venture into selling my work.
    Yes, I worry that I may be killed by my own gun...

    But my attacker will have to use it to beat me to death because it will be out of bullets!

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by RRobaldo View Post
    Nice! Great to see a fellow knifemaker on the forum!

    I've been making my own blades for about 5 years, mostly O1 or 1095 high carbon fixed blades. More recently recently I've started venturing ventured into making liner lock folders. I'm also just now starting to venture into selling my work.
    Fun,isnt it? And admittedly, addictive. I've got like 5 projects on the bench @ the moment lol.
    One super=annoying thing about the folders, though- all those tiny-arsed screws. I think I end up spending 2/3rd of my assembly-time, dropping, searching for, and trying to hold onto that tiny fng screws grrrrr

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