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Thread: Condition 3 Not a Good Idea. (Graphic Video)

  1. #1
    Regular Member crackersillo's Avatar
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    Condition 3 Not a Good Idea. (Graphic Video)

    i was just surfing oround and found this video i dont know if its new or old i just wanted to share it with you guys hope we can study it together (anything besides pointing out that condition 3 is not a good idea) and yet people ask us why we feel the need to carry a gun oround like if the world wasnt a F#"$# up place..
    and let me point out how quick the Sh!t hits the fan in a matter of seconds one inocent person is dead

    stay safe.

    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=086_1260862712
    Last edited by crackersillo; 07-21-2010 at 02:04 AM.

  2. #2
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    Very scary indeed, sadly this type of thing happens frequently and for no reason. Hopefully this sheds some light on why some people decide to OC/CC, and maybe it will convince someone new to start expressing their 2A right.

    Happy OC'in

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    jesus christ..

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    Regular Member usmcbess's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by crackersillo View Post
    i was just surfing oround and found this video i dont know if its new or old i just wanted to share it with you guys hope we can study it together (anything besides pointing out that condition 3 is not a good idea) and yet people ask us why we feel the need to carry a gun oround like if the world wasnt a F#"$# up place..
    and let me point out how quick the Sh!t hits the fan in a matter of seconds one inocent person is dead

    stay safe.

    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=086_1260862712
    This is a prime example why I carry condition 1.

  5. #5
    Regular Member paul@paul-fisher.com's Avatar
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    Did I miss it? How do we know the guy shot was in condition 3?

  6. #6
    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paul@paul-fisher.com View Post
    Did I miss it? How do we know the guy shot was in condition 3?
    He was definitely racking the slide. Could be a malfunction, could be an empty chamber.

  7. #7
    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    I found out the hard way... Carrying Concealed is just as bad. Buried under clothes is no place to hide your life preserver. I guess it's better than nothing, but when things go down fast, CC won't help you. Might as well not even have it.

    Having a gun does not make you bullet proof.

  8. #8
    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ixtow View Post
    I guess it's better than nothing, but when things go down fast, CC won't help you. Might as well not even have it..
    A hammerless revolver carried in a messenger bag, or in a coat or vest pocket can be fired at the hip level within the bag with decent combat accuracy to about 6 feet. I would take that with my hand firmly on it over a double stacked 45 OC'd in a retention holster.

    In addition to showing the dangers of unchambered, I think the video also demonstrates the combat ineffectiveness of handguns. Larry Vickers said it well when he described the handgun as the most difficult PDW to master. Even if you are loaded down with 18 high performance hollow points, a handgun isn't an unstoppable death ray. Realistically, a handgun against several other people with the same weapon, or against another person with superior firepower is being in a terrible situation with terrible odds, especially if the assailants are determined, courageous, and have any idea how to shoot.
    Last edited by Michigander; 07-21-2010 at 10:03 PM.

  9. #9
    Regular Member Phoenix David's Avatar
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    No the handgun is not an optimal weapon it's underpowered that's why IMO you should always carry the largest caliber with the hottest load you can control and train, train, train, train, train you are carrying that firearm so if needed you can defend your life. Do you think 20 minutes at the range once a month with a target that is standing still 5 feet away from you is going to cut the mustard when the SHTF?.

    You need to train with a variety of tactical simulations, drawing from the holster, shooting from cover, only partially visible targets, malfunction drills multiple adversaries , fire and movement, reloading, mental awareness. You need to develop that muscle memory so when the SHTF your body knows what to do.

    There are two things I have never heard from someone after a firefight, "Wish I had brought a smaller gun" and "I wish I had trained less"

    Just my opinion, your millage will vary.
    Freedom is a bit like sex, when your getting it you take it for granted, when you're not you want it bad, other people get mad at you for having it and others want to take it away from you so only they have it.

  10. #10
    Founder's Club Member ixtow's Avatar
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    Handguns are underpowered, and you make very good points. It's not just an opinion, it's empirical.

    Which is why it is so mind boggling that there is so much venom directed at people who carry something that's actually useful. Same old 'you're being a show off' 'you're hurting gun owner's interests' etc. Same crap anyone who open carried anything 5 years ago was being told. Now it's just 'those' kind of guns and the people who own/carry them.

    My PLR-16 is a hell of a lot more effective than my 1911. So is my collection of DIY AK pistols. More controllable, too, due to the two-point hand placement. 3-point if you tension a single-point sling. There is a lot more controllable firepower than trying to hang on to a desert eagle and re-locate pour target after each shot... And slung instead of holstered is quicker on the draw, too. Tho, I can come to target very fast with my 1911 cross-draw. No awkward yoink-and-point of a conventional draw.

    Looking to Government for guidance on what is a 'rifle' round and what is 'powerful enough' is a joke. The .40 S&W is a neutered 10mm. The .223 can get stuck in heavy jackets and clothing! I'll not doubt that .40 S&W is better than a .22lr, and so is .223. But real rifles are 7.62x51. .223 and 7.62x39, in their respective pistol platforms, are more effective and more controllable pistol rounds than .45 ACP and .50 AE. I can bring 20+ rounds of .223 controlably and safely on-target just about as fast as I can do 7 with .45 out of my 1911.

    But in spite of the obvious advantages, it's mocked in Clinton-style 'those' guns are bad idiocy.

  11. #11
    Regular Member Tomas's Avatar
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    I'm not sure that being in Condition 0 (gun in hand, one in the chamber, safety off) would have saved him. Yes, he may have gotten off a few rounds, but he would probably still be dead...
    No tyranny is so irksome as petty tyranny: The officious demands of policemen, government clerks, and electromechanical gadgets. -- Edward Abbey

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  12. #12
    Regular Member mFonz77's Avatar
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    Simply having a gun won't save anyone, even if it's OC'ed. Situational awareness (aka, your brain) is the tool that will save you, the handgun is a backup for that. In this video we can't see the entrance or see anything from the point of view of the person shot, but it appears to me he's looking down at the jewelry, in a zoned-out Condition White.

  13. #13
    McX
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    i can see the point, but one can also see other points; the guy had display cases, jewelry? If so, yeah condition 1 would be advised, he made mistakes, and let people in behind him, and in close proximity to him. plus if he was carrying condition 3 he should have instinctively rakked on draw. but no one is perfect when they're blasting away at you- and i fully acknowledge that.

  14. #14
    Regular Member GF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by McX View Post
    ...no one is perfect when they're blasting away at you- and i fully acknowledge that.
    I agree, but like Phoenix David stated, you have to make sure you train as much as possible to make sure you come out the one who stays alive. I can only imagine how it must feel to have to actually use your firearm to try and save your own life. It's a shame that this happened.

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    I rest my case.

    Few month ago I replied to a thread asking what weapon we carried. In SC, we HAVE to CC, but I carry a Colt .45 Single Action Revolver.
    Practice in different situations, shoulder holster with only a covor shirt to conceal, and old dependable engineeringb works for me.
    I can get it out fast, **** while drawing instinctively (muscle memory from practice), and I hit what I aim at.
    I was asked why I carry what I do, and not a modern auto.
    I rest my case.


    Quote Originally Posted by crackersillo View Post
    i was just surfing oround and found this video i dont know if its new or old i just wanted to share it with you guys hope we can study it together (anything besides pointing out that condition 3 is not a good idea) and yet people ask us why we feel the need to carry a gun oround like if the world wasnt a F#"$# up place..
    and let me point out how quick the Sh!t hits the fan in a matter of seconds one inocent person is dead

    stay safe.

    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=086_1260862712

  16. #16
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    So you guys are right that we can't exactly tell if he was racking to **** or racking to fix a jam..

    Either way he was racking. Maybe his round didn't go off the first pull of the trigger? Always a good idea to have a SA/DA for that "second strike" capability that gives you a second chance at hitting the primer to ignite the gunpowder.

    So a family feud is supposedly behind the shooting in that store. Brutal. Is the man in the video the actual intended victim or a bystander reacting to the shots fired at someone else? Not sure. And wow did those criminals actually come up on the victim, one kicked him in the face, and took the gun! That's ballsy!

    Anyway- yeah what a great incentive for carrying Condition 1 and having a DA trigger that can **** and release the hammer in one motion. I hope that mans ammunition didn't fail him.

  17. #17
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    How immature... on a firearms website.. the word "****" is blocked...

  18. #18
    Regular Member Sonora Rebel's Avatar
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    'Makes many of thses imaginary scenario's seen here from time to time rather cheezy... for lack of a better word. Gunfights are sudden, violent and rather final. No time for adjustments. You're either ready to go or not. 2nd place is dead.

  19. #19
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    looks like limp wristing

    a gun fight is a lot different then the range, it looks like he got a shot and had a jam.
    I wish I knew what he carried. The bad guys came in guns blazing though, he really didn't have much of a chance.
    Not many could have even got a shot off.

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