For God's Sake, Help Me Out Here

I've seen a myriad of posts on this forum stating that you cannot OC into an establishment that serves alcohol for on premises consumption. I have also seen a myriad of posts saying that you CAN as long as you DO NOT consume any alcohol. A little help here would be nice. Thanks all!

SixtyEightWhiskey said:

I've seen a myriad of posts on this forum stating that you cannot OC into an establishment that serves alcohol for on premises consumption. I have also seen a myriad of posts saying that you CAN as long as you DO NOT consume any alcohol. A little help here would be nice. Thanks all!

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My recommendation is to not rely on the questionable advice you get from reading messages in gun forums and go straight to the source, ARS 4-229:
http://www.azleg.state.az.us/FormatDocument.asp?inDoc=/ars/4/00229.htm&Title=4&DocType=ARS.

In order to carry in a place where alcohol is served:
1. You must possess a valid CCW permit, and have it with you.
2. You must carry concealed (which makes a joke of the whole law).
3. The establishment must NOT post a "no firearms" sign. Bear in mind that until July 29 when a new law takes effect, the sign does NOT have to be visible. It is supposed to be near the liquor license which could be in a back hallway somewhere (that's how Chipotle's handles it).
4. You may not consume alcohol.

Bear in mind that the law does not distinguish between bars and restaruants - it applies to any place that serves alcohol for consumption.

Fred

Tyvm

azcdlfred said:

My recommendation is to not rely on the questionable advice you get from reading messages in gun forums and go straight to the source, ARS 4-229:
http://www.azleg.state.az.us/FormatDocument.asp?inDoc=/ars/4/00229.htm&Title=4&DocType=ARS.

In order to carry in a place where alcohol is served:
1. You must possess a valid CCW permit, and have it with you.
2. You must carry concealed (which makes a joke of the whole law).
3. The establishment must NOT post a "no firearms" sign. Bear in mind that until July 29 when a new law takes effect, the sign does NOT have to be visible. It is supposed to be near the liquor license which could be in a back hallway somewhere (that's how Chipotle's handles it).
4. You may not consume alcohol.

Bear in mind that the law does not distinguish between bars and restaruants - it applies to any place that serves alcohol for consumption.

Fred

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Fred, am I remembering correctly that even after the 29th of this month (when Constitutional CC takes effect) that one will still have to have the optional CC permit to carry into bars/restaurants? Lots of folks still seem to be confused on that point. TIA!

PavePusher said:

Fred, am I remembering correctly that even after the 29th of this month (when Constitutional CC takes effect) that one will still have to have the optional CC permit to carry into bars/restaurants? Lots of folks still seem to be confused on that point. TIA!

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The Constitutional Carry law does not change the Restaurant Carry law. You'll still need a CCW permit and you must have it with you, and you must carry concealed in order to legally carry into a place that serves alcohol and that doesn't bar firearms.

As an FYI, we (AzCDL) were able to get a change added to a liquor bill that requires the liquor license to be posted "in a conspicuous public area." Since the no firearms sign must be posted near the liquor license, that means there is less chance of you walking into a place and break the law. There is NO requirement that the sign be in the front window. The absence of a sign in the front window is not any indication that the place allows firearms. Look for their liquor license to find the no firearms sign. This new law also takes effect on July 29.

Fred

azcdlfred said:

My recommendation is to not rely on the questionable advice you get from reading messages in gun forums and go straight to the source, ARS 4-229:
http://www.azleg.state.az.us/FormatDocument.asp?inDoc=/ars/4/00229.htm&Title=4&DocType=ARS.

In order to carry in a place where alcohol is served:
1. You must possess a valid CCW permit, and have it with you.
2. You must carry concealed (which makes a joke of the whole law).
3. The establishment must NOT post a "no firearms" sign. Bear in mind that until July 29 when a new law takes effect, the sign does NOT have to be visible. It is supposed to be near the liquor license which could be in a back hallway somewhere (that's how Chipotle's handles it).
4. You may not consume alcohol.

Bear in mind that the law does not distinguish between bars and restaruants - it applies to any place that serves alcohol for consumption.

Fred

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Precisely correct. And the joke is as follows for those who aren't connecting the dots:

The Authors claimed that only people who have a permit will obey the law and not drink alcohol. Yet, there is no way to tell who these people are since the same law requires them to conceal. So, how can this prevent someone without a permit from concealing and drinking? Is carrying and drinking even a problem anyway? If you wanted the law to be enforceable, it would have to REQUIRE OC, so you could actually SEE who had a gun and wasn't allowed to drink...

It's a double-whammy of circular stupid. All that tax money dedicated to writing a law in just the right way so that it cannot possibly perform it's supposed intended purpose...

ixtow said:

Precisely correct. And the joke is as follows for those who aren't connecting the dots:

The Authors claimed that only people who have a permit will obey the law and not drink alcohol. Yet, there is no way to tell who these people are since the same law requires them to conceal. So, how can this prevent someone without a permit from concealing and drinking? Is carrying and drinking even a problem anyway? If you wanted the law to be enforceable, it would have to REQUIRE OC, so you could actually SEE who had a gun and wasn't allowed to drink...

It's a double-whammy of circular stupid. All that tax money dedicated to writing a law in just the right way so that it cannot possibly perform it's supposed intended purpose...

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Wait a minute. Laws have purposes?