ezzekial
New member
What i least expected to happen in Arizona, happened.
Its a bit of a read, if something isnt clear, feel free to ask, ill try to clear it up as best i can.
I was OC at check in, and around the hotel for most of the day. Walked down to the front desk at night to get a blanket for the room. 2 security guards seemed to be shooting the **** with each other and the lady at the desk, who was on the phone. They saw me, and kindly informed me that the bars in the hotel are posted, which is fine by me. Started talking guns, one of them said he would be carrying if he could, but had to leave it in his truck. My age came up at some point and they insisted i was not legally allowed to posses a handgun in AZ. I explained that its 18 to OC and own, just cant buy from FFL. They were still skeptical, and said that thats not what they were told in their law enforcement class. I encouraged them to look into it, and that i was sure it was 18, had been carrying all over AZ with no issues. They told me the blanket would be right up.
About 30 minutes later, there was a knock on the door, expecting the blanket i open it, and 2 different older security guards are standing there. They tell me they were informed there is a firearm in the room and they need to see it. I said i wasnt going to let them into the room, the one who seemed to be a manager or sorts had his foot in the door and started saying that he can come in since it is their property, dont need a warrant, and they all allowed to do health and wellness checks. Even after saying that he will come in, he didnt walk through the door. When i asked if i had to show it to them (i know im not required to) they said yes since its private property, i have to show them the firearm. I walked into the next room (my shirt had slipped over it while watching tv. Concealed...yeah, i was in my hotel room, not really a big deal, wasnt planning on going anywhere without ensuring its uncovered) Pulled my holster off, unloaded, and stuck it back into the holster with slide locked back. I walked back to where they could see me from the door, holding the holster by one of the straps near my crotch. They wanted me to hand it to them.
Yeah....right....do you want my car keys too?
I flat out said no, and then the arguments really started. I asked if i could set the gun down, bald guy said yeah, right there pointing at the ground next to the door. I said im putting it on the counter, and placed it on the kitchen counter.
Now the supervisor started saying that they want me to put it in a lock box, to which i explained i dont feel comfortable with that, and i carry everywhere i go. They started asking why, and saying its pointless. Here is where the order of what was said got jumbled up in my mind, so im just going to cover the key points, in whichever order i remember them, not chronologically.
They said that i would get arrested for carrying under 21. Asked me if i had been ID'ed by the police for the gun yet. I was scaring the customers and employees. If i was 21, they wouldn't have a problem with me OC around the hotel (except the bars) if it were unloaded. That im illegally in possession of a handgun. The shops in town wont sell to anyone under 21. Kept asking me if i wanted them to call PD to get everything settled. Also kept saying that since its private property they make the rules. Threated PD a couple more times, and that they could kick me out with no refund.
I was responding during this between the two of them interrupting me a couple times., trying to explain how FFL is different from private party sales, and the law is 18. And that ive been around cops in AZ with no issues. I ignored their threats to call police, and said im not arguing the private property deal, and that i understand that.
They finally tried to tell me to just leave it in my room unloaded, and i said i need to get it out of the hotel whenever i leave, since i carry everywhere, and will not stop. They started saying that any drunk out there could snatch it. I tried to explain my retention holster and retention training, just like the police use, who are around drunks all the time, and the bald guy snapped saying im not a cop, and that he has "Police experience" (I saw at least 2 tattoos. One covering most of his right forearm, and another large one on the other arm.) I have a feeling his police experience was the Law enforcement class all the employees had to take, where they got the 21 only info.
He also mentioned that they have had guns used in the hotel before, to which i replied is an excellent reason to have it with me for personal protection, they both started saying how thats not allowed, and how they control all guns in the hotel, and the previous gun incident is the reason for them to control all guns, and not carry themselves. How they found the logic to say that a previous gun incident is a reason from them to not carry is beyond me. I said that probably half of the rooms had a guest with a CCW, they said they dont care, and that im under 21. The bald guy then said that somebody could come into my room, tie me up, and use the gun against other people.
Again, i said that the exterior doors are not locked, the stairwells at each wing are open, anybody could just walk in, thats not very controlled, and asked if they can guarantee my safety. They responded by saying they control everything, and ignored the safety comment. Also, bald guy started saying that he doesnt know whats going to happen if i get high or drunk and start shooting off the gun, etc.
Finally, it came down to them telling me to carry it out to the vehicle in a plastic bag whenever i leave. I said i cannot as that would be concealing, and the bald guy with police experience tried telling me its not since it is not on my person. I tried to explain that if the bag/briefcase/backpack in on me/in my hand, its the same thing, and that they were trying to tell me to break the law, etc. He asked me if i had ever peed on a wall or tree in public, i said no, he said he highly doubted that, and that i would be fine carrying in the bag to the car. Also asked if i had a case for it to carry in, again, i said no, im on vacation between two states where OC is legal, no need for one, they told me i should have one.
I said i wouldn't do it, and that i could keep my arm over it, and have a friend on my right side between the side door and the car, they said they dont know my friend...again, how is that relevant? The final decision was kind of hazy, they said to keep it unloaded in my room, and not to carry it on their property.
Towards the end of the conversation i was asking them if they would look up the laws so that they were properly informed, and got a flat out NO. I tried asking a couple times, and the manager just said it didnt matter, and he didnt care, and that the age was 21, and if i was 21, i could carry unloaded.
Now, here is the deal, it seems that they own most of the shops next to the bridge, as well as a large chunk of the walkway next to the water. I have not run into the guys again, but im not exactly sure what would happen if im on their property, or in one of the shops the lease out, and they try to tell me to leave. I have a feeling that even though they ended the encounter at night by telling me that they arent trying to give me a hard time or come down on me, that if they saw me on their sidewalk, they would.
The other issue is, i am here with with a friend and his family. Its not my hotel room, i have no ride back to town other then them. Obviously i cannot leave, or switch hotels.
Normally, i wouldnt have had an issue with PD, since i know im not breaking the law, but i dont need them to try to trespass me after PD shows up.
Any tips?
Seems like they would be ok with it if i was 21, so the only reason they arent, is because they think im breaking the law, even though they tried to tell me to conceal.
Pretty sure they cant come into the room unless it actually is a health and wellness check or emergency, looking for a gun doesnt fall under those, is that correct?
Im just trying to think of what else i could do, i dont want to run into issues, even though im going straight from a back stair case to the car, or onto the public walk way everybody walks on, even though it is their property.
Thanks guys. In better news, talked guns with a Chevron clerk, he has a 1911, and a female clerk from one of the store the hotel leases out. She was all for it, informed of the laws, just asked what kind of gun it was.
Its a bit of a read, if something isnt clear, feel free to ask, ill try to clear it up as best i can.
I was OC at check in, and around the hotel for most of the day. Walked down to the front desk at night to get a blanket for the room. 2 security guards seemed to be shooting the **** with each other and the lady at the desk, who was on the phone. They saw me, and kindly informed me that the bars in the hotel are posted, which is fine by me. Started talking guns, one of them said he would be carrying if he could, but had to leave it in his truck. My age came up at some point and they insisted i was not legally allowed to posses a handgun in AZ. I explained that its 18 to OC and own, just cant buy from FFL. They were still skeptical, and said that thats not what they were told in their law enforcement class. I encouraged them to look into it, and that i was sure it was 18, had been carrying all over AZ with no issues. They told me the blanket would be right up.
About 30 minutes later, there was a knock on the door, expecting the blanket i open it, and 2 different older security guards are standing there. They tell me they were informed there is a firearm in the room and they need to see it. I said i wasnt going to let them into the room, the one who seemed to be a manager or sorts had his foot in the door and started saying that he can come in since it is their property, dont need a warrant, and they all allowed to do health and wellness checks. Even after saying that he will come in, he didnt walk through the door. When i asked if i had to show it to them (i know im not required to) they said yes since its private property, i have to show them the firearm. I walked into the next room (my shirt had slipped over it while watching tv. Concealed...yeah, i was in my hotel room, not really a big deal, wasnt planning on going anywhere without ensuring its uncovered) Pulled my holster off, unloaded, and stuck it back into the holster with slide locked back. I walked back to where they could see me from the door, holding the holster by one of the straps near my crotch. They wanted me to hand it to them.
Yeah....right....do you want my car keys too?
I flat out said no, and then the arguments really started. I asked if i could set the gun down, bald guy said yeah, right there pointing at the ground next to the door. I said im putting it on the counter, and placed it on the kitchen counter.
Now the supervisor started saying that they want me to put it in a lock box, to which i explained i dont feel comfortable with that, and i carry everywhere i go. They started asking why, and saying its pointless. Here is where the order of what was said got jumbled up in my mind, so im just going to cover the key points, in whichever order i remember them, not chronologically.
They said that i would get arrested for carrying under 21. Asked me if i had been ID'ed by the police for the gun yet. I was scaring the customers and employees. If i was 21, they wouldn't have a problem with me OC around the hotel (except the bars) if it were unloaded. That im illegally in possession of a handgun. The shops in town wont sell to anyone under 21. Kept asking me if i wanted them to call PD to get everything settled. Also kept saying that since its private property they make the rules. Threated PD a couple more times, and that they could kick me out with no refund.
I was responding during this between the two of them interrupting me a couple times., trying to explain how FFL is different from private party sales, and the law is 18. And that ive been around cops in AZ with no issues. I ignored their threats to call police, and said im not arguing the private property deal, and that i understand that.
They finally tried to tell me to just leave it in my room unloaded, and i said i need to get it out of the hotel whenever i leave, since i carry everywhere, and will not stop. They started saying that any drunk out there could snatch it. I tried to explain my retention holster and retention training, just like the police use, who are around drunks all the time, and the bald guy snapped saying im not a cop, and that he has "Police experience" (I saw at least 2 tattoos. One covering most of his right forearm, and another large one on the other arm.) I have a feeling his police experience was the Law enforcement class all the employees had to take, where they got the 21 only info.
He also mentioned that they have had guns used in the hotel before, to which i replied is an excellent reason to have it with me for personal protection, they both started saying how thats not allowed, and how they control all guns in the hotel, and the previous gun incident is the reason for them to control all guns, and not carry themselves. How they found the logic to say that a previous gun incident is a reason from them to not carry is beyond me. I said that probably half of the rooms had a guest with a CCW, they said they dont care, and that im under 21. The bald guy then said that somebody could come into my room, tie me up, and use the gun against other people.
Again, i said that the exterior doors are not locked, the stairwells at each wing are open, anybody could just walk in, thats not very controlled, and asked if they can guarantee my safety. They responded by saying they control everything, and ignored the safety comment. Also, bald guy started saying that he doesnt know whats going to happen if i get high or drunk and start shooting off the gun, etc.
Finally, it came down to them telling me to carry it out to the vehicle in a plastic bag whenever i leave. I said i cannot as that would be concealing, and the bald guy with police experience tried telling me its not since it is not on my person. I tried to explain that if the bag/briefcase/backpack in on me/in my hand, its the same thing, and that they were trying to tell me to break the law, etc. He asked me if i had ever peed on a wall or tree in public, i said no, he said he highly doubted that, and that i would be fine carrying in the bag to the car. Also asked if i had a case for it to carry in, again, i said no, im on vacation between two states where OC is legal, no need for one, they told me i should have one.
I said i wouldn't do it, and that i could keep my arm over it, and have a friend on my right side between the side door and the car, they said they dont know my friend...again, how is that relevant? The final decision was kind of hazy, they said to keep it unloaded in my room, and not to carry it on their property.
Towards the end of the conversation i was asking them if they would look up the laws so that they were properly informed, and got a flat out NO. I tried asking a couple times, and the manager just said it didnt matter, and he didnt care, and that the age was 21, and if i was 21, i could carry unloaded.
Now, here is the deal, it seems that they own most of the shops next to the bridge, as well as a large chunk of the walkway next to the water. I have not run into the guys again, but im not exactly sure what would happen if im on their property, or in one of the shops the lease out, and they try to tell me to leave. I have a feeling that even though they ended the encounter at night by telling me that they arent trying to give me a hard time or come down on me, that if they saw me on their sidewalk, they would.
The other issue is, i am here with with a friend and his family. Its not my hotel room, i have no ride back to town other then them. Obviously i cannot leave, or switch hotels.
Normally, i wouldnt have had an issue with PD, since i know im not breaking the law, but i dont need them to try to trespass me after PD shows up.
Any tips?
Seems like they would be ok with it if i was 21, so the only reason they arent, is because they think im breaking the law, even though they tried to tell me to conceal.
Pretty sure they cant come into the room unless it actually is a health and wellness check or emergency, looking for a gun doesnt fall under those, is that correct?
Im just trying to think of what else i could do, i dont want to run into issues, even though im going straight from a back stair case to the car, or onto the public walk way everybody walks on, even though it is their property.
Thanks guys. In better news, talked guns with a Chevron clerk, he has a 1911, and a female clerk from one of the store the hotel leases out. She was all for it, informed of the laws, just asked what kind of gun it was.
