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South Chipotle in Longmont.

Superlite27

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 12, 2007
Messages
1,277
Location
God's Country, Missouri
"How do you deal with a guy like that?"

I'd stop pointing the gun at his head.

Maybe you could tell me where, in all firearm safety rules you've ever read, where it says "ALWAYS POINT THE MUZZLE IN A SAFE DIRECTION.....BUT IF YOUR HAND ISN'T ON IT, IT'S O.K.". I must have missed this one. There must be some small disclaimer where folks wearing horizontal rigs are exempt from "ALWAYS". You must be following the "MOST THE TIME POINT THE MUZZLE IN A SAFE DIRECTION" rule intended solely for horizontal rig wearers.

I was under the assumption that one of the reasons we open carriers carried openly was to familiarize the general public with normal everyday citizens who responsibly carry firearms in order to gain acceptance.

You must think ******* the public off by letting them look at the hollow point chambered in your hogleg must be an effective way of gaining their acceptance.

Maybe you could print out your horizontal rig wearers exemption to that "ALWAYS" part so you could tape it to your back for those staring down the barrel of your heater to read so they'll be comforted.

I know it won't go off. You know it won't go off. 99% of the people familiar with firearms know it won't go off. Everyone in the world can know it won't go off. So?

I'm still googling the exeption to the #1 rule of firearm safety. I can't seem to find it. Maybe you could point it out for me?
 

Gunslinger

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Mar 6, 2008
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Free, Colorado, USA
Nothing at all wrong with your mode of carry. That knucklehead had a better chance of getting into a head-on collision on the way home while simultaneously scratching a winning lottery ticket and getting a lap dance from Jessica Alba than he did of your gun just deciding all on its own to fire just because it happened to be in the horizontal position. What a jackass. I'd think a forum of gun toters would understand that as well, but people never cease to amaze me.
You don't point the muzzle of the gun at something you don't intend to shoot, loaded or not, cocked and locked or condition three. That's the second rule of firearms handling--second only to treat and assume every gun as loaded. I don't want any gun pointed at me.
 

mahkagari

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Guys, let's not dissolve into infighting and flamewars on this. We have to keep our eyes on the bigger picture and common goal. Namely, how do I get a lap dance from Jessica Alba and what do I do to sublimate until Machete is out on DVD and I can watch her and Michelle Rodriguez go all bad-ass pistolera? I'm trying Amanda Peet in The Whole Nine Yards and it's just not working.
 

entartet17

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Messages
206
Location
Aurora, Colorado, USA
Guys, let's not dissolve into infighting and flamewars on this. We have to keep our eyes on the bigger picture and common goal. Namely, how do I get a lap dance from Jessica Alba and what do I do to sublimate until Machete is out on DVD and I can watch her and Michelle Rodriguez go all bad-ass pistolera? I'm trying Amanda Peet in The Whole Nine Yards and it's just not working.

lmao. Greatest post ever.
 

ixtow

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Nov 25, 2006
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Location
Suwannee County, FL
How do you deal with a person like that? Same way, regardless of topic.

"Sir, you are a liar and an a$$hole; I've no need to comply with either."

The first rule of firearms safety involves pointing a weapon. If it is not in your hand, you can't point it. The argument is absurd. Where is the gun pointing when it's in a gun case? Leaning against a wall? I'm sure it points at an airplane or two in the course of the day...

Pointing a gun, as referred to in the first rule of firearms safety, means that it's in your hand and you're pointing it at stuff. A deliberately false broadening of this rule is merely the manufacture of an excuse to pick a fight and be an a$$hole, too.
 
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Superlite27

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Location
God's Country, Missouri
I think deliberately narrowing it in order to justify behavior you have no intention of altering is just as disingenuous.

The fact is, one of the reasons we carry is to "normalize" the sight of everyday citizens responsibly carrying firearms. I agree that the argument of folks being unnesseccarily frightened of firearms can be carried over to this argument, as well. However, I PERSONALLY would not want to sit behind anyone while looking at the nose of a chambered hollow point regardless of whether or not it was being physically "pointed".

In order for folks to be accustomed to firearms it is necessary to carry them in public. Therefore, folks being frightened by them is mooted by the fact that it is NESSECCARY in order to open carry.

How is mouthing off to a citizen uncomfortable with looking directly down the pipe of a loaded gun NECESSARY?

Please explain how ******* the general public off is the ideal method of "winning their hearts and minds"? When I carry in public, I try to set the image of approachable, friendly citizen into the mind of anyone forming an opinion of gun owners.

Maybe someone can tell me how making people think "Wow. Those open carriers are assholes!" helps us become more accepted? After all, your behavior cannot be modified, correct? It's the poor sucker that has to sit looking at the biggest black hole he's ever seen that needs to alter his.

BTW: If it's the actual act of pointing a weapon that makes it unsafe, why do people clear their weapons before going down range? Wouldn't the act of simply setting them down be O.K.? After all, they are no onger "pointed" at you by hand. We all know guns don't just "go off". Why unload them?
 

mahkagari

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I never really noticed what a bad actress Amanda Peet is. Not that Michelle Rodriguez or Jessica Alba are Oscar winners, but if you put them in the hands of a director like Robert Rodriguez, well...one even stops caring about how lame Salma's believability is.
 
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cscitney87

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Joined
Aug 13, 2009
Messages
1,250
Location
Lakewood, Colorado, USA
For the record, I wouldn't sit there with a gun pointed at me, either.

Ditto


"Always keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction."


That goes for all holsters.. If your muzzle's not pointed DOWN when holstered... you should understand that the muzzle is pointed out. Whatever the angle of your muzzle- if it's not down at the ground- it's going to intersect with the path of a human being.


There are only a few rules to remember in firearms safety...

Treat all firearms like they are loaded

Always keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction

Keep your finger off the trigger until you are ready to shoot
 
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Gunslinger

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2008
Messages
3,853
Location
Free, Colorado, USA
How do you deal with a person like that? Same way, regardless of topic.

"Sir, you are a liar and an a$$hole; I've no need to comply with either."

The first rule of firearms safety involves pointing a weapon. If it is not in your hand, you can't point it. The argument is absurd. Where is the gun pointing when it's in a gun case? Leaning against a wall? I'm sure it points at an airplane or two in the course of the day...

Pointing a gun, as referred to in the first rule of firearms safety, means that it's in your hand and you're pointing it at stuff. A deliberately false broadening of this rule is merely the manufacture of an excuse to pick a fight and be an a$$hole, too.
If you lay a firearm on a table, do you point the muzzle at the guy sitting across from you? Most guns in cases are unloaded. If it leans against a wall it's pointing up. What if the guy perceives a threat and grabs at the 1911 in the horizontal rig, cocked and locked--until he accidently pushes the safety down and his finger ends up on the trigger as he rushes his draw, or doesn't know how to draw? It's not just the present state in the holster, it's what 'could' happen. That's why generally accepted rules of firearm safety exist.
 

entartet17

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Messages
206
Location
Aurora, Colorado, USA
Ditto

That goes for all holsters.. If your muzzle's not pointed DOWN when holstered... you should understand that the muzzle is pointed out. Whatever the angle of your muzzle- if it's not down at the ground- it's going to intersect with the path of a human being.

What if you're carrying muzzle down and go to the second floor of building? Now everyone below you is in "danger." What if you live in interior apartment? There are people above you, below you, and on both sides of you. Are you just not allowed to have loaded gun?

It all boils down to people treating guns like they're death machines prone to magically fly out holsters and gun down little children. It's absurd. I have no problem with horizontal rigs or any other method of carry.
 

Kingfish

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 10, 2007
Messages
1,276
Location
Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Shoot. I can't figure out the polls on this thing. Someone will have to help me so we can settle this with a simple vote.

http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/faq.php?faq=vb3_reading_posting#faq_vb3_polls
To create a poll when you post a new thread, simply click the 'Yes, post a poll with this thread' checkbox at the bottom of the page, and set the number of possible responses you want to include.
When you click the submit button, you will be taken to the poll creation page, where you can specify the question and the list of responses you want to include.
 
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entartet17

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Messages
206
Location
Aurora, Colorado, USA
That was rhetorical I assume? Because there would be a floor between my bullet and other human beings. In the case of the South Chipotle in Longmont- no such barrier exists.

Apples and Oranges, pal.

Yeah, because floors are made of bullet proof materials </sarcasm>. The whole point is that you were arguing to keep a gun holstered muzzle down because that's safe. Well, if there is someone below you then "it's going to intersect with the path of a human being." If muzzle down is the only safe way to carry then one can never be in a second floor of any building while carrying a gun, which is ridiculous.
 
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centsi

Campaign Veteran
Joined
Feb 11, 2008
Messages
392
Location
Castle Rock, Colorado, USA
If you have a properly functioning modern firearm in a holster that covers the trigger, that firearm should be safe pointing in any direction.

The problem with OCing in a manner where the firearm is pointing at someone ELSE is that someone else doesn't know if that firearm is mechanically sound and in a proper holster. When someone is starring down the barrel of your gun, there probably isn't any way to assure them that the firearm is safe.

Even knowledgeable gun owners in that situation are likely to think:

"There is no absolutely 100% safe firearm. Firearms are mechanical and mechanical objects can and do fail. Sure 99+% of all NDs occur as a result of human failure, and not mechanical, but am I willing to sit here and stare down that barrel and take that chance, no matter how small? No thank you."
 

mahkagari

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Apr 28, 2009
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If you have a properly functioning modern firearm in a holster that covers the trigger, that firearm should be safe pointing in any direction.

The problem with OCing in a manner where the firearm is pointing at someone ELSE is that someone else doesn't know if that firearm is mechanically sound and in a proper holster. When someone is starring down the barrel of your gun, there probably isn't any way to assure them that the firearm is safe.

Even knowledgeable gun owners in that situation are likely to think:

"There is no absolutely 100% safe firearm. Firearms are mechanical and mechanical objects can and do fail. Sure 99+% of all NDs occur as a result of human failure, and not mechanical, but am I willing to sit here and stare down that barrel and take that chance, no matter how small? No thank you."

Yeah. Better to wear a coat or a shirt over the shoulder holstered firearm. It's safer that way. :p
 
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