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A Rant? Maybe. Preaching to the Choir, I hope.

Mudjack

Banned
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
Messages
104
Location
Las Vegas, Nevada, USA
Defense is Death

What in the world do you mean by your last sentence? THAT'S gibberish if I ever heard it. NO ONE trains for violence, at least not law abiding citizens. We train to defend ourselves AGAINST violence! Excuse me! I am a woman and I certainly DO prefer to carry a gun to give me a fighting chance against a criminal who wants to rob me, rape me, or murder me, or all of the above! Even if you are trained in the martial arts, you cannot move faster than a bullet. Quit feeding this kid a bunch of BS!

Young man, train your brain and your gun together at the same time; you have to use the first in order to use the second one.


What I mean by my last sentence is just exactly what I said. I said: 'Most people who are trained properly for violence prefer not to carry anything at all.' And, again, that is just exactly what I meant.

The professionals, including myself, who train for violence, mostly complain that guns and knives and all the other ancillary tools one may have on his person in a violent encounter are most likely just things that are going to get in the way while the incident is occurring and could hang us up.

I still prefer to carry a gun on my person, yes. But that is for personal reasons, not tactical reasons. I will survive the situation, gun or no gun, no matter what. I know this already, and so the gun for me is just a snap-on tool that might help me be more effective in violence.

I have been training for violence for about twenty years now. The professional trainers I work with are the best in the world and know how to get the job done the right way the first time around. We are all sane, socialized, law-abiding citizens, and we train and train earnestly for violence every week.

This is what keeps us out of trouble and out of violence. Because the more you know about violence, the less you need to worry about it.

If anyone is feeding this "kid" a bunch of BS -- it's you.

I carry a gun for no other reason than it is a simple kinetic energy dispenser that might make my job of killing someone that much easier should the need to kill someone arise. And that, in a nutshell, is the real reason I carry a gun: because I might have to kill somebody--and the gun is the quickest, most powerful way to get that job done. I will still be able to kill him with my bare hands, a bat or a knife, but the gun is going to save a whole lotta' labor for me, should I happen to have on handy.

Guns are made for killing and nothing else.

Violence is a messy, ugly, dirty business. All guns do is make it easier to get the messy, dirty, ugly job done.

Guns, and certainly all weapons in general, are simple labor saving devices.
 

Mudjack

Banned
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
Messages
104
Location
Las Vegas, Nevada, USA
*pointing finger*

Elite Ninja Syndrom. Occasionally causes massive swollen cranium.

Lol @ simmonsjoe

Elite I Don't Know What To Say Syndrome. So instead point fingers at others and make fun without offering anything constructive.

What's your method for dealing with violence? What principles, methods, tools, knowledge and experience are you hoping will be there for you when the time comes?
 

Midnight0489

New member
Joined
Jul 29, 2010
Messages
7
Location
Raleigh, NC
So many to reply to...

Well, I need to check the forums more often. =P So many people have replied, and I've gotten slightly behind on responding on thread I started!

I mean this to be in no way offensive, but only a good, old fashioned debate. I disagree with several parts of your assessments, though, mudjack. While I have already stated that I agree that the brain is the most important tool in ensuring survival in this world, I don't think carrying a gun for defense is foolish, as you appear to be making it out. If that's not your intention, please forgive me. I may not be the most properly trained, but I spend a lot of time at the range/country (Grays Creek) in an attempt to foster a sense of comfortableness with my firearm.

I am in no way suggesting that your ability to defend yourself without a firearm is in question. I do, however, sense a slight bit of arrogance in your words, especially as you claim to be able to survive any situation, gun or not. Given that you have no idea, and nor do I for that matter!, what may or may not occur that day, I feel as though being prepared is always the right thing to do. You may feel comfortable if you were accosted by multiple adversaries, or even multiple people with guns. These things are very unlikely, but very possible, so please don't say I'm just making up things. I'm only saying that with my limited skills (mostly Hapkido and Taekwondo for 3 years while going through high school), I feel as though unarmed, I may be unable to walk the streets of this world safely.

Also, to those that have posted, I take back my earlier, hasty comments regarding the magical disappearance of all firearms. What I really meant to say was that it would be great if the BGs didn't have them. I personally enjoy target shooting, skeet shooting, and overall, the experience of hunting. As I said, when I was growing up, my Father used to spend time with me doing just that, and I always enjoyed it. However, I still believe that the original intentions of firearms was to make war. Have they evolved since then? Certainly.

I definitely agree that a firearm can be an equalizer, even in a situation with a trained individual. If a trained individual was invincible, I doubt an LEO's occupation would be so dangerous. And 45ACP4Me, I never thought of that! A bigger target, indeed! :D

I personally feel like those that are properly trained for violence understand that violence is a very real threat, and that in certain situations, the need to carry is justified. Therefore, I make the connection that you must always be prepared.

All in all, whether I agree with you or not, I appreciate all of the comments, advice, and criticism.
 

Ruby

Regular Member
Joined
May 5, 2010
Messages
1,201
Location
Renton, Washington, USA
*pointing finger*

Elite Ninja Syndrom. Occasionally causes massive swollen cranium.

Agreed. Doesn't sound very sane to me. I would be willing to bet that if he was shot, he would bleed like anyone else. I DON'T train for violence, don't experience much of it in my life, but I do carry a .45 in the event I need to deal with it.
 

Ruby

Regular Member
Joined
May 5, 2010
Messages
1,201
Location
Renton, Washington, USA
Mudjack

By my last post, I did not mean to infer that I wished you any harm, nothing could be further from the truth, I have nothing against you. I simply meant that you are human, though you seem to try to make yourself out to be so much more and so much better than everyone else. Your arrogance is very unattractive.
 

Mudjack

Banned
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
Messages
104
Location
Las Vegas, Nevada, USA
Well, I need to check the forums more often. =P So many people have replied, and I've gotten slightly behind on responding on thread I started!

I mean this to be in no way offensive, but only a good, old fashioned debate. I disagree with several parts of your assessments, though, mudjack. While I have already stated that I agree that the brain is the most important tool in ensuring survival in this world, I don't think carrying a gun for defense is foolish, as you appear to be making it out. If that's not your intention, please forgive me. I may not be the most properly trained, but I spend a lot of time at the range/country (Grays Creek) in an attempt to foster a sense of comfortableness with my firearm.

I am in no way suggesting that your ability to defend yourself without a firearm is in question. I do, however, sense a slight bit of arrogance in your words, especially as you claim to be able to survive any situation, gun or not. Given that you have no idea, and nor do I for that matter!, what may or may not occur that day, I feel as though being prepared is always the right thing to do. You may feel comfortable if you were accosted by multiple adversaries, or even multiple people with guns. These things are very unlikely, but very possible, so please don't say I'm just making up things. I'm only saying that with my limited skills (mostly Hapkido and Taekwondo for 3 years while going through high school), I feel as though unarmed, I may be unable to walk the streets of this world safely.

Also, to those that have posted, I take back my earlier, hasty comments regarding the magical disappearance of all firearms. What I really meant to say was that it would be great if the BGs didn't have them. I personally enjoy target shooting, skeet shooting, and overall, the experience of hunting. As I said, when I was growing up, my Father used to spend time with me doing just that, and I always enjoyed it. However, I still believe that the original intentions of firearms was to make war. Have they evolved since then? Certainly.

I definitely agree that a firearm can be an equalizer, even in a situation with a trained individual. If a trained individual was invincible, I doubt an LEO's occupation would be so dangerous. And 45ACP4Me, I never thought of that! A bigger target, indeed! :D

I personally feel like those that are properly trained for violence understand that violence is a very real threat, and that in certain situations, the need to carry is justified. Therefore, I make the connection that you must always be prepared.

All in all, whether I agree with you or not, I appreciate all of the comments, advice, and criticism.

I appreciate your thoughts. Yes, you are correct. You are not understanding me.

But that is not uncommon with what I do. That is not an insult to you, but a common occurrence in talking about violence. I am used to it. What I do is not for everyone. But what I do works. That's the important thing.

People have been spoon fed the same old lines over and over again throughout the years. They don't know any different. They don't know how to talk or think any other way.

What I do relies only on simple scientific principles. Just put it that way. It's not a martial art but more at combat science than anything else. It does not rely on speed, conditioning, form, or anything like that, but more on seeking out targets and wrecking them.
 

Grapeshot

Legendary Warrior
Joined
May 21, 2006
Messages
35,317
Location
Valhalla
Midnight0489 After all is said and done, you did the very best thing that night......whether you were armed or not is not the question.

You effectively avoided the confrontation, which is much better in my mind that using any more forceful response.
 

SouthernBoy

Regular Member
Joined
May 12, 2007
Messages
5,837
Location
Western Prince William County, Virginia, USA
Midnight0489 After all is said and done, you did the very best thing that night......whether you were armed or not is not the question.

You effectively avoided the confrontation, which is much better in my mind that using any more forceful response.

Absolutely correct.

Just because someone is armed does not guarantee their success in a confrontation. He did the right thing.
 

wrightme

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Messages
5,574
Location
Fallon, Nevada, USA
The confidence people believe they have just because they are carrying a fun is false. They think that the gun gives them the power to deal with any situation. This is utter nonsense. The gun will not always be available for you, even when it is on your person.
The confidence people feel because they are carrying a [g]un is true, and is projected in their demeanor. THIS is much better than appearing as easy prey. Carrying a firearm can help a person project this "I am not prey" persona.

Mudjack said:
Your brain, your primary weapon, however, is always going to be there for you. Learn to use your brain in violence first and worry about the gun later.
Of course. Well, except it would be better to "learn to use your brain to identify and avoid hazards first..." Why the focus on violence anyway?

Mudjack said:
Most people who are trained properly for violence prefer not to carry anything at all.
Really? What statistic is this from?
 
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wrightme

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Messages
5,574
Location
Fallon, Nevada, USA
You did good.

Do not get legal advice from LE. His "this isn't Texas" comment is far off the mark. Texans are not allowed to OC.
As far as GATTTOTP, check the statutes for your state for actual possibilities, and get with a local OC group for some 'BTDT' reality information.

Oh, and do not listen to the obvious mall ninja smack-talk you will encounter here.


I recently talked to the Night Watch Commander for Cumberland County Sheriff's Department, and whoever I talked to told me that I could carry my firearm anywhere that it was legal, with the risk that I could be charged with Going Armed to the Terror of the Public. When I talked to the Fayetteville Police (again, with the family), they told me that, "This isn't Texas. I strongly recommend you don't carry a gun without a badge." I understand that I might have gotten slightly rude, but I said something along the lines of, "No offense intended, but you, nor your friends, are going to be able to save us everytime. I need my own firearm protection." At this point, he actually asked me my name, and I told him, and afterwards, he warned me again that though he thought it was legal, he did not recommend carrying my firearm. There was something on this site in someone's signature that said, "When seconds count, the police are only minutes away." I'm not saying that the police don't provide a much-needed service, and in a world that did not have BG's, I would never bother to carry my firearm (no police would be needed, either, but that's besides the point).

Anyway, I'm coming to the end of my rant with the statement that I open carry for two reasons: 1. I have to protect myself and my family, and 2. This is my right as an American. I carry my firearm with the desire that I will never have to draw it in the defense of myself or my family, but with the realization that if that day ever comes, I hope that God gives me the strength to take the necessary actions.

I apologize once again for such a long-winded post, and completely understand if you don't want to read it all or disagree with my views. That being said, I look forward to communicating with you all now that I'm on this forum.
 

wrightme

Regular Member
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Messages
5,574
Location
Fallon, Nevada, USA
What I do relies only on simple scientific principles. Just put it that way. It's not a martial art but more at combat science than anything else. It does not rely on speed, conditioning, form, or anything like that, but more on seeking out targets and wrecking them.
Goody for you. Do you understand that most OC'ers are not likely to be "seeking out targets and wrecking them?" Trying to give advice here based upon that is not what OC is about IMHO.

As you are aware, the brain is the best weapon. But for most here, the best use for it is as a weapon of avoidance first, and as defense second. Carrying a firearm is simply the fallback plan for when avoidance fails. It isn't for "seeking out a target and wrecking it." Nor is it likely that a majority here are either trained in martial arts or "combat science," though it would be beneficial I am sure.

Beyond that, is it really necessary to be condescending in delivery when you give "advice?"
 
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slowfiveoh

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 15, 2009
Messages
1,415
Location
Richmond, VA
Mudjack,

When you are done jumping from tree to tree, or disappearing after throwing a smokebomb at your feet, perhaps you could calm down and realize just how stupid you sound.

"People who "train for violence" prefer to be unarmed."

Well, so far as I can tell, this forum is chock full of veterans of all branches of the military. Myself included. Some of them are combat vets. Myself included. Get off your donkey.

While hand to hand combat is something that is taught, interestingly enough, we were never sent in to combat without our firearms. Were there any truth whatsoever to your commentary, soldiers and marines would be backflipping ninja bunnies who dodge bullets and perform matrix-like maneuvers to an orchestrated soundtrack.

Alas, real life, and "those who train for violence", don't do any of the above, because a firearm is the greatest possible means of defense in any potentially violent situation. When brought down to the individual level (FIX BAYONETS) you are still taught to use bluedgeoning and stabbing.

Interesting eh?

I would be full on behind your commentary were you asserting that civilians get some sort of secondary training to augment their ability to defend themselves.

This just isn't the case though.

Frankly I think you're a gigantic fake, who is flopping their pompousness about the forum.

That remains to be seen I suppose.
 
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Mudjack

Banned
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
Messages
104
Location
Las Vegas, Nevada, USA
Goody for you. Do you understand that most OC'ers are not likely to be "seeking out targets and wrecking them?" Trying to give advice here based upon that is not what OC is about IMHO.

As you are aware, the brain is the best weapon. But for most here, the best use for it is as a weapon of avoidance first, and as defense second. Carrying a firearm is simply the fallback plan for when avoidance fails. It isn't for "seeking out a target and wrecking it." Nor is it likely that a majority here are either trained in martial arts or "combat science," though it would be beneficial I am sure.

Beyond that, is it really necessary to be condescending in delivery when you give "advice?"

You don't see out targets and wreck them with a gun? What do you do with it then?

Point gun at center mass, squeeze trigger. If that isn't seeking out a target and wrecking it, I don't know what is.

If you guys don't seek out targets to strike when firing your guns, what then, may I ask, are you firing at?
 

Mudjack

Banned
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
Messages
104
Location
Las Vegas, Nevada, USA
Mudjack,

When you are done jumping from tree to tree, or disappearing after throwing a smokebomb at your feet, perhaps you could calm down and realize just how stupid you sound.

"People who "train for violence" prefer to be unarmed."

Well, so far as I can tell, this forum is chock full of veterans of all branches of the military. Myself included. Some of them are combat vets. Myself included. Get off your donkey.

While hand to hand combat is something that is taught, interestingly enough, we were never sent in to combat without our firearms. Were there any truth whatsoever to your commentary, soldiers and marines would be backflipping ninja bunnies who dodge bullets and perform matrix-like maneuvers to an orchestrated soundtrack.

Alas, real life, and "those who train for violence", don't do any of the above, because a firearm is the greatest possible means of defense in any potentially violent situation. When brought down to the individual level (FIX BAYONETS) you are still taught to use bluedgeoning and stabbing.

Interesting eh?

I would be full on behind your commentary were you asserting that civilians get some sort of secondary training to augment their ability to defend themselves.

This just isn't the case though.

Frankly I think you're a gigantic fake, who is flopping their pompousness about the forum.

That remains to be seen I suppose.

I think you're a fake too, buddy. And you're the one who sounds stupid.

You obviously don't know what you're talking about.

If you have any real questions for me, I will be more than happy to answer them.
 
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