Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 33

Thread: Question on where to store magazines in vehicle...

  1. #1
    Regular Member Genken's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Tacoma, WA
    Posts
    105

    Question on where to store magazines in vehicle...

    So I understand until I get my CPL, I have to clear my pistol before I get into the car...but can I keep the magazines in my mag pouches on my belt while driving, or do I need them in the "trunk" area of my car(a Kia Rondo, with no actual "Trunk" per se).

    To be safe until I get a solid answer, I will keep them in the tailgate area, but I would prefer to keep them closer if legally possible.

    I appreciate any help.

  2. #2
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    South of Disorder in Rouge Canyon, , USA
    Posts
    272
    Quote Originally Posted by Genken View Post
    So I understand until I get my CPL, I have to clear my pistol before I get into the car...but can I keep the magazines in my mag pouches on my belt while driving, or do I need them in the "trunk" area of my car(a Kia Rondo, with no actual "Trunk" per se).

    To be safe until I get a solid answer, I will keep them in the tailgate area, but I would prefer to keep them closer if legally possible.

    I appreciate any help.

    This has been asked before ......
    I'm sure someone with the right answer will chime in, don't forget to clear the round from the chamber !!!!!!!
    Don't forget to check out the "Sticky" which is a permanent post called "Washington Gun Rights Pamphlet" you might find your answer there.
    Last edited by Bersa.380; 08-02-2010 at 08:42 AM.

  3. #3
    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    South Whidbey, Washington, USA
    Posts
    2,812

    Duck taped to your forehead!

    I think that was the consensus of the last thread on the subject

    Naw, it actually doesn't matter. The weapon only needs to be unloaded, meaning no magazine, no round in chamber. Where those two things are at the time doesn't matter, as long as they are not in the gun.
    It is very wise to not take a watermelon lightly.

  4. #4
    Campaign Veteran ak56's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Carnation, Washington, USA
    Posts
    748
    Quote Originally Posted by Metalhead47 View Post
    I think that was the consensus of the last thread on the subject

    Naw, it actually doesn't matter. The weapon only needs to be unloaded, meaning no magazine, no round in chamber. Where those two things are at the time doesn't matter, as long as they are not in the gun.
    Metalhead just beat me to it, only I prefer gaffer's tape - leaves less adhesive residue on my forehead.

    But he got the rest of the answer right.

  5. #5
    Regular Member Genken's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Tacoma, WA
    Posts
    105
    I appreciate it. Like mike253, I was under the impression that it couldn't be easily accessible as well.

  6. #6
    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Federal Way, Washington, USA
    Posts
    5,666

    Welcome!

    Welcome a couple of you to the forum.

    There is no RCW that states how to carry an unloaded pistol in your vehicle, only that it be unloaded. Unloaded meaning no round in the cylinder and no loaded magazine in the grip of a semi auto.

    Therefore in a semi, you could remove the round from the chamber and remove the magazine from the grip. Duck tape the magazine to the outsied of the grip and Duck tape both of them to your forehead and you would be legal.

    You many NOT conceal the unloaded pistol anywhere on your person.

    Attachment 3456


    Quote Originally Posted by mik253 View Post
    Really? I was always under the impression that your ammunition couldn't be within an easily accessible distance
    Last edited by gogodawgs; 08-02-2010 at 02:45 PM.
    Live Free or Die!

  7. #7
    Regular Member Genken's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Tacoma, WA
    Posts
    105
    Ok, got it. So I should also put the pistol somewhere off of me unloaded if it is covered by my seatbelt(thus concealed on me). Proper train of thought on that, yes?

  8. #8
    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Federal Way, Washington, USA
    Posts
    5,666

    Yes

    YES


    Quote Originally Posted by Genken View Post
    Ok, got it. So I should also put the pistol somewhere off of me unloaded if it is covered by my seatbelt(thus concealed on me). Proper train of thought on that, yes?
    Live Free or Die!

  9. #9
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Location, Location
    Posts
    208
    Quote Originally Posted by Genken View Post
    Ok, got it. So I should also put the pistol somewhere off of me unloaded if it is covered by my seatbelt(thus concealed on me). Proper train of thought on that, yes?
    Seriously? The seatbelt would be considered concealment? Even if the seatbelt cannot cover the entire grip of the gun?

    I thought the issue was "no concealing clothing over the gun", so it wouldn't be concealed if asked to step out of the car. If the gun is not concealed by the seatbelt or clothing, with the gun on your right hip, the gun is still being concealed from an officer on your left side by your entire body.

  10. #10
    Regular Member Genken's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Tacoma, WA
    Posts
    105
    Quote Originally Posted by ShooterMcGavin View Post
    Seriously? The seatbelt would be considered concealment? Even if the seatbelt cannot cover the entire grip of the gun?

    I thought the issue was "no concealing clothing over the gun", so it wouldn't be concealed if asked to step out of the car. If the gun is not concealed by the seatbelt or clothing, with the gun on your right hip, the gun is still being concealed from an officer on your left side by your entire body.
    Yes. That's why I can't use my IWB holster. The whole gun and holster has to be in plain view. Anything that can conceal it can make it a bad day. Better safe than sorry.

    As for the body concealing it, not sure how that works exactly, but I would think that they would take into account that we aren't the invisible man.
    Last edited by Genken; 08-02-2010 at 04:08 PM.

  11. #11
    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    South Whidbey, Washington, USA
    Posts
    2,812
    Not quite guys. The RCWs don't define "concealed," there was a big thread on this a while back as to just what did constitute "concealed." Since it's not clearly defined by law, and there's been no test cases, it'd be up to the cop at the time & the DA down the road as to whether you would end up charged for having a seatbelt across the gun.
    It is very wise to not take a watermelon lightly.

  12. #12
    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    In My Coffee
    Posts
    5,278
    FWIU you can use a IWB and it not be considered CC as long as when a reasonable person observes what is exposed is a handgun.

    Officer: They were CC without a permit

    Lawyer: How did you know they were CC a handgun?

    Officer: I could see it.

    Lawyer: You could see what.

    Officer: I could see the grip of the handgun.


    You are only CC'ing if the handgun is covered in such a way that the officcer is unable to determine it is a handgun. It is about evidence, proof that you are CC. An officer can not say you are CC'ing if he see that you are carrying a handgun by the grip that is sticking out of your pants.

    I could be wrong, Gray or someone on here will correct me if I am, I am sure of it LOL.
    Last edited by Beretta92FSLady; 08-02-2010 at 04:23 PM.
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

  13. #13
    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Federal Way, Washington, USA
    Posts
    5,666
    Quote Originally Posted by ShooterMcGavin View Post
    Seriously? The seatbelt would be considered concealment? Even if the seatbelt cannot cover the entire grip of the gun?

    I thought the issue was "no concealing clothing over the gun", so it wouldn't be concealed if asked to step out of the car. If the gun is not concealed by the seatbelt or clothing, with the gun on your right hip, the gun is still being concealed from an officer on your left side by your entire body.
    There is no definition of what concealed would entail. Therefore the reasonable man doctrine would be your guide.

    Quote Originally Posted by Metalhead47 View Post
    Not quite guys. The RCWs don't define "concealed," there was a big thread on this a while back as to just what did constitute "concealed." Since it's not clearly defined by law, and there's been no test cases, it'd be up to the cop at the time & the DA down the road as to whether you would end up charged for having a seatbelt across the gun.
    Correct.
    Live Free or Die!

  14. #14
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Location, Location
    Posts
    208
    Quote Originally Posted by Genken View Post
    Yes. That's why I can't use my IWB holster. The whole gun and holster has to be in plain view. Anything that can conceal it can make it a bad day. Better safe than sorry.
    Ok, a new question with this part...
    I always considered that, if I am carrying in an IWB holster and I tuck my shirt behind the grip of the gun (so it is visible), I would be open carrying. You are saying that, in that condition, within a car, you are considered to be concealed because the holster is not visible?!?

    Isn't it great how they take law abiding citizens and turn them into criminals through these complicated laws that serve no purpose!!!

    ETA: I was typing when you guys responded. No need to explain it further. However, my last point above still stands!!!
    Last edited by ShooterMcGavin; 08-02-2010 at 04:25 PM.

  15. #15
    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    In My Coffee
    Posts
    5,278
    Quote Originally Posted by ShooterMcGavin View Post
    Ok, a new question with this part...
    I always considered that, if I am carrying in an IWB holster and I tuck my shirt behind the grip of the gun (so it is visible), I would be open carrying. You are saying that, in that condition, within a car, you are considered to be concealed because the holster is not visible?!?

    Isn't it great how they take law abiding citizens and turn them into criminals through these complicated laws that serve no purpose!!!

    ETA: I was typing when you guys responded. No need to explain it further. However, my last point above still stands!!!

    The issue here is you are not allowed to carry a loaded sidearm in your vehicle without a permit.
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

  16. #16
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    93
    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia Plath View Post
    The issue here is you are not allowed to carry a loaded sidearm in your vehicle without a permit.
    Except in regards to outdoor recreational activities as stated in: RCW 9.41.060 - Exceptions to restrictions on carrying firearms.

    The provisions of RCW 9.41.050 shall not apply to:......

    (8) Any person engaging in a lawful outdoor recreational activity such as hunting, fishing, camping, hiking, or horseback riding, only if, considering all of the attendant circumstances, including but not limited to whether the person has a valid hunting or fishing license, it is reasonable to conclude that the person is participating in lawful outdoor activities or is traveling to or from a legitimate outdoor recreation area;


    This means you can carry just like you have a CPL without having one as long as you are traveling to and from; while participating in outdoor activities. This means loaded in the vehicle is perfectly fine as defined by the law.

    And please remember that just because its the law doesn't mean all LEOs know the law or will interpret the law correctly.

  17. #17
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    South of Disorder in Rouge Canyon, , USA
    Posts
    272
    Until you get your CPL just unload the chamber, pull the mag out, then put the mag between the seats in the cup holder and the pistol on the passenger seat. Then don't do anything to make a cop pull you over.

  18. #18
    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    In My Coffee
    Posts
    5,278
    Quote Originally Posted by TheJeepster View Post
    Except in regards to outdoor recreational activities as stated in: RCW 9.41.060 - Exceptions to restrictions on carrying firearms.

    The provisions of RCW 9.41.050 shall not apply to:......

    (8) Any person engaging in a lawful outdoor recreational activity such as hunting, fishing, camping, hiking, or horseback riding, only if, considering all of the attendant circumstances, including but not limited to whether the person has a valid hunting or fishing license, it is reasonable to conclude that the person is participating in lawful outdoor activities or is traveling to or from a legitimate outdoor recreation area;


    This means you can carry just like you have a CPL without having one as long as you are traveling to and from; while participating in outdoor activities. This means loaded in the vehicle is perfectly fine as defined by the law.

    And please remember that just because its the law doesn't mean all LEOs know the law or will interpret the law correctly.
    This thread is about everyday carry, not going hunting or fishing; those types of outdoor activities.

    Second, you are throwing a huge gray area out there, then stating that not all LEO's know this RCW or that they will interpret it correctly. Try being more specific when you are talking about a gray area that this RCW can create for the carrier.

    -What constitutes coming and going? You drive to the activity armed (legal). You leave the activity, drive to McDonalds, then drive home, (?). How would the officer know that you left an outdoor activity, he just seen you at Mcdonalds, he pulls you over as you pull out of McDonalds because you make a left out of a right only, he realizes you are armed and asks for your Permit to carry because you are driving with a loaded handgun in your vehicle.

    -can you articulate, prove how you were coming or going?

    -If the officer does not know this RCW, are you prepared to bring it to his attention?

    -The officer could cite you and make you explain yourself to a judge.

    To save yourself the pain in the butt gray area this RCW inherently creates, load your sidearm when you get to your destination, and unload when you leave. Yes, you are protected but the protection is not fully clear. There are so many variable that can cause you legal issues.
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

  19. #19
    Regular Member Metalhead47's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    South Whidbey, Washington, USA
    Posts
    2,812
    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia Plath View Post
    This thread is about everyday carry, not going hunting or fishing; those types of outdoor activities.

    Second, you are throwing a huge gray area out there, then stating that not all LEO's know this RCW or that they will interpret it correctly. Try being more specific when you are talking about a gray area that this RCW can create for the carrier.

    -What constitutes coming and going? You drive to the activity armed (legal). You leave the activity, drive to McDonalds, then drive home, (?). How would the officer know that you left an outdoor activity, he just seen you at Mcdonalds, he pulls you over as you pull out of McDonalds because you make a left out of a right only, he realizes you are armed and asks for your Permit to carry because you are driving with a loaded handgun in your vehicle.

    -can you articulate, prove how you were coming or going?

    -If the officer does not know this RCW, are you prepared to bring it to his attention?

    -The officer could cite you and make you explain yourself to a judge.

    To save yourself the pain in the butt gray area this RCW inherently creates, load your sidearm when you get to your destination, and unload when you leave. Yes, you are protected but the protection is not fully clear. There are so many variable that can cause you legal issues.

    Naw, just keep a dead deer strapped to the hood or a bucket of fish in the back, and you'll be covered. And after a couple days no LEO (or anyone else for that matter) would want to get close enough to your rig to see if you're carrying in the first place
    It is very wise to not take a watermelon lightly.

  20. #20
    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    In My Coffee
    Posts
    5,278
    Quote Originally Posted by Metalhead47 View Post
    Naw, just keep a dead deer strapped to the hood or a bucket of fish in the back, and you'll be covered. And after a couple days no LEO (or anyone else for that matter) would want to get close enough to your rig to see if you're carrying in the first place

    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

  21. #21
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    , ,
    Posts
    93
    Quote Originally Posted by Sylvia Plath View Post
    This thread is about everyday carry, not going hunting or fishing; those types of outdoor activities.

    Second, you are throwing a huge gray area out there, then stating that not all LEO's know this RCW or that they will interpret it correctly. Try being more specific when you are talking about a gray area that this RCW can create for the carrier.

    -What constitutes coming and going? You drive to the activity armed (legal). You leave the activity, drive to McDonalds, then drive home, (?). How would the officer know that you left an outdoor activity, he just seen you at Mcdonalds, he pulls you over as you pull out of McDonalds because you make a left out of a right only, he realizes you are armed and asks for your Permit to carry because you are driving with a loaded handgun in your vehicle.

    -can you articulate, prove how you were coming or going?

    -If the officer does not know this RCW, are you prepared to bring it to his attention?

    -The officer could cite you and make you explain yourself to a judge.

    To save yourself the pain in the butt gray area this RCW inherently creates, load your sidearm when you get to your destination, and unload when you leave. Yes, you are protected but the protection is not fully clear. There are so many variable that can cause you legal issues.
    I thought this forum was about the legality of open carry, whether that be everyday or for specific reasons. The RCW (law) quoted is an exception to the CPL restrictions, thus allowing open carry while loaded in a vehicle when pursuing outdoor activities in general.

    As far as it being a gray area. Its about as much of a gray area as open carry is. There are way too many stories on this board about LEOs not knowing the laws they are supposed to enforce regarding open carry. This would just be one more. Is it possible for any of the "what if?" situations you brought up to happen? Absolutely, but not more so than open carry will get you in general. The RCW shouldn't be used to maliciously circumvent needing a CPL, but one should not be scared on exercising ones rights just because LEOs don't know the law.

    Or maybe I have misread every post on this board...

  22. #22
    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    In My Coffee
    Posts
    5,278
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post

    I think the point that TheJeepster makes is very valid. Going hiking, going fishing, going hunting are normal activities that normal people engage in. If those normal people are going to/from those normal activities, they have an exception in the law that allows them to carry a loaded handgun in their vehicle and/or concealed on their person, as they choose, without a CPL. I think it is totally within the purpose of this forum to discuss that.

    And that exception to the law is more than just a gray area or a loophole. It is a specific exception, written intentionally by the legislators, with a specific intention behind it.
    I said that this thread topic, not the forum, is about general carry, meaning a form of carry that is not exempted under RCW. The person who started this thread was asking a question about general carry when driving in your car. Yes, there is an exception, but that exception is not general carry, there are somewhat specific guidelines that make it legal to carry while in your vehicle without a permit to carry, and the RCW outlines what that is.

    It is a gray area. There is a specific intent in the RCW, but specific intentions do not always translate to like application of the RCW. Intent and application are two different things.

    I am just posting. The person who started this thread does not have to take what I am saying and consider it to hold any value. You want to act as if the law is some clear cut thing when it isn't. It is misleading to act as if there is an absolute in any law, there are no absolutes, only "probabilities."
    Last edited by Beretta92FSLady; 08-03-2010 at 03:30 PM.
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

  23. #23
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Des Moines, Washington, USA
    Posts
    26
    Please correct my if I'm wrong but, according to leo's I've spoken with open carry is fine however once you enter a vehicle the firearm is no longer viewable and therfore considered concealed. Best to keep it off you and unloaded till you get a permit at least when inside a car or truck. Err on the side of safety, yours and the LEO's who has been on shift for 12 hours is tired and suddenly sees your gun on your hip as you reach for your wallet. scary huh? No one needs the stress. Play it by the book till they learn that the Constitution of The United States of America is OUR law.
    As for your mags......keep them in your belt pouches or any where you like....except in the gun
    Last edited by dan10mmman; 08-03-2010 at 03:22 PM. Reason: about mags

  24. #24
    Regular Member killchain's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Richland, Washington, USA
    Posts
    788
    You can carry a handgun in an IWB holster, as long as it's "reasonably obvious" you have a firearm on you.

    So if the butt of your Colt is sticking out plain as day against your shirt, then it's not concealed.

    I've open carried with a Crossbreed Supertuck before, I just tucked my shirt behind it and it was good to go.

    Essentially: If you have to lift your shirt or pull it out of a pocket to touch it, it's concealed. If "random guy" can't glance at you for ten seconds and see some part of that handgun you're open carrying, you're doing it wrong.

    And yes, my favorite: You can literally duct tape your handgun and/or magazines to your forehead if you like. As long as the magazine isn't in the pistol and there isn't a round in the chamber, you're good to go.

    Get a CPL, however, and that problem goes away.

    I'd LOVE to see THAT traffic stop.

    "Sir, why is there a pistol taped to your forehead?"

    "Sir, why don't YOU have a pistol taped to YOUR forehead?"

    Hahahahaha.
    "War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself." -John Stuart Mill

  25. #25
    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    In My Coffee
    Posts
    5,278
    Quote Originally Posted by TheJeepster View Post
    The RCW shouldn't be used to maliciously circumvent needing a CPL, but one should not be scared on exercising ones rights just because LEOs don't know the law.

    I completely agree.

    General carry without a permit while driving is not legal. If you are engaging in activities that are excepted under the RCW that outlines outdoor activities, you are legal. This poster did not ask about special exemption carry while driving, they asked about general carry while driving. The reason I make distinctions between all of these things is that people need to understand that what is and is not lawful can be complex. Some people lack the capacity, I am not implying this poster does, to understand that reality and take general responses as being some blanket OK to carry.

    I still want an answer to what I posted above:

    You are leaving your outdoor activity to head home, you stop at McDonald's to grab a bite to eat. You leave McDonald's, get into your vehicle with a loaded handgun and continue home. Does your outdoor activity exemption no longer apply because you are engaging in activities that are not protected under the RCW exemption? I would say you are no longer legal.

    If someone has a case involving carrying without permit while driving to and from an outdoor activity, post it. I have not been able to find anything.

    I could be wrong; I have been wrong, on occasion
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •