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Thread: Are there places you cover up?

  1. #1
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    Red face Are there places you cover up?

    I OC & CC depending on how I'm dressed & where I am going.

    Here in Ohio OC is slowly gaining traction, thanks in large part to the web & forums etc.

    I use to OC practically everywhere but lately I noticed something strange happening.

    Often times I do not tuck my shirts in & just tuck my tshirt behind my gun. I OC to gas stations, Circle K, walking my dog, bicycle rideing, practically everywhere legal.

    Funny thing though, lately when I go to Wal Mart I cover up. I have never had a problem OCing there and have OCed at a lot of stores with no problem.

    Once I was asked by security to take my gun out of a mall & rather than get the place posted by pointing out there was not proper signage I left, only to return CCing.

    I may just be covering because of the t shirt behind the gun vs tucked, I do not know.

    It's funny really but I was wondering if anyone else covers up in lcertain locations? I never did til this year & can't even explain why.

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    Most of the time I CC

    I would say that it is still about 65/35 CC/OC

    I tend to cover up when I'm going out with friends, or going places where I may not want to keep so much attention focused on my pistol in the open. When I OC I tend to stay more alert, on edge maybe? Close proximity to many people with my gun exposed makes me somewhat nervous still.

    I also cover when I am going to a friends house or to play poker, etc.

    Since I OC for either a deterrent or educational purposes if the situation does not call for either then I will conceal more often than not.

    Of course, there are days I just don't want to bother with a cover shirt...

  3. #3
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    I CC in costco and in my doctors (2) offices also in the local medical lab when I go in for blood work.

  4. #4
    Regular Member Ruger's Avatar
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    Same here

    Quote Originally Posted by daddy4count View Post
    Most of the time I CC

    I would say that it is still about 65/35 CC/OC

    I tend to cover up when I'm going out with friends, or going places where I may not want to keep so much attention focused on my pistol in the open. When I OC I tend to stay more alert, on edge maybe? Close proximity to many people with my gun exposed makes me somewhat nervous still.

    I also cover when I am going to a friends house or to play poker, etc.

    Since I OC for either a deterrent or educational purposes if the situation does not call for either then I will conceal more often than not.

    Of course, there are days I just don't want to bother with a cover shirt...
    This pretty much describes me too. Except I probably split OC/CC more like 50/50. I don't OC when going to the home of friends, or those family members who I know would disapprove. My church has asked that anyone who wants to carry on church property stick to CC as well, so I respect that.

    I find that I meet less resistance about OC if I do it when I am with my wife and my 19 month old daughter. People tend to not feel too threatened at the sight of the gun on my left hip when I am carrying my baby girl with my right arm & my wife is right next to me. This is the image/statement that I want to make as I OC: A normal, family man looking out for himself & his loved ones. When folks see that "normal" men and women carry guns, and they are not freaked out by it, then we are succeeding.

    Last edited by Ruger; 08-05-2010 at 03:20 PM. Reason: fixed a broken sentence :)

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    Yep! I agree...

    I OC'd at two new places this week... chiropractors office. Turns out he is pro-gun, ex-military, carries a .45ACP and doesn't mind at all if I wear it openly. Gals at the front desk seem completely unaffected as well.

    Also today I just got back from the garden shop where I have never OC'd before. The folks who run it are so sweet and friendly, I was curious how it would go over there. I always CC in places like this, to avoid possible conflict at a small business that might be within their right to boot me, but where I would miss patronizing the shop after... But since I did not wear anything to cover with... went on in. They noticed it, said nothing.

    One customer could not take his eyes away from my belt... so either he liked my butt or did not like my gun.

  6. #6
    Regular Member Brent Evertz's Avatar
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    I open carry all of the time except when I don't have the time to deal with a possible bad police encounter. I've been in one of those situations already and they stole about 20 min of my time.

    I too was about to open carry in a mall and they didn't have proper signage but I still placed my gun in my car. I didn't feel like getting harassed by mall security or the police.

    It all depends on where or what I'm doing. I also prefer to CC while in crowds of people. I don't feel comfortable OC'ing with people so close to me even with my level 2 serpa holster. Plus I like the element of surprise that CC gives you.
    "What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms." -Thomas Jefferson

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    Regular Member MatieA's Avatar
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    Denver, Co and whenever I am wearing my duster; it's a lil long so even a drop-leg wouldn't help
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  8. #8
    Regular Member Ruger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brent Evertz View Post
    Plus I like the element of surprise that CC gives you.
    Not meaning to bash, but, I've got to ask....

    How do you figure that? If you had the "element of surprise", that would imply offensive action being taken, not defensive. So, how are you going to have "surprise" on your side when someone already has the drop on you?

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not bashing CC - God knows, I do it too, as I said above. Its just that I find it to be strange how many people like to talk about "the element of surprise" that is afforded them by CC.

  9. #9
    Regular Member Brent Evertz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruger View Post
    Not meaning to bash, but, I've got to ask....

    How do you figure that? If you had the "element of surprise", that would imply offensive action being taken, not defensive. So, how are you going to have "surprise" on your side when someone already has the drop on you?

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not bashing CC - God knows, I do it too, as I said above. Its just that I find it to be strange how many people like to talk about "the element of surprise" that is afforded them by CC.
    While there are different situations that produce different outcomes, consider this. Some mad man comes into a place of business or an event wishing to rob people and stop whoever gets in their way. Now they see you open carrying. If they have intent to stop all who get in their way, your going to be the first one down, guaranteed. (and believe me, it only takes a second or two. Not like the movies where the good guy gets 2 minutes) Now of course every OC'er claims that they will unholster and neutralize the threat before they get shot. I say good luck with that!

    Hence CC gives you element of surprise. If its out of sight and out of mind, you hold the upper hand in every hostile situation. Now of course there are the scenarios where the criminals intend to seem very hostile but in fact will never commit murder. In those cases they are just bluffing and at the sight of an OC'er they run.

    The choosing of your carry method is of course entirely up to you. EVERY situation is different. Some criminals simply don't care whether your OC or not. If they have the intent to harm, they most likely will harm the OCer first, so that they have a better chance of surviving.
    "What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms." -Thomas Jefferson

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brent Evertz View Post
    While there are different situations that produce different outcomes, consider this. Some mad man comes into a place of business or an event wishing to rob people and stop whoever gets in their way. Now they see you open carrying. If they have intent to stop all who get in their way, your going to be the first one down, guaranteed.
    Can you name any instances where this has happened? I can name one where the mere presence of an open carrier prevented an armed robbery. Criminals don't take out OCers. Criminals just go elsewhere.

    A few things to consider:

    1. Crimes prevented by OC go unnoticed almost all of the time. We will never know how many times criminals have moved on because of OC.

    2. CC will never stop an armed robbery before it starts. At best, it provides the possibility for armed response to armed robbery.

  11. #11
    Regular Member Brent Evertz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    Can you name any instances where this has happened? I can name one where the mere presence of an open carrier prevented an armed robbery. Criminals don't take out OCers. Criminals just go elsewhere.

    A few things to consider:

    1. Crimes prevented by OC go unnoticed almost all of the time. We will never know how many times criminals have moved on because of OC.

    2. CC will never stop an armed robbery before it starts. At best, it provides the possibility for armed response to armed robbery.
    Listen, every situation is different. If you come across a criminal that doesn't give a $@#! then he will shoot you first! Like the criminals that methodically murdered people just as in virginia tech's case and Susana Hupp's case. You think those criminals would of ran away at the mere sight OC'er? Nope. They would of shot them first. AGAIN, every situation is different.

    I can answer your initial question. There might not be any recorded cases of OC'ers getting popped first because they OC for 2 reasons. 1)Most criminals don't go on mass killing sprees. 2)The presence of armed civilians is already thin as it is. You can't rule out that when you get criminals as in those 2 cases I mentioned above, that if an OCer was to be present, they would've been killed first. Just because it hasn't happened doesn't mean it can't.

    I don't argue that OC can and has been proven to deter crime. But I also never cancel out that CC might also save my life from an event where a criminal simply doesn't care!
    "What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms." -Thomas Jefferson

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brent Evertz View Post
    Listen, every situation is different. If you come across a criminal that doesn't give a $@#! then he will shoot you first! Like the criminals that methodically murdered people just as in virginia tech's case and Susana Hupp's case. You think those criminals would of ran away at the mere sight OC'er? Nope. They would of shot them first. AGAIN, every situation is different.

    I can answer your initial question. There might not be any recorded cases of OC'ers getting popped first because they OC for 2 reasons. 1)Most criminals don't go on mass killing sprees. 2)The presence of armed civilians is already thin as it is. You can't rule out that when you get criminals as in those 2 cases I mentioned above, that if an OCer was to be present, they would've been killed first. Just because it hasn't happened doesn't mean it can't.

    I don't argue that OC can and has been proven to deter crime. But I also never cancel out that CC might also save my life from an event where a criminal simply doesn't care!
    So, I guess that you cannot name an instance where what you contend will happen has happened. Remember, I can name an instance where what I contend will happen has happened.

    OCing is much more likely to stop a crime before it ever happens than to prompt the criminal to take out the OCer first.

  13. #13
    Regular Member Brent Evertz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    So, I guess that you cannot name an instance where what you contend will happen has happened. Remember, I can name an instance where what I contend will happen has happened.

    OCing is much more likely to stop a crime before it ever happens than to prompt the criminal to take out the OCer first.
    Then I guess we agree to disagree. Your pretty much saying that because it hasn't happened it won't. Well that's foolish thinking.

    While I don't argue that OC deters crime better than CC, CC also would be beneficial in a situation where criminals are murdering others. I really don't think that OC would have made Susana Hupp's case any better. I do think that if she was allowed to CC it would of helped a ton.

    The two methods of carry are totally different and apply to an already low probability that either will needed. There can be scenarios where one or the other is more beneficial and if you don't see that, then I don't know what to say to you. I know that for me though, I understand how both are good and I therefore continue to keep my options open.
    "What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms." -Thomas Jefferson

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brent Evertz View Post
    Then I guess we agree to disagree. Your pretty much saying that because it hasn't happened it won't. Well that's foolish thinking.
    Well, that's pretty insulting. I didn't read past that point. As a matter of fact, I don't read anything written by folks who resort to insults rather than intelligent discussion.

    Anyway, I never agree to disagree. That is truly a foolish thing to say. I would (if doing so with you were worth my while) just continue to post support for my POV. Again, though, I don't bother discussing with folks who have so little faith in their ability to formulate a coherent response that they have to resort to personal insults.

    Welcome to Ignoreland.

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    Regular Member Bikenut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brent Evertz View Post
    -snip-

    Your pretty much saying that because it hasn't happened it won't. Well that's foolish thinking.

    -snip-
    Are you saying that in spite of OC being practiced by many citizens for many years, decades in some states, that since it hasn't happened (no documented cases) anywhere in the U.S. in all that time then it surely will happen? And the odds of it surely happening since it has never happened yet (not even after decades of OC) is such that it should be a consideration in the decision to OC?
    Last edited by Bikenut; 08-06-2010 at 05:22 PM.
    Gun control isn't about the gun at all.... for those who want gun control it is all about their own fragile egos, their own lack of self esteem, their own inner fears, and most importantly... their own desire to dominate others. And an openly carried gun is a slap in the face to all of those things.

  16. #16
    Regular Member Brent Evertz's Avatar
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    I don't understand why you guys think that just because you OC, your invincible.

    Does OC deter most crimes? Yes. Can it ever go against you in a situation? I believe so. Why rule that out?

    I'm not advocating that people shouldn't OC. In fact I'm for it just as much as CC. This all stemmed off my initial response that CC can have an element of surprise effect.

    Eye95, I didn't mean to offend you. I just think you shouldn't rule out all of your options based on the premise that it simply "hasn't happened yet..."
    "What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms." -Thomas Jefferson

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brent Evertz View Post
    Does OC deter most crimes? Yes. Can it ever go against you in a situation? I believe so.
    What evidence do you have for this belief, please? Evidence, please, and not personal opinion. I don't recall any bad guys reported as saying, "I had to prioritize my targets and took out the visible weapon carrier as the more immediate threat, then I waited for the concealed carriers to uncloak."

  18. #18
    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    I CC to anti gun family gatherings, at work, when tired, and when going somewhere posted or otherwise not permitted where law still poses no obstacle to carry. Sometimes I also CC on the way to or from work when I don't feel like changing holsters just to go into a gas station.

  19. #19
    Regular Member Brent Evertz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Huffman View Post
    What evidence do you have for this belief, please? Evidence, please, and not personal opinion. I don't recall any bad guys reported as saying, "I had to prioritize my targets and took out the visible weapon carrier as the more immediate threat, then I waited for the concealed carriers to uncloak."
    Have you been reading any of the previous posts? I'd recommend you re-read them and you'll find your answer.

    And why would I need evidence for my belief?
    "What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms." -Thomas Jefferson

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    CC could play a role in preventing crime indirectly AFTER the BG sees someone OCing, it might make him wonder whoelse is armed LOL

  21. #21
    Regular Member Bikenut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brent Evertz View Post
    Have you been reading any of the previous posts? I'd recommend you re-read them and you'll find your answer.

    And why would I need evidence for my belief?
    I read your posts Sir.. and you are presenting your beliefs as being fact. This website deals in facts so if your beliefs are rooted in fact please provide links or cites to those facts.

    If you are stating your "opinion" please state that it is an "opinion". Everyone is entitled to an opinion... everyone has an opinion... including me. But opinions are not fact. And "beliefs" are also not always factually based.

    But it is a fact that to date there have not been any documented cases of citizen OC'ers "shot first" by bad guys after decades of many folks open carrying throughout the entire U.S.. If you can find one, just one!, documented incident where the citizen OC'er was "shot first" by the bad guy everyone here would be most interested in researching that incident. So if it is your "opinion" that an OC'er would be shot first... then that is your opinion or belief... but it is not documented fact.

    Hang around on this website and you will discover that folks here insist on facts. Those who have no facts to back up what they say rapidly lose credibility. But those who preface "opinions" and "beliefs" by stating they are such do retain credibility because whether opinions or beliefs are correct or not everyone is entitled to have them.
    Gun control isn't about the gun at all.... for those who want gun control it is all about their own fragile egos, their own lack of self esteem, their own inner fears, and most importantly... their own desire to dominate others. And an openly carried gun is a slap in the face to all of those things.

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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Bikenut View Post
    ...Hang around on this website and you will discover that folks here insist on facts. Those who have no facts to back up what they say rapidly lose credibility...
    +1

  23. #23
    Regular Member simmonsjoe's Avatar
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    +1

    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    +1
    yep yep yep.
    illegal ≠ immoral legal ≠ moral
    [SIZE=1]"I never submitted the whole system of my opinions to the creed of any party of men whatever in religion, in philosophy, in politics, or in anything else where I was capable of thinking for myself. "Such an addiction is the last degradation of a free and moral agent." - Thomas Jefferson
    G19 Gen 4; Bersa Thunder 380; Sig Sauer P238; Kel-Tec su-16c

  24. #24
    Regular Member t33j's Avatar
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    Bikenut that was... beautiful

    Off the top of my head I know of one encounter where a would be bank robber ran out the door after he noticed an OCer (Dennis O'Connor) in my state.
    Last edited by t33j; 08-07-2010 at 01:04 AM.
    Sic Semper Tyrannis

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    Combine that with Waffle House, and we have two known cases of OC deterring a crime. Plus probably thousands of cases that we'll never know about.

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