sultan62
Regular Member
As I was surfing the internet for OC-related info the other day, I came across something interesting: a petition to legalize OC in NC. http://www.petitiononline.com/ncoc/petition.html
As of this post, it has 70 signatures - I do not know how long it has been up. However, when I found it, I thought it might be useful information for the sponsor to know that OC is, in fact, legal. I came to these conclusions prior to reading the petition itself in depth, and after reading found one statement within the petition that is not simply misleading, but an outright lie.
At the time I initially found this, I contacted the sponsor of the petition to inform him that OC is perfectly legal in NC. Below is the conversation that took place over the course of two days via email, unedited except that my email address and name has been removed, replaced with "sultan62".
I probably was a little bit short with him. Frankly, I was frustrated.
As of this post, it has 70 signatures - I do not know how long it has been up. However, when I found it, I thought it might be useful information for the sponsor to know that OC is, in fact, legal. I came to these conclusions prior to reading the petition itself in depth, and after reading found one statement within the petition that is not simply misleading, but an outright lie.
In fact, North Carolina is one of only SIX states in the entire United States that completely bans open carry of handguns in public.
At the time I initially found this, I contacted the sponsor of the petition to inform him that OC is perfectly legal in NC. Below is the conversation that took place over the course of two days via email, unedited except that my email address and name has been removed, replaced with "sultan62".
On Aug 2, 2010, at 3:30 PM, sultan62 wrote:
You know Open Carry is already legal in NC, right? There is no law against it, which means it is legal. Here's a great pocket reference:
http://www.piedmontandeasterncarolinarailroad.com/NCPage1.pdf
http://www.piedmontandeasterncarolinarailroad.com/NCpage2.pdf
On Tue, Aug 3, 2010 at 12:37 PM, jay conkin <jay.conkin@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks for the reply, in NC open carry is very grey in NC. If a law officer decides that your firearm constitutes a threat (note perception, not reality) they can detain you under the "going to the terror to the public" statute. Therefore although it is "legal" on paper the law does not give a guarantee that your gun will not be confiscated and you detained. If this is doubted, one only needs to ask an acquaintance of mine who open carried into a local grocery store, he is a law abiding citizen and was actually on his way home from a shooting class and did not want to leave his gun in his car. He picked up his items and was on his way to the front of the store where he was greeted by several sheriff deputies who basically treated him as a felon and had him put his hands in the air (at taser point mind you) turn around and lock his fingers behind his head. They then removed his pistol and placed him in handcuffs, and removed him from the store. They questioned him as to why he had a gun, and he told them which apparently was not sufficient for them, and they confiscated his gun and cited him for "going armed to the terror of the public". Now if that is open carry, I am glad I have a concealed permit...
Thanks,
Jay
On Aug 3, 2010, at 3:57 PM, sultan62 wrote:
Did you even look at the links? There is no 'perception' legally allowed. Check out http://forum.opencarry.org/ if you want more information. What the police did concerning your friend was very much illegal and he should have filed a complaint, if not a lawsuit.
Furthermore, are you suggesting that it be made legal on paper? As in a statute that says "Open Carry of a firearm is legal in North Carolina"? That would set a very dangerous precedent. Laws are not there to tell us what is legal; they are to tell us what is illegal.
Have you ever open carried? I assure you, the vast majority of citizens and LEOs have no problem with it. Certainly, some do, though they have no right to do anything about it. If they do, they have broken the law and should be held accountable for it.
On Tue, Aug 3, 2010 at 4:43 PM, jay conkin <jay.conkin@gmail.com> wrote:
According to NC law, it is up to municipalities to dictate whether open carry is legal vs illegal. I would refer you to a discussion on THR (the high road) website concerning open carry in NC. There are other examples of case law to support the police to detain and confiscate firearms when charging one with "going armed to the terror of the public". It is the burden of the law to prove intent, but when you have unsympathetic judges and DA's on the issue of gun control, you can see where you can get into hot water when brandishing a firearm, even if it is holstered. In the link I have attached is the NC Supreme Court ruling concerning the "going armed" charge. It also could include knives, nun chucks, swords, even to something such as fingernail clippers if they so wanted. Most agree it is best to stay on the safe side in NC and not open carry as to not be harassed by local LE. As for a case, my acquaintance attempted a case that was thrown out of court, and the local PD was cleared of wrongdoing by the Sheriff Department IA investigation.
Jay
From sultan62 to jay.conkin@gmail.com
Yes, and Cary has a law against open carry. If you would bother to check any of the links I provided you, you would know this. They, and Durham County further regulate gun control beyond the state. You would also have seen the legal requirements for GAttTotP. Or, if you had checked the opencarry.org link I gave you, you would see that both legislation AND case law back up the strict requirements for GAttTotP.
If, as you say "Most agree it is best to stay on the safe side in NC and not open carry" why do so many carry without significant problems?
Also, if in your response you would actually address the questions I ask, I would appreciate it. I'll state them again since you clearly missed them before:
1. Did you even look at the links I provided?
2. Are you suggesting a law that explicitly states that open carry is legal? Additionally, do you not see the danger inherent in producing laws that tell us what we ARE allowed to do?
3. Have you ever open carried?
Also, you didn't provide a link in your email, so I was unable to check your references.
Lastly, I'm sorry about what happened to your friend. That doesn't change the fact that it was illegal. Was he convicted? I doubt it. We all know people who have been arrested on trumped up charges. (Such as a drano bomb being called a WMD)
I probably was a little bit short with him. Frankly, I was frustrated.