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Yes, another quick question

Chrome coytoe

Chrome coytoe

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Ok, I will make it as brief as possible.

I am getting married in 31 days. For a pre wedding present, I bought my WTB a pistol. Now, it is registered in my name, because I wanted it to be a surprise. That was about 45 days ago. Now, she surprised me and has not only decided to support me OCing, but she wants to start OCing herself! My question is can she legally OC a pistol registered in my name, or does it have to be registered in hers first? We are going to register it in her name. She can legal purchase and own a pistol, so in no way was it a straw purchase. Just a thoughtful man buying his soon to be a way to protect herself. And if it does need to be registered first, how would we go about transferring ownership? As always, I appreciate the help those wiser than me in the ways of firearms can offer.

By the way, neither of us have our CPL's (yet)
 
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eastmeyers

eastmeyers

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IANAL

Michigan - No she can not borrow your pistol (its in your name) unless she has a CPL. All you have to do to put it in her name is go up to you local police department (if the city/village/township you live in doesn't have one go to county) and transfer it into her name, "sell it to her", you need the serial number, make, model, length, and mag cap. Am I missing anything guys

Oh IANAL
 
Chrome coytoe

Chrome coytoe

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I thought that was the answer, but it never hurts to speak to those wiser than yourself. We want to register it to her, we have both been busy with wedding crap to think about it. Looks like we have a goal to accomplish this week.
 
eastmeyers

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Cities are different. Also different police departments have different time spans in which they issue the purchase permit. I live in Hazel Park, they have you fill out the app first and have it done before you finish the test :D, I guess if you fail the test they destroy or void it, I am not sure. However in Clawson they will have it ready for you before lunch the next business day. I have herd of other cities that take three days though. :banghead:

Don't worry about the test if you fail it you are safer to not be around a firearm! :p

Oh also I don't think the 3 day think is legal, I am sure someone will be around eventually to list it, I really don't feel like searching the MCLs for it. But maybe I will I am full of surprises. :cool:
 
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A

autosurgeon

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1. Go get purchase permit

2. bring PP home

3. fill out PP

4. Sign and get it notarized. (your bank likely can do this for you)

5. return MSP and Local Agency copies to the location you picked up PP from. (you can also mail it)

6. Have WTB carry her copy of PP for 30 days whenever she is OCing.

7. Carry on safely!
 
eastmeyers

eastmeyers

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autosurgeon said:
1. Go get purchase permit

2. bring PP home

3. fill out PP

4. Sign and get it notarized. (your bank likely can do this for you)

5. return MSP and Local Agency copies to the location you picked up PP from. (you can also mail it)

6. Have WTB carry her copy of PP for 30 days whenever she is OCing.

7. Carry on safely!
Click to expand...

Or you can do this all in one shot at the police department, just go together, this is what I do EVERY TIME I sell a firearm to someone with out a CPL. They usually notarize it their, and since the purchaser is a resident many cities will waive any fees. This has been the case every time I have done it. Of course she will still need to carry the PP for 30days while OCing.
 
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Michigander

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eastmeyers said:
Oh also I don't think the 3 day think is legal, I am sure someone will be around eventually to list it, I really don't feel like searching the MCLs for it. But maybe I will I am full of surprises. :cool:
Click to expand...

It isn't. "Due speed and diligence" is required by law when it comes to PD's issuing permits, and since the law doesn't specify any waiting periods or other roadblocks, they need to be issued immediately. If they won't fork them over right there on the spot, allowing you to pay them nothing and get it notarized where you please, they are in violation of the law. The only exception would be if they are REALLY busy, and legitimately don't have time that day. And if they claimed that, I'd be FOIAing the activities of the day, making sure it was a rare occurrence, otherwise, off to the city council, and failing their swift actions, the AG's office.
 
eastmeyers

eastmeyers

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Can you PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE list that MCL? This way I can email the Clawson city attorney and let them know that even though I personally am not offended that they have a 8-24 hour turn around period (most likely because I have a CPL) for PP, that they are still in violation and need to correct their actions. I actually remembered this being discussed here before, and the first time I went with a purchaser their I said they were in violation of the law, they assured me they were not. I immediately demanded to speak with the chief of police, and they said he was not in, they said that if I had a law to list they would look it up then and there and discuss it with me. I said never mind. I had it recorded too, but I deleted it not even thinking about it till now :banghead:. Dope on me!~
 
PDinDetroit

PDinDetroit

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http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?mcl-28-422

(3) The commissioner or chief of police of a city, township, or village police department that issues licenses to purchase, carry, possess, or transport pistols, or his or her duly authorized deputy, or the sheriff or his or her duly authorized deputy, in the parts of a county not included within a city, township, or village having an organized police department, in discharging the duty to issue licenses shall with due speed and diligence issue licenses to purchase, carry, possess, or transport pistols to qualified applicants residing within the city, village, township, or county, as applicable unless he or she has probable cause to believe that the applicant would be a threat to himself or herself or to other individuals, or would commit an offense with the pistol that would violate a law of this or another state or of the United States.
Click to expand...
 
eastmeyers

eastmeyers

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PDinDetroit said:
That would be correct. I had a friend that I put this together for, complete with answers in BOLD.
Click to expand...

No offense I disagree with the "study guide", you do not need to get them all right to pass, and if you don't pass you are not the type of person that is going to be safe around firearms. On the other hand their shouldn't be a test to get your "rights".
 
PDinDetroit

PDinDetroit

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eastmeyers said:
What is the legal deffination of "due speed and diligence"?
Click to expand...

I am not sure how this would legally be interpreted, as in a required within a specific time frame. Webster says:

Due - satisfying or capable of satisfying a need, obligation, or duty.
Speed - the act or state of moving swiftly.
Diligence - the attention and care legally expected or required of a person (as a party to a contract).

I guess this is just one more area that needs to be changed within the MI Laws, although it would probably be better to just abolish the mandatory Pistol Purchase Permit and have an optional one to cover other needs.
 
Agent1

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Chrome coytoe said:
Ok, I will make it as brief as possible.
She can legal purchase and own a pistol, so in no way was it a straw purchase.
By the way, neither of us have our CPL's (yet)
Click to expand...

If she is under 21, the ATF (or what ever they call them selves now) would disagree.
Once upon a time I was a FFL holder and Sporting Goods store owner. I had an ATF agent tell me that I could not sell my personal pistol to my 19 year old brother until 1 year after I purchased it. I have found no laws to support that but the ATF run on how they interpret the law this week. Be careful. Good luck!
 
Chrome coytoe

Chrome coytoe

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Hudsonville MI
Agent1 said:
If she is under 21, the ATF (or what ever they call them selves now) would disagree.
Once upon a time I was a FFL holder and Sporting Goods store owner. I had an ATF agent tell me that I could not sell my personal pistol to my 19 year old brother until 1 year after I purchased it. I have found no laws to support that but the ATF run on how they interpret the law this week. Be careful. Good luck!
Click to expand...

Nope, she is 23 and all good and legal. Its just a matter of getting our butts to the office to get the PP.
 
eastmeyers

eastmeyers

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Agent1 said:
If she is under 21, the ATF (or what ever they call them selves now) would disagree.
Once upon a time I was a FFL holder and Sporting Goods store owner. I had an ATF agent tell me that I could not sell my personal pistol to my 19 year old brother until 1 year after I purchased it. I have found no laws to support that but the ATF run on how they interpret the law this week. Be careful. Good luck!
Click to expand...

(this is in no offense to you agent1)

LEOs are not lawyers! This is BS! If you buy a pistol legally your good, than sell it legally your good. A "straw" purchase is when you sell a pistol to someone who can't legally posses one. I will go back to the Clawson thing... My girlfriend is 18 (yes eighteen) she made an agreement to purchase a pistol from a man in the Army that was leaving that day. We went to the Clawson police department, they said PP can be picked up next morning (this issue has already been addressed within this thread). I said she needed it that day, the lady at the front desk asked if I had a CPL motioning at my pistol, than handed me a RI 60 and said, you can buy it today, come in tomorrow and sell it to her than. This is what we did, perfectly legal!
 
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