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Thread: Westland Gas Station Customer helps break up gas station holdup

  1. #1
    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Westland Gas Station Customer helps break up gas station holdup

    Gas Station Customer helps break up gas station holdup

    http://www.hometownlife.com/article/...station+holdup

    "When the door was opened, the Westland man said the gunman grabbed the money from the woman and then cocked the gun. At that point, the Westland man said he yelled 'Back away from the girl' and drew his handgun, which he is licensed to carry concealed."
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

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    Allow me to be the first to say: that quote is badass.

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    Regular Member eastmeyers's Avatar
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    Kicka$$

    If he was carrying open would this had happened in the first place?
    Last edited by eastmeyers; 08-13-2010 at 10:09 PM.
    "Bam, I like saying bam when I cite something, in fact I think I shall do this from here on out, as long as I remember.
    Bam!" - eastmeyers

    "Then said he to them, But now he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his sack: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one."
    Luke 22:36
    God Bless

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    Regular Member PDinDetroit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eastmeyers View Post
    Kicka$$

    If he was carrying open would this had happened in the first place?
    Yes, because it was the LADY who was 33 WEEKS PREGNANT who was the target. Now, if she was Open Carrying that crook wouldn't have been anywhere near her. A momma bear, armed with black talons, would protect her offspring at all costs and even predators in the natural world know this!

    Pun WAS intended.

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    Regular Member detroit_fan's Avatar
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    Glad they caught the scumbag too!

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    This stuff makes me proud.

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    He left his car there? AHAHHAHAHAH, no matter how many you put in jail they will never learn.

    Whats even worse is that he drives a nicer car than I do, heck he probably stole that too.

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    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Yes! Typically criminals are focused on the prize not what happens around them. This is evidenced by the hundreds of times each year some dumb criminals commits a crime right in front of uniformed officers in this country. Those who watch shows like Cops have seen similar stupidity where a criminal never notices a cop while he is in the commission of a crime. One has to remember despite the Media portraying criminals as victims of the system, or super intellectuals gone bad, the fact is the average convict has an eight grade and even less of an education. I have dealt with them and I have yet to find one I would consider intelligent. Common sense would indicate the intelligent ones wouldn't get caught, or would find a way to make a living with far less risk involved.


    Quote Originally Posted by eastmeyers View Post
    Kicka$$

    If he was carrying open would this had happened in the first place?
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

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    Regular Member Bailenforcer's Avatar
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    Hmmm a gun toting and pointing Psychopath threatening to murder a pregnant women? Sounds like he's lucky the carry gun didn't shoot to protect the woman from the deranged psychopath. It would have been covered under the defense of other act. He is damn lucky.


    Quote Originally Posted by PDinDetroit View Post
    Yes, because it was the LADY who was 33 WEEKS PREGNANT who was the target. Now, if she was Open Carrying that crook wouldn't have been anywhere near her. A momma bear, armed with black talons, would protect her offspring at all costs and even predators in the natural world know this!

    Pun WAS intended.
    Exo 22:2 "If anyone catches a thief breaking in and hits him so that he dies, he is not guilty of murder.
    Luke 22:36: "Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." Luk 11:21 "When a strong man, with all his weapons ready, guards his own house, all his belongings are safe.

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    Regular Member PDinDetroit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bailenforcer View Post
    Hmmm a gun toting and pointing Psychopath threatening to murder a pregnant women? Sounds like he's lucky the carry gun didn't shoot to protect the woman from the deranged psychopath. It would have been covered under the defense of other act. He is damn lucky.
    He would have been protecting 2 lives, 33 weeks is just about ready to POP.

    According to the story, the scenario was the following (high-level):

    1. Perp approaches pregnant woman in car
    2. Perp pulls gun and demands money
    3. Pregnant woman hands over money
    4. Perp then cocks the gun

    Any reasonable person would have assumed at that step 4, the CPL Holder could have used deadly force to prevent the imminent death of or imminent great bodily harm to another individual. This would be a CLEAR and CONVINCING case of an act of self-defense justifying the application of deadly force according to MCL 780.972 Section 2 (1)(a).

    http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?mcl-780-972
    Last edited by PDinDetroit; 08-14-2010 at 10:22 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PDinDetroit View Post
    He would have been protecting 2 lives, 33 weeks is just about ready to POP.

    According to the story, the scenario was the following (high-level):

    1. Perp approaches pregnant woman in car
    2. Perp pulls gun and demands money
    3. Pregnant woman hands over money
    4. Perp then cocks the gun

    Any reasonable person would have assumed at that step 4, the CPL Holder could have used deadly force to prevent the imminent death of or imminent great bodily harm to another individual. This would be a CLEAR and CONVINCING case of an act of self-defense justifying the application of deadly force according to MCL 780.972 Section 2 (1)(a).

    http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?mcl-780-972
    I think deadly force would be justifiable at step 2. The situation occurred at night, hard to see the hammer. Also it could have been a double action weapon. Obviously deadly force is more justifiable at step 4, but shootings have been ruled justified for less than step 2.

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    Regular Member WARCHILD's Avatar
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    Flame away, but this is one scenario where I would have gladly played "mall ninja" and shot the guy "without" any verbal warning. The minute he cocked the gun, it showed his possible intent....my intent, protect the innocent, pull bang switch; danger ended.

    JMO

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    Quote Originally Posted by PDinDetroit View Post
    He would have been protecting 2 lives, 33 weeks is just about ready to POP.
    Thank you Thank you Thank you for pointing this out.

    IMO the perp could have been stopped at level 2.
    Last edited by stainless1911; 08-14-2010 at 11:32 AM.

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    Regular Member Jblack44's Avatar
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    Right around the corner from me. Armed robbery middle of the afternoon. Any time, any place!! Kudo's to the LAC who stepped up and saved the life of that woman. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    "If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid. That's ridiculous. If you have a gun, what in the hell do you have to be paranoid for." Clint Smith, Director of Thunder Ranch

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    Regular Member PDinDetroit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WARCHILD View Post
    Flame away, but this is one scenario where I would have gladly played "mall ninja" and shot the guy "without" any verbal warning. The minute he cocked the gun, it showed his possible intent....my intent, protect the innocent, pull bang switch; danger ended.

    JMO
    No flame necessary. I stated the position I did as I would not have taken the risk to this lady and her unborn child or myself by giving verbal warning. I would have shot to stop the threat.

    I hope to never use my firearms in self-defense, but I have made the decision to if the need arises.

  16. #16
    Regular Member PDinDetroit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainless1911 View Post
    Thank you Thank you Thank you for pointing this out.

    IMO the perp could have been stopped at level 2.
    I wouldn't disagree with that, I believe that a judge or jury would likely side with the self-defense action. It may take longer in court and cost more $ also.

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