'Steinhorst questions ...' Baraboo News Republic

The Don said:

He's one of the few people on here that is apparently using his real name and not hiding behind any aliases, myself and yourself included, something I respect a lot and wish I wasn't so paranoid about doing myself.

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Listen, if I got you wrong so be it. But guys with just a few posts should stay out of threads like this where all they do is confuse the situation.

Whatever you think of Doug, he was BANNED for using sock puppets in the past and will probably be permanently banned if caught using them again. Yes, he may use his own name for the majority of his post-whoring, but to make up Internet Friends such as Don Quixote and Sancho Panza to tag-team his BS is unconscionable and not allowed on any forum.

J.Gleason said:

And he represents WCI at the gun shows? yeeeesh, that really sets a lasting impression.

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COMMENTS REMOVED BY MODERATOR: Personal attack

Spartacus said:

Listen, if I got you wrong so be it. But guys with just a few posts should stay out of threads like this where all they do is confuse the situation.

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So I shouldn't post in threads that concern my home county where many of family still live because I'm new. I'm sorry, I must have missed that forum rule. Perhaps you could fill me in as to what sort of threads I should cut my teeth on and when exactly I'll be seasoned enough to post in threads that are relevant to me and mine?

BTW, you still haven't admitted you mis-attributed the initial Nazi reference. It's good to see you're still insulting and belittling others, though. Full marks for consistency and predictability.

The Don said:

So I shouldn't post in threads that concern my home county where many of family still live because I'm new. I'm sorry, I must have missed that forum rule. Perhaps you could fill me in as to what sort of threads I should cut my teeth on and when exactly I'll be seasoned enough to post in threads that are relevant to me and mine?

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I'm still not convinced you are not one of Dougie's sockpuppets. What I can do is search your posts to see if you have tag-teamed Dougie in the past.

But in the event you are a unique individual then yes, you should already know that it takes a while to gain credibility on a forum. I have actually met and interacted with most of the guys that post on here and I know who they are and what they stand for. When I know you or hear from others that they have met you in person then I will take you seriously. Until then you are a phantom who lacks credibility especially if you pop up only to defend a known ID thief like Doug.

The Don said:

BTW, you still haven't admitted you mis-attributed the initial Nazi reference. It's good to see you're still insulting and belittling others, though. Full marks for consistency and predictability.

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Although McX made the first comment, Dougie and his sockpuppets ran with it and quite frankly I am sick of his rhetoric in that regard so I commented on that and his use of false persona's to support the original post that was done in his name.

Spartacus said:

Listen, if I got you wrong so be it. But guys with just a few posts should stay out of threads like this where all they do is confuse the situation.

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Its a thread about a candidate running for Sheriff in Sauk county, how are they confusing the situation?

The persons home county, and has family living there? Is it your home county? Do you have family living here? Do you even care about the actual topic? Or do you just like to "confuse the situation"?

The Don has every right to post on here, you are not better or more special because you have more posts. In fact he only clarified your confusion when suggesting Doug made the nazi comment.

And you are totally confused if you think we can just vote out someone here with bad ideas on concealed carry, they are both saying almost the exact same things, directly from the ideas of law enforcement associations across the state. The democrat running is not a good candidate at all, I dont want to even get into that because I have ill feelings towards the person.

When you get something wrong you should apologize rather than continue to put someone down for no good reason. You were wrong about the nazi comment, wrong about the person being Doug, wrong about them confusing the situation, and wrong to say they should not post in a thread like this.

It is amazing how working at a couple of picnics and gun shows turns someone into an expert on everything. It would be in the best interest of everyone to just place the troll on your iggy list. Hopefully the mods will ban him for harassment.

minuteman said:

When you get something wrong you should apologize rather than continue to put someone down for no good reason. You were wrong about the nazi comment, wrong about the person being Doug, wrong about them confusing the situation, and wrong to say they should not post in a thread like this.

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I've asked John to check on the IP's of those in question so we will see how wrong I am.

How many times do I have to repeat that Doug was once banned for using sockpuppets to bolster his arguments?

Spartacus said:

I've asked John to check on the IP's of those in question so we will see how wrong I am.

How many times do I have to repeat that Doug was once banned for using sockpuppets to bolster his arguments?

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Thats fine, but accusing someone without proof is not right.

Spartacus said:

I've asked John to check on the IP's of those in question so we will see how wrong I am.

How many times do I have to repeat that Doug was once banned for using sockpuppets to bolster his arguments?

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Blah, blah, blah bla bla bla Blaaahhhhhhh!!

I don't really care how many log in names someone has. It is only those who argue without merit that have an issue with it.

J.Gleason said:

I don't really care how many log in names someone has.

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Maybe you don't care but forum rules state:

"13) MULTIPLE ACCOUNTS ARE NOT ALLOWED: Signing up multiple accounts (or alts) is a tactic employed by spammers and trolls and not legitimate members. Doing so will result in the banning of all accounts involved."

J.Gleason said:

It is amazing how working at a couple of picnics and gun shows turns someone into an expert on everything.

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My ex-wife used to minimize my accomplishments as well...

sorry for the long post, all.

***NOTE***I cut and paste into a word document for ease of editing on my part. Apologies for the non-standard quoted text indicators.

Spartacus: “I'm still not convinced you are not one of Dougie's sockpuppets. What I can do is search your posts to see if you have tag-teamed Dougie in the past.”

I seem to remember offering to provide you with any proof you wanted if you simply emailed me privately and asked. Which you haven’t bothered to do. Which I predicted. You have, however, continued to insult and belittle me and my opinion. Which I also predicted. It’s also nice to see you’re bothering to stop with the derogatory nick-names, too, with all the Dougie crap. I’m tempted to respond in kind, but I’m attempting to keep my side of this civil and limited to defense of myself and counters to your arguments. I’ll keep doing that, but you go ahead and continue with the derogatory nicknames. Your widely respected 371 posts seem to indicate that’s your stock in trade.

No need to search my posts, I’ll post all of my original 6 for all to see in my next post. I’m fairly certain there’s nothing in any of them supporting Doug in anyway, but if there is, I’ll freely acknowledge it.

Spartacus: “But in the event you are a unique individual then yes, you should already know that it takes a while to gain credibility on a forum. I have actually met and interacted with most of the guys that post on here and I know who they are and what they stand for. When I know you or hear from others that they have met you in person then I will take you seriously. Until then you are a phantom who lacks credibility especially if you pop up only to defend a known ID thief like Doug.”

I wasn’t aware credibility was required in order to point out an error of attribution. You’ve met and interacted with most guys here…how nice for you. Have you met and interacted with the Pope? I’m gonna go ahead and guess not. Does he lack credibility with you, as well? Also, I’m confused, has Doug previously created false users, or has he stolen actual users identities? That’s a fairly serious accusation to make, I think.

Also, you’re apparently the only one who thinks only people who’ve posted a lot are the ones with credibility. I lurked for a long time prior to starting to post, and I’ve never really got that impression from anyone else.

Spartacus: “Although McX made the first comment, Dougie and his sockpuppets ran with it and quite frankly I am sick of his rhetoric in that regard so I commented on that and his use of false persona's to support the original post that was done in his name.”

Again with the Dougie crap. The only nazi related comments I see other than McX’s original comment are by Doug, Don Quixote and Minuteman. One or two comments each. That hardly seems like “running with it”. Let’s try to keep the exaggeration to a minimum, please. As well as an additional comment by McX.

It’s fairly obvious you think Don Quixote is a sockpuppet, but are you now saying Minuteman is too? And I apparently am. (rolls eyes.) And we know you don’t like J. Gleason, too. So is anyone who supports Doug in any way a sockpuppet by default? Jesus, did Doug relieve himself in your cheerios after he shaved your puppy and burned down your house or something? You’ve got a pretty big hate-on for him.

Spartacus: “I've asked John to check on the IP's of those in question so we will see how wrong I am.”

Superb. And once we see that I’m not a sockpuppet will you admit you were wrong and apologize to me? Will you admit you were wrong and apologize to Doug? Will you admit you were wrong and apologize to anyone else you’ve asked John to investigate? As an aside to the administrator and/or John…as a suggestion, in the future, I think it would be fair to all members to let them know if another member has asked you to investigate them for any reason. We’re all about Freedom of Information when it comes to the police, let’s start practicing a bit of it here, since, frankly, I for one am starting to feel a bit harassed. For that matter, I’ve felt for quite a while that Spartacus’ attitude and posts towards Doug are beyond borderline harassment. My impression is other’s here feel the same way.

Btw, Spartacus, I’ll tell you for free (at least from my limited understanding of how IP address stuff works (I test software, but I’m not a sys admin and I’m not at work today so I can’t ask the sys admins I know how all that works)) that my IP addresses will show the west side of Madison for when I post when I’m at work, Cambridge for when I post when I’m at home, and I don’t have a clue what they’ll show when I post from my Verizon phone.

Spartacus: “How many times do I have to repeat that Doug was once banned for using sockpuppets to bolster his arguments?”

Yes, yes, you’ve made that very clear. However, the original issue (which got this post WAY off topic (and I do apologize for that – that certainly wasn’t my intent)), was that YOU mis-attributed something. Nothing at all to do with Doug having had sockpuppets in the past. You turned it to that all by yourself, free of help from anyone else. Like you nearly always do anyTIME anyONE posts anything even remotely in support of Doug. Again, you’ve got a whole lot of hate in your heart for Doug. My opinion…is using multiple users wrong…sure, if it’s against the forum rules as it is here. Did Doug do that…you say he did and I have no reason to believe you’re wrong or right about that. Since no one has stated anything to the contrary, I’m going to assume you’re right. Was that wrong of Doug? Yes it was. Did Doug get punished for that in accordance with the aforementioned rules? Apparently he did. Has Doug ‘served his time’? Apparently he has since the administrators/moderators have let him back on the forum. That seems to be good enough for everyone but you. Maybe you could just, you know… Let. It. Go.

I’ll be waiting for that apology once John proves to you that I’m not a sockpuppet. But I won’t hold my breath.

Spartacus said:

My ex-wife used to minimize my accomplishments as well...

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I bet we can all guess why she is your ex. I am sure we would all get along with her just fine.

Spartacus said:

Maybe you don't care but forum rules state:

"13) MULTIPLE ACCOUNTS ARE NOT ALLOWED: Signing up multiple accounts (or alts) is a tactic employed by spammers and trolls and not legitimate members. Doing so will result in the banning of all accounts involved."

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(6) NO PERSONAL ATTACKS: While you may disagree strongly with another poster based upon their opinion, we will NOT tolerate any personal attacks or general bashing of groups of people based upon race, religion, sex, or choice of occupation (e.g., being a law enforcement officer, in the military, etc). NOTE THAT THIS RULE APPLIES TO PMs AS WELL AS FORUM POSTS!!!
(8) KEEP IT ON-TOPIC: All gun rights discussions not directly related to open carry should take place in the "General Discussions" forum and topics that are not related to gun rights at all should take place in "The Lounge". Please police your own posts before posting them and help keep OCDO strong and focused.
(9) HATE IS NOT WELCOME HERE: Any posts attacking others based upon race, religions, national origin, sexual orientation, or anything other than opposition to gun rights is NOT WELCOME HERE! We reserve the right to impose immediate bans for such behavior.

I guess you missed these rules huh?

my posts

POST 1
5/28/2010 – Thread: FN Herstal
I have a FN 5.7 and I love it. I rank it behind my HK .45 Tactical (and the Sig P220 I used to have) only because I have a strange obsession with .45's. On the other hand, I'd rank it behind the pair of stainless Springfield 1911's I used to have.

Very accurate, almost zero recoil, 20 rounds, easy to disassemble and clean.

***comment*** - no Doug supporting here…just answering another member’s question with relevant information.

POST 2
7/2/2010 – Thread: examiner.com – District Attorney declares most state gun laws unconstitutional
subject: car jacking and open carry with my wife
about 5 years ago my wife nearly got car jacked on South Park street, right near the Beltline, after taking a night class down that way. stopped at a stoplight and a guy moved in front of her car and started pounding on the hood, another guy stood behind the car pounding on the trunk and a third guy was walking toward her window when she cranked the wheel to get around the guy in front of her and ran the red light to get away. about a month later i bought her a walther p22 for her birthday (she's only 5'3" and doesn't have a lot of upper body strength, figured we'd work up to a .380 or *maybe* a 9mm). anyway, she's only fired it twice and despite saying she wants to learn how, always as an excuse not to.

all that aside, she's gradually coming around to the idea of me open carrying (even said angrily, when we heard a talk show host on The Mic 92.1 say that now that supreme court made their ruling that he needs to be afraid of anyone pulling out a gun and blowing his brains out, that the people who (open) carry legally aren't the ones he needs to be worried about). still, though, she says if she saw someone open carrying when shopping (alone or with our 2.5 year old) she's going to high tail it the other way just in case. frustrating attitude, but it's better than saying she'd call the cops, which is what she was saying a month ago.

and yes, i said The Mic 921...i'm one of those rare liberal gun owners. so i get it from both sides on this issue. which is a lot of fun.

***comment*** no Doug supporting here either, just relaying a personal story, I think in response to a similar story another member had.

POST 3
7/2/2010 – Thread: Holster Review
subject: holster/holster rig question
I have an HK USP .45 Tactical, which would probably be the pistol I would open carry when I start. That or my FN Five-seveN. I have two questions.

1. Regardless of which one I ultimately decide to carry, I'm a bigger guy and the few times I've worn a hip/belt holster in the past while target shooting I haven't enjoyed the way it felt. Has anyone on here (who would care to share) had much experience with drop holsters or any kind of rig setup they'd recommend? I don't really want to go with a tactical thigh holster for various reasons. Anyone have any thoughts or recommendations?

2. I will probably carry the HK for a variety of reasons, especially for the reduced risk of over-penetration (and all that increased liability (or whatever the right term is)) as compared to the 5.7...should anything ever happen where I'd need to use it. Anyone have an holster recommendations or experience for an HK USP .45 Tactical?

Thanks for any feedback or recommendations, I really appreciate it.

***comment*** - hmmm…still no Doug support, just asking a question about holsters for my HK and FN.

POST 4
8/25/2010 – Thread: I don’t get it/need help
subject: Am I Free to Leave vs. Am I Under Arrest
Originally Posted by paul@paul-fisher.com
Actually, I believe the correct question is 'am I free to leave'. That is basically asking if they have RAS. Am I under arrest is asking if they have PC. If they have RAS and you leave then I believe you can be charged with obstruction/resisting.

No matter if they have RAS or PC or walked in while you were doing an actual crime, you don't have to identify yourself.

Just curious, would it make sense to first ask, "Am I under arrest?" and if the answer is "No", then follow that up with "Am I free to leave?"?

Or is that inviting trouble in some way?

If the officer says you're not free to leave, is it appropriate to ask what their RAS is, or is it better to just remain silent and/or ask for a lawyer?

Thanks.

***comment*** STILL no Doug support! Jeez. Just asking a question to clarify the best way to deal with police if I’m ever stopped.

POST 5
8/25/2010 – Thread: I don’t get it/need help
thanks all, that answered my questions.

***comment*** Now technically I suppose this could be considered Doug support since I was thanking him and Wisconsin Carry, Inc. – Chairman, and Paul Fisher for answers to my question. But seriously, is this really supporting Doug? Sure doesn’t seem like it.

POST 6
8/27/2010 – Thread: ‘Steinhorst questions’…Baraboo News Repulic
Originally Posted by Spartacus
Dougie your references to elected officials as Nazis is stupid at best. We vote them out if we don't agree with them but even at their worst they are hardly comparable to schutzstaffel except in your twisted consciousness.

Just to clarify, Doug didn't make the initial comparison to the SS. Perhaps you overlooked that in your haste to berate him.

***comment*** - and that brings us to this, the post that got you all fired up claiming I was one of Doug's sockpuppets. Starting to feel silly yet? Since so far none of your claims about me have turned out to be true. I know I would be.

J.Gleason said:

(6) NO PERSONAL ATTACKS: While you may disagree strongly with another poster based upon their opinion, we will NOT tolerate any personal attacks or general bashing of groups of people based upon race, religion, sex, or choice of occupation (e.g., being a law enforcement officer, in the military, etc). NOTE THAT THIS RULE APPLIES TO PMs AS WELL AS FORUM POSTS!!!
(8) KEEP IT ON-TOPIC: All gun rights discussions not directly related to open carry should take place in the "General Discussions" forum and topics that are not related to gun rights at all should take place in "The Lounge". Please police your own posts before posting them and help keep OCDO strong and focused.
(9) HATE IS NOT WELCOME HERE: Any posts attacking others based upon race, religions, national origin, sexual orientation, or anything other than opposition to gun rights is NOT WELCOME HERE! We reserve the right to impose immediate bans for such behavior.

I guess you missed these rules huh?

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clearly some rules are more important than others.

Pay him no mind Don, I for one value your membership here and your posts. Thanks for joining us.

The Don said:

***comment*** - and that brings us to this, the post that got you all fired up claiming I was one of Doug's sockpuppets. Starting to feel silly yet? Since so far none of your claims about me have turned out to be true. I know I would be.

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So you are not. Fine. Then so you made a big deal about nothing but proved your point. Good for you and welcome to the forum.

I am probably correct on the others though, and know for a fact that Doug has used them in the past and was banned for it.

Spartacus said:

So you are not. Fine. Then so you made a big deal about nothing but proved your point. Good for you and welcome to the forum.

I am probably correct on the others though, and know for a fact that Doug has used them in the past and was banned for it.

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*I*made a big deal about nothing?!? Seems to me since you've now *barely* admitted you were wrong you were the one who made a big deal about nothing. All I did was defend myself as required since you were apparently trying to have me banned for something I wasn't. Btw, while you did sort of admit you were wrong, I notice you didn't apologize to Doug or I for your baseless accusations. As predicted.

Also, I'm curious...would you have even admitted you were wrong if I hadn't posted all 6 of my original posts? Or would have quietly dropped the issue and hoped no one noticed? Or did you even bother to look at my posts?

Again with the past history. Tired. At least you didn't call him Dougie this time.