Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 50

Thread: Question regarding carrying on school grounds

  1. #1
    Regular Member joejoejoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Vancouver, WA
    Posts
    321

    Question regarding carrying on school grounds

    Say my wife wants to take the dog to the school yard to get them some exercise and it is after school hours (like 9PM at night), can she carry there? It is not on school grounds (i.e. in the buildings or even in the parking lot), it is just the area where they do track and stuff.

    Joe~

  2. #2
    Regular Member 1245A Defender's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    north mason county, Washington, USA
    Posts
    4,381

    9.41.280 (1)

    when the track and field area is NOT being used for school activities
    it is not prohibited . i am sure it would be lawful, unless theyre having a meet!
    EMNofSeattle wrote: Your idea of freedom terrifies me. So you are actually right. I am perfectly happy with what you call tyranny.....

    “If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”

    Stand up for your Rights,, They have no authority on their own...

    All power is inherent in the people,
    it is their right and duty to be at all times ARMED!

  3. #3
    Regular Member joejoejoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Vancouver, WA
    Posts
    321
    Also, I have a question about college campuses. WSU Vancouver bans the possession of firearms. It is a WAC (Washington Administrative Code) that firearms are not allowed on WSU campuses. I don't seem to understand what happens when you are caught breaking that code. Are you breaking the law and are subject to criminal charges or are you just breaking campus code and are subject to the campus's punishment?

    Joe~

  4. #4
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Seattle, Washington, USA
    Posts
    923
    IIRC There is no carry allowed on school property unless you have a CPL AND you are picking up or dropping off a student.

    Are you sure the field is actually school property? it might be a city or county park. My highschool did track and field stuff in a park next to the school. The park looked like it was part of the school property but it was actually a county park.

    Keep in mind however that it may still be considered "school grounds" during the time that the school is using it.
    A wise and frugal Government, which shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government.- Thomas Jefferson March 4 1801

  5. #5
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Seattle, Washington, USA
    Posts
    923
    Quote Originally Posted by joejoejoe View Post
    Also, I have a question about college campuses. WSU Vancouver bans the possession of firearms. It is a WAC (Washington Administrative Code) that firearms are not allowed on WSU campuses. I don't seem to understand what happens when you are caught breaking that code. Are you breaking the law and are subject to criminal charges or are you just breaking campus code and are subject to the campus's punishment?

    Joe~

    You are only breaking school rules
    A wise and frugal Government, which shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government.- Thomas Jefferson March 4 1801

  6. #6
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Seattle, Washington, USA
    Posts
    923
    Quote Originally Posted by 1245A Defender View Post
    when the track and field area is NOT being used for school activities
    it is not prohibited . i am sure it would be lawful, unless theyre having a meet!

    If the track and field area is school property then it IS prohibited wether it is in use or not.

    (1) It is unlawful for a person to carry onto, or to possess on, public or private elementary or secondary school premises, school-provided transportation, or areas of facilities while being used exclusively by public or private schools:

    The "areas of facilities while being used" part refers to areas that are not part of the school property but are being used for a school event. Such as a meeting room in a library that is hosting a spelling bee.
    A wise and frugal Government, which shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government.- Thomas Jefferson March 4 1801

  7. #7
    Opt-Out Members BigDave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Yakima, Washington, USA
    Posts
    3,463
    Quote Originally Posted by 1245A Defender View Post
    when the track and field area is NOT being used for school activities
    it is not prohibited . i am sure it would be lawful, unless they're having a meet!
    Good luck on that interpretation and if noticed will likely have a court date.

    (1) It is unlawful for a person to carry onto, or to possess on, public or private elementary or secondary school premises, school-provided transportation, or areas of facilities while being used exclusively by public or private schools:

    Note the bolded area, or areas of facilities this means such as a stadium or venues being held by a school, has nothing to do with school grounds as the will be off limits.

    There is a provision to carry while dropping off or picking up a student but not outside of that.
    • Being prepared is to prepare, this is our responsibility.
    • I am not your Mommy or Daddy and do not sugar coat it but I will tell you simply as how I see it, it is up to you on how you will or will not use it.
    • IANAL, all information I present is for your review, do your own homework.

  8. #8
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Lakewood, Washington, USA
    Posts
    305
    Quote Originally Posted by BigDave View Post
    Good luck on that interpretation and if noticed will likely have a court date.

    (1) It is unlawful for a person to carry onto, or to possess on, public or private elementary or secondary school premises, school-provided transportation, or areas of facilities while being used exclusively by public or private schools:

    Note the bolded area, or areas of facilities this means such as a stadium or venues being held by a school, has nothing to do with school grounds as the will be off limits.

    There is a provision to carry while dropping off or picking up a student but not outside of that.
    Why does this code include private schools when they located on private property? Shouldn't it be up to the private school how to address firearms on their own property?
    Last edited by Nosrac; 09-03-2010 at 12:52 PM.

  9. #9
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Whatcom County
    Posts
    17,338
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    Also, don't forget, without a Washington CPL (for a school located in Washington) the 1000' Federal prohibition applies.
    Yep, although I haven't heard one case were any WA LEO have prosecuted for this.
    This federal law needs to go it is unconstitutional, how does this effect interstate commerce.

  10. #10
    Regular Member joejoejoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Vancouver, WA
    Posts
    321
    My private property (my house) is less than 100 yards from the school. Not sure how that applies to the 1000' rule. So the overall consensus is NO I cannot carry in the yard after school hours?

    Also, NO I will not be criminally charged if caught carrying on college grounds?

    Joe~

  11. #11
    Opt-Out Members BigDave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Yakima, Washington, USA
    Posts
    3,463
    Quote Originally Posted by BigDave View Post
    Good luck on that interpretation and if noticed will likely have a court date.

    (1) It is unlawful for a person to carry onto, or to possess on, public or private elementary or secondary school premises, school-provided transportation, or areas of facilities while being used exclusively by public or private schools:

    Note the bolded area, or areas of facilities this means such as a stadium or venues being held by a school, has nothing to do with school grounds as the will be off limits.

    There is a provision to carry while dropping off or picking up a student but not outside of that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nosrac View Post
    Why does this code include private schools when they located on private property? Shouldn't it be up to the private school how to address firearms on their own property?
    Why? because the legislature encompassed Public and Private together in the RCW is the only answer I have.
    • Being prepared is to prepare, this is our responsibility.
    • I am not your Mommy or Daddy and do not sugar coat it but I will tell you simply as how I see it, it is up to you on how you will or will not use it.
    • IANAL, all information I present is for your review, do your own homework.

  12. #12
    Regular Member Bob Warden's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Kent, Washington, USA
    Posts
    192
    When I famously carried into the SW Seattle Community Center last November, I was no more than 50 yards from both Chief Sealth High School and Denny Middle School. In light of Heller / McDonald, it's pretty clear to me that the 1000' rule would be held unconstitutional if enforced.
    Last edited by Bob Warden; 09-03-2010 at 02:09 PM.

  13. #13
    Regular Member Lammo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Spokane, Washington, USA
    Posts
    581
    Quote Originally Posted by joejoejoe View Post
    Also, I have a question about college campuses. WSU Vancouver bans the possession of firearms. It is a WAC (Washington Administrative Code) that firearms are not allowed on WSU campuses. I don't seem to understand what happens when you are caught breaking that code. Are you breaking the law and are subject to criminal charges or are you just breaking campus code and are subject to the campus's punishment?

    Joe~
    I have not researched this in any depth but I do not believe these rules can be applied to someone who is not a student, faculty member or employee. These provisions are generally found in the student conduct code, e.g., WAC 478-120-020 for the UW. The WAC on the UW also purports to apply a similar restriction to "members of the university community". WAC 478-124-010 & 020. The most they could do to a non-student is trespass them. WAC 478-124-030.

    I don't know about any of you but I'm a Bulldog and definitely not a member of any Husky "university community". GO ZAGS!!!!!
    IAALBIAAFTDPASNIPHCBCALA
    Don't be so open minded that your brains fall out. (John Corapi, The Black Sheep Dog)
    Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read. (Groucho Marx)

  14. #14
    Regular Member joejoejoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Vancouver, WA
    Posts
    321
    Well it's WSU not UW. WSU are cougars... Also, I am a student

    Joe~

  15. #15
    Regular Member Lammo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Spokane, Washington, USA
    Posts
    581
    Quote Originally Posted by joejoejoe View Post
    Well it's WSU not UW. WSU are cougars... Also, I am a student

    Joe~
    Ran across the UW section of the WAC before I could find the one for WSU. Suspect it's the same/similar language with different numbers. As a student I think you are stuck, unless you want to risk expulsion. Sorry. :-(
    IAALBIAAFTDPASNIPHCBCALA
    Don't be so open minded that your brains fall out. (John Corapi, The Black Sheep Dog)
    Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read. (Groucho Marx)

  16. #16
    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    North of Seattle, Washington, USA
    Posts
    5,953
    Quote Originally Posted by Lammo View Post
    I have not researched this in any depth but I do not believe these rules can be applied to someone who is not a student, faculty member or employee. These provisions are generally found in the student conduct code, e.g., WAC 478-120-020 for the UW. The WAC on the UW also purports to apply a similar restriction to "members of the university community". WAC 478-124-010 & 020. The most they could do to a non-student is trespass them. WAC 478-124-030.

    I don't know about any of you but I'm a Bulldog and definitely not a member of any Husky "university community". GO ZAGS!!!!!
    (from Washington State Legislature web site)
    "Washington Administrative Code (WAC) — Regulations of executive branch agencies are issued by authority of statutes. Like legislation and the Constitution, regulations are a source of primary law in Washington State. The WAC codifies the regulations and arranges them by subject or agency. "

    Wouldn't a WAC, being a souce of primary law, have the weight of law?
    Last edited by amlevin; 09-03-2010 at 07:43 PM.

  17. #17
    Regular Member joejoejoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Vancouver, WA
    Posts
    321
    That's what I was wondering amlevin, but the disciplinary actions only say it is up to the school administration.

    Joe~

  18. #18
    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    North of Seattle, Washington, USA
    Posts
    5,953
    Quote Originally Posted by joejoejoe View Post
    That's what I was wondering amlevin, but the disciplinary actions only say it is up to the school administration.

    Joe~
    For students perhaps. if a non-student then maybe the police get called. A non student could be trespassed.

  19. #19
    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Federal Way, Washington, USA
    Posts
    5,667

    You can conceal.

    You can open carry an empty holtser.
    You can start a chapter for carry on campus.
    You can seek written permission from the campus President.

    Lot's of choices. There are groups around the U.S. for CC on campus. There are states that allow carry. (Utah)

    I suggest you form a plan of action before commiting to one or more avenues, as when you do seek permission or carry an empty holster your option to CC may be endangered.

    Quote Originally Posted by joejoejoe View Post
    Well it's WSU not UW. WSU are cougars... Also, I am a student

    Joe~
    Live Free or Die!

  20. #20
    Regular Member joejoejoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Vancouver, WA
    Posts
    321
    Start a chapter you say? What is that, and how do I start?

  21. #21
    Regular Member 1245A Defender's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    north mason county, Washington, USA
    Posts
    4,381

    talk to this guy..

    Quote Originally Posted by joejoejoe View Post
    Start a chapter you say? What is that, and how do I start?
    We-the-People he is very active in oregon, OC and school carry activism...
    EMNofSeattle wrote: Your idea of freedom terrifies me. So you are actually right. I am perfectly happy with what you call tyranny.....

    “If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”

    Stand up for your Rights,, They have no authority on their own...

    All power is inherent in the people,
    it is their right and duty to be at all times ARMED!

  22. #22
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Whatcom County
    Posts
    17,338
    PM Just_a_car.....he might have some good info for you.

  23. #23
    Regular Member GreatWhiteLlama's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Bothell, Washington, USA
    Posts
    287
    Quote Originally Posted by BigDave View Post
    Good luck on that interpretation and if noticed will likely have a court date.

    (1) It is unlawful for a person to carry onto, or to possess on, public or private elementary or secondary school premises, school-provided transportation, or areas of facilities while being used exclusively by public or private schools:

    Note the bolded area, or areas of facilities this means such as a stadium or venues being held by a school, has nothing to do with school grounds as the will be off limits.

    There is a provision to carry while dropping off or picking up a student but not outside of that.
    The track and field parts of school property become open to the public after hours, thereby making carrying there legal. I remember this being brought up before with a cite, but I cannot seem to locate it now...

  24. #24
    Opt-Out Members BigDave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Yakima, Washington, USA
    Posts
    3,463
    Quote Originally Posted by Big Dave
    Good luck on that interpretation and if noticed will likely have a court date.

    (1) It is unlawful for a person to carry onto, or to possess on, public or private elementary or secondary school premises, school-provided transportation, or areas of facilities while being used exclusively by public or private schools:

    Note the bolded area, or areas of facilities this means such as a stadium or venues being held by a school, has nothing to do with school grounds as the will be off limits.

    There is a provision to carry while dropping off or picking up a student but not outside of that.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatWhiteLlama View Post
    The track and field parts of school property become open to the public after hours, thereby making carrying there legal. I remember this being brought up before with a cite, but I cannot seem to locate it now...
    RCW 9.41.280(3) Subsection (1) of this section does not apply to:

    (a) Any student or employee of a private military academy when on the property of the academy;

    (b) Any person engaged in military, law enforcement, or school district security activities. However, a person who is not a commissioned law enforcement officer and who provides school security services under the direction of a school administrator may not possess a device listed in subsection (1)(f) of this section unless he or she has successfully completed training in the use of such devices that is equivalent to the training received by commissioned law enforcement officers;

    (c) Any person who is involved in a convention, showing, demonstration, lecture, or firearms safety course authorized by school authorities in which the firearms of collectors or instructors are handled or displayed;

    (d) Any person while the person is participating in a firearms or air gun competition approved by the school or school district;

    (e) Any person in possession of a pistol who has been issued a license under RCW 9.41.070, or is exempt from the licensing requirement by RCW 9.41.060, while picking up or dropping off a student;

    (f) Any nonstudent at least eighteen years of age legally in possession of a firearm or dangerous weapon that is secured within an attended vehicle or concealed from view within a locked unattended vehicle while conducting legitimate business at the school;

    (g) Any nonstudent at least eighteen years of age who is in lawful possession of an unloaded firearm, secured in a vehicle while conducting legitimate business at the school; or

    (h) Any law enforcement officer of the federal, state, or local government agency.

    (4) Subsections (1)(c) and (d) of this section do not apply to any person who possesses nun-chu-ka sticks, throwing stars, or other dangerous weapons to be used in martial arts classes authorized to be conducted on the school premises.

    (5) Subsection (1)(f)(i) of this section does not apply to any person who possesses a device listed in subsection (1)(f)(i) of this section, if the device is possessed and used solely for the purpose approved by a school for use in a school authorized event, lecture, or activity conducted on the school premises.

    (6) Except as provided in subsection (3)(b), (c), (f), and (h) of this section, firearms are not permitted in a public or private school building.

    (7) "GUN-FREE ZONE" signs shall be posted around school facilities giving warning of the prohibition of the possession of firearms on school grounds.

    [2009 c 453 § 1; 1999 c 167 § 1; 1996 c 295 § 13; 1995 c 87 § 1; 1994 sp.s. c 7 § 427; 1993 c 347 § 1; 1989 c 219 § 1; 1982 1st ex.s. c 47 § 4.]
    This RCW is pretty clear, as you see I have pasted the exceptions and no where in it does it indicate that carry upon school property after hours or while not in use.
    If you can find your reference I would be happy to read it as well.
    • Being prepared is to prepare, this is our responsibility.
    • I am not your Mommy or Daddy and do not sugar coat it but I will tell you simply as how I see it, it is up to you on how you will or will not use it.
    • IANAL, all information I present is for your review, do your own homework.

  25. #25
    Regular Member tombrewster421's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Roy, WA
    Posts
    1,329
    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLT View Post
    So, exactly what hours/days can I carry my gun past those "Gun Free School Zone" signs? The last time I looked at one of those signs, I didn't see applicable times listed or any such phrase as "when children are present". I have a feeling you aren't going to locate that citation in RCW.
    The only place I've seen the gun free zone signs is at the entrances to the buildings. I don't recall ever seeing them on a fence surrounding a school.
    Guns don't kill people, bullets do!

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •