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Question regarding carrying on school grounds
- Thread starter joejoejoe
- Start date
sudden valley gunner
Regular Member
PM Just_a_car.....he might have some good info for you.
GreatWhiteLlama
Regular Member
The track and field parts of school property become open to the public after hours, thereby making carrying there legal. I remember this being brought up before with a cite, but I cannot seem to locate it now...
BigDave
Opt-Out Members
Big Dave said:
RCW 9.41.280(3) Subsection (1) of this section does not apply to:
(a) Any student or employee of a private military academy when on the property of the academy;
(b) Any person engaged in military, law enforcement, or school district security activities. However, a person who is not a commissioned law enforcement officer and who provides school security services under the direction of a school administrator may not possess a device listed in subsection (1)(f) of this section unless he or she has successfully completed training in the use of such devices that is equivalent to the training received by commissioned law enforcement officers;
(c) Any person who is involved in a convention, showing, demonstration, lecture, or firearms safety course authorized by school authorities in which the firearms of collectors or instructors are handled or displayed;
(d) Any person while the person is participating in a firearms or air gun competition approved by the school or school district;
(e) Any person in possession of a pistol who has been issued a license under RCW 9.41.070, or is exempt from the licensing requirement by RCW 9.41.060, while picking up or dropping off a student;
(f) Any nonstudent at least eighteen years of age legally in possession of a firearm or dangerous weapon that is secured within an attended vehicle or concealed from view within a locked unattended vehicle while conducting legitimate business at the school;
(g) Any nonstudent at least eighteen years of age who is in lawful possession of an unloaded firearm, secured in a vehicle while conducting legitimate business at the school; or
(h) Any law enforcement officer of the federal, state, or local government agency.
(4) Subsections (1)(c) and (d) of this section do not apply to any person who possesses nun-chu-ka sticks, throwing stars, or other dangerous weapons to be used in martial arts classes authorized to be conducted on the school premises.
(5) Subsection (1)(f)(i) of this section does not apply to any person who possesses a device listed in subsection (1)(f)(i) of this section, if the device is possessed and used solely for the purpose approved by a school for use in a school authorized event, lecture, or activity conducted on the school premises.
(6) Except as provided in subsection (3)(b), (c), (f), and (h) of this section, firearms are not permitted in a public or private school building.
(7) "GUN-FREE ZONE" signs shall be posted around school facilities giving warning of the prohibition of the possession of firearms on school grounds.
[2009 c 453 § 1; 1999 c 167 § 1; 1996 c 295 § 13; 1995 c 87 § 1; 1994 sp.s. c 7 § 427; 1993 c 347 § 1; 1989 c 219 § 1; 1982 1st ex.s. c 47 § 4.]
This RCW is pretty clear, as you see I have pasted the exceptions and no where in it does it indicate that carry upon school property after hours or while not in use.(a) Any student or employee of a private military academy when on the property of the academy;
(b) Any person engaged in military, law enforcement, or school district security activities. However, a person who is not a commissioned law enforcement officer and who provides school security services under the direction of a school administrator may not possess a device listed in subsection (1)(f) of this section unless he or she has successfully completed training in the use of such devices that is equivalent to the training received by commissioned law enforcement officers;
(c) Any person who is involved in a convention, showing, demonstration, lecture, or firearms safety course authorized by school authorities in which the firearms of collectors or instructors are handled or displayed;
(d) Any person while the person is participating in a firearms or air gun competition approved by the school or school district;
(e) Any person in possession of a pistol who has been issued a license under RCW 9.41.070, or is exempt from the licensing requirement by RCW 9.41.060, while picking up or dropping off a student;
(f) Any nonstudent at least eighteen years of age legally in possession of a firearm or dangerous weapon that is secured within an attended vehicle or concealed from view within a locked unattended vehicle while conducting legitimate business at the school;
(g) Any nonstudent at least eighteen years of age who is in lawful possession of an unloaded firearm, secured in a vehicle while conducting legitimate business at the school; or
(h) Any law enforcement officer of the federal, state, or local government agency.
(4) Subsections (1)(c) and (d) of this section do not apply to any person who possesses nun-chu-ka sticks, throwing stars, or other dangerous weapons to be used in martial arts classes authorized to be conducted on the school premises.
(5) Subsection (1)(f)(i) of this section does not apply to any person who possesses a device listed in subsection (1)(f)(i) of this section, if the device is possessed and used solely for the purpose approved by a school for use in a school authorized event, lecture, or activity conducted on the school premises.
(6) Except as provided in subsection (3)(b), (c), (f), and (h) of this section, firearms are not permitted in a public or private school building.
(7) "GUN-FREE ZONE" signs shall be posted around school facilities giving warning of the prohibition of the possession of firearms on school grounds.
[2009 c 453 § 1; 1999 c 167 § 1; 1996 c 295 § 13; 1995 c 87 § 1; 1994 sp.s. c 7 § 427; 1993 c 347 § 1; 1989 c 219 § 1; 1982 1st ex.s. c 47 § 4.]
If you can find your reference I would be happy to read it as well.
tombrewster421
Regular Member
The only place I've seen the gun free zone signs is at the entrances to the buildings. I don't recall ever seeing them on a fence surrounding a school.
BigDave
Opt-Out Members
As to posting or not posting a gun free zone really has no less merit to it then the RCW prohibiting it.
There is no consequence for the school not to post and still have intact the school and property being prohibited.
Stretch
Regular Member
Thought this might be an appropriate thread to place my thoughts in:
Went to a city park last night with the family to practice some softball exercises. This park is directly connected to a local elementary school. Now, there is no fence or any way to really determine where the park ends, and where the school grounds begin. I do want to make it clear that the sign for the park does not have language that violates our 2A rights, and does limit the discharge of a weapon.
Here is a satellite view of the park/school properties: http://tinyurl.com/23kq425
I did some digging this morning and found the county assessor's site with defined borders, as to where the city property ends and the school property begins. I found it highly irritating that one could possibly be in jeopardy of violating the school zone laws without actually being in the school's property.
Went to a city park last night with the family to practice some softball exercises. This park is directly connected to a local elementary school. Now, there is no fence or any way to really determine where the park ends, and where the school grounds begin. I do want to make it clear that the sign for the park does not have language that violates our 2A rights, and does limit the discharge of a weapon.
Here is a satellite view of the park/school properties: http://tinyurl.com/23kq425
I did some digging this morning and found the county assessor's site with defined borders, as to where the city property ends and the school property begins. I found it highly irritating that one could possibly be in jeopardy of violating the school zone laws without actually being in the school's property.
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daddy4count
Regular Member
In my opinion WA law is pretty straight forward and clear...
With very few exceptions you cannot carry a gun on school property. Not just inside the building, but parking lots, ball fields, etc. Off school property the law still applies if it is a school function, like a field trip or ball game at a public venue. If it is a school function then you have to treat that property like school property during the function.
There is no signage required... you see a school and you're supposed to know better.
The most notable exception, IMO is for licensed concealed carry while picking up or dropping off a student.
... and this doesn't even touch on the Federal 1,000 foot rule
With very few exceptions you cannot carry a gun on school property. Not just inside the building, but parking lots, ball fields, etc. Off school property the law still applies if it is a school function, like a field trip or ball game at a public venue. If it is a school function then you have to treat that property like school property during the function.
There is no signage required... you see a school and you're supposed to know better.
The most notable exception, IMO is for licensed concealed carry while picking up or dropping off a student.
... and this doesn't even touch on the Federal 1,000 foot rule
BigDave
Opt-Out Members
Is there an exception in the law if there are no signs posted that the law become null and void?
amzbrady
Regular Member
I'm confused (as usual)... Couldnt a college be concidered a school? A private school at that?
(1) It is unlawful for a person to carry onto, or to possess on, public or private elementary or secondary school premises, school-provided transportation, or areas of facilities while being used exclusively by public ...
or private schools:
(1) It is unlawful for a person to carry onto, or to possess on, public or private elementary or secondary school premises, school-provided transportation, or areas of facilities while being used exclusively by public ...
or private schools:
BigDave
Opt-Out Members
No "public or private elementary or secondary school premises" is what it covers.
Stretch
Regular Member
So are you saying if Elementary School XYZ is attending a public event, that too becomes a school event for all in attendance?
And it is NOT so clear cut. The park and the school share an open grass border, where does the school property end and the city property begin?
joeroket
Regular Member
If a school or district as a whole have exclusive rights to the property then you must treat it as school grounds.
If you are at the zoo and 3 schools are there on field trips they do not have exclusive use of the premises and you are free to carry your sidearm.
You will likely know if a place where you are/want to be is being used exclusively by the schools because you will have had to be invited or you will more than likely be turned away.
joejoejoe
Regular Member
College is not a secondary or elementary school ground. This law applies to K-12.
P.S. I still don't know if I can get arrested and thrown in prison, or fined, for carrying on a state college campus. State law regulates state campuses, but the only penalty they provide is that the college decides what happens to you.
Joe~
P.S. I still don't know if I can get arrested and thrown in prison, or fined, for carrying on a state college campus. State law regulates state campuses, but the only penalty they provide is that the college decides what happens to you.
Joe~
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sudden valley gunner
Regular Member
You can't be arrested, you can be trespassed, and not allowed back on your own school grounds.
joejoejoe
Regular Member
The whole trespass law doesn't make sense to me. Can they trespass me BEFORE asking me to leave? Do they have to ask me to leave, then I have to refuse, then they trespass me?
Joe~
Joe~
BigDave
Opt-Out Members
For the sake a clarity, SVG has it right, you cannot be arrested for being there, unless you refuse to leave.
sudden valley gunner
Regular Member
They can trespass you without you even being on the property.
This has happened here in Bellingham at WWU. From what I know and I don't know the whole story the student can't even figure out why he is trespassed other than the campus cops don't like him.
Think of it this way you see property with a sign on it saying "NO TRESPASSING" you are trespassed from that property, without setting foot there or without having any contact with the owners.
gogodawgs
Campaign Veteran
I am always looking for interpertation of this RCW.
My daughters are in H.S. sports. I often pick them up after softball or another sport or event. What if I arrive and the game is in extra innings? The law does not define how long 'picking up or dropping off' a student may take.
gogodawgs
Campaign Veteran
It varies by college. The UW code says that only a uniformed UWPD can ask you to leave. And only after that could you be trespassed.