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Thread: A bumper sticker to replace my NRA-logo sticker...

  1. #1
    Regular Member Ruger's Avatar
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    A bumper sticker to replace my NRA-logo sticker...

    COMMENTS REMOVED BY MODERATOR: No bashing other gun rights groups
    Carry on!

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    I didn't look at the sticker. You may get a yellow card

    (12) NO BASHING OF OTHER GUN RIGHTS ORGANIZATIONS: Regardless of how convinced you are that another gun rights organization is not doing their job, this is not the place to air those concerns unless they are specifically related to an anti-open carry position taken by that organization. All other rants against other gun rights groups will be deleted or the thread locked.

    NRA apologists deny anti-open carry position is taken.

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    Regular Member Ruger's Avatar
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    Here is the basis for my complaint - and YES, it DOES pertain to OC

    http://www.ncteaparty.com/2010/07/grnc_vs_nra_2/

    Also, I must cite the National Rifle Association's actions regarding the "Disclose" act.

    Here is how it pertains to OC: If the NRA, via their backroom deals, bamboozles their own constituency into helping to elect politicians who are not truly pro-2A (as the NRA would sometimes have us believe - read the linked article) then we are left with elected officials who are not truly pro-2A, let alone pro-OC.

    PS - Doug - How long would it have taken you to actually LOOK at the sticker. I figured that you of all people would have liked it
    Last edited by Ruger; 09-03-2010 at 01:49 PM.
    Carry on!

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    I think the sticker is disgusting.

    Not because it bashes the NRA. I really don't care one way or the other.

    I think it is disgusting because it diminishes the horrors committed by the Nazis and the Judenrat who were forced by the Nazis to betray other Jews--typically resulting in the deaths of these Jews.

    I really hope you reconsider putting this sticker on your car.

  5. #5
    Regular Member Ruger's Avatar
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    Eye95 - it is meant to be provocative. It is meant to get people's attention.

    Think outside the box. Look at some of the recent actions of the NRA. I don't trust them. They're in a great position to screw over a large number of gun owners across the country if they so choose. If a national gun registry ever came to pass, I don't know that I trust the NRA to not hand over their member lists to the Feds - hence the comparison.

    I don't mean to be disrespectful to Jews.
    Carry on!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruger View Post
    Eye95 - it is meant to be provocative. It is meant to get people's attention.

    Think outside the box. Look at some of the recent actions of the NRA. I don't trust them. They're in a great position to screw over a large number of gun owners across the country if they so choose. If a national gun registry ever came to pass, I don't know that I trust the NRA to not hand over their member lists to the Feds - hence the comparison.

    I don't mean to be disrespectful to Jews.
    You may not mean to be, but you are. Deliberately being provocative is no excuse for being so.

    Don't get me wrong. You have a right to produce that bumper sticker. And, I have a right to rebuke that sticker in the strongest possible terms. I hope you reconsider.

    BTW, you are not being provocative in a useful way. Notice that we are not discussing the NRA, but the bumper sticker's disrespect for the Jews who suffered horrifically at the hand of the Nazis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruger View Post
    Just created this at Vistaprint. Thinking about ordering a few. One for me, and a few for others who see that the NRA is nothing more than a "union" that does what unions do best - look out for themselves first, and their member's interests later.

    What do you guys think?
    Very offensive to Jews and non-Jews alike, as well as NRA members. The actions of the NRA pale in comparison to what the Nazis did; there simply is no comparison or a reason to compare them. I get that you don't like the NRA and there are things I don't agree with either, BUT, if it weren't for the NRA and it's past actions of standing up for gun rights, you might very well not be able to carry a gun today. For a very long time, they were the ONLY organization that did stand up for citizen's gun rights. You can come down off your high horse any time.
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    Regular Member simmonsjoe's Avatar
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    Very poor taste

    and a ludicrous comparison.
    illegal ≠ immoral legal ≠ moral
    [SIZE=1]"I never submitted the whole system of my opinions to the creed of any party of men whatever in religion, in philosophy, in politics, or in anything else where I was capable of thinking for myself. "Such an addiction is the last degradation of a free and moral agent." - Thomas Jefferson
    G19 Gen 4; Bersa Thunder 380; Sig Sauer P238; Kel-Tec su-16c

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    Regular Member buster81's Avatar
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    Really?
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  10. #10
    Regular Member Ruger's Avatar
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    All right. I'm scrapping it. Even though they did donate $4950 to Harry Reid's re-election fund http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/reci...?id=D000000082

    I was especially angry with them when I designed that, after having found the evidence of their donation, and then when I asked the NRA about it they said that they are not endorsing Reid - they said that is a contribution & not an endorsement (sounds like a bunch of doublespeak to me). Be that as it may...

    @ Ruby: As for the "come down off your high-horse" remark.... There's no need to make a personal attack against me. You gave the necessary feedback about the bumper sticker, and after taking your feedback into consideration along with others, I have altered my course of action. Insults, veiled or otherwise, are not welcome or necessary.

    I was looking for feedback on an idea, which I am now not going to implement. After having cooled down a bit, and seeing the reaction from folks here, I realize that this probably isn't the best thing to stick on my vehicle.

    Thank you to everyone for your valuable feedback. (well, except Ruby, perhaps)
    Carry on!

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    You are welcome. I hope you don't think that I was too harsh in my criticism. It was not directed at you.

    Thank you for scrapping the sticker. I understand your idea behind the analogy.

    The irony here is that some posters would say that my (and others') free speech regarding your free speech that helped change your mind was somehow a restriction on your freedom. However, I think this thread is the perfect illustration of free speech and how it is used to change the ideas of others sans force.

    Again, thank you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruger View Post
    All right. I'm scrapping it. Even though they did donate $4950 to Harry Reid's re-election fund http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/reci...?id=D000000082

    I was especially angry with them when I designed that, after having found the evidence of their donation, and then when I asked the NRA about it they said that they are not endorsing Reid - they said that is a contribution & not an endorsement (sounds like a bunch of doublespeak to me). Be that as it may...

    @ Ruby: As for the "come down off your high-horse" remark.... There's no need to make a personal attack against me. You gave the necessary feedback about the bumper sticker, and after taking your feedback into consideration along with others, I have altered my course of action. Insults, veiled or otherwise, are not welcome or necessary.

    I was looking for feedback on an idea, which I am now not going to implement. After having cooled down a bit, and seeing the reaction from folks here, I realize that this probably isn't the best thing to stick on my vehicle.

    Thank you to everyone for your valuable feedback. (well, except Ruby, perhaps)

    I made the comment about coming down off your high horse for your negative post concerning the NRA. That post of yours WAS an attack and was removed by the moderators. I was upset because you seem to think that you are so much better than the NRA and the fact that you have gun rights today is probably due to the work they have done in the past, so there was no need for you to put them down. It was a comment, not a personal attack on you. And I don't need your thanks for anything, you may keep it!
    Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens can change the world; it's the only thing that ever does.- Margaret Mead


    Those who will not fight for justice today will fight for their lives in the future,

    Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote. Benjamin Franklin

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruger View Post
    http://www.ncteaparty.com/2010/07/grnc_vs_nra_2/

    Also, I must cite the National Rifle Association's actions regarding the "Disclose" act.

    Here is how it pertains to OC: If the NRA, via their backroom deals, bamboozles their own constituency into helping to elect politicians who are not truly pro-2A (as the NRA would sometimes have us believe - read the linked article) then we are left with elected officials who are not truly pro-2A, let alone pro-OC.

    PS - Doug - How long would it have taken you to actually LOOK at the sticker. I figured that you of all people would have liked it

    If you're going to attack the NRA in such a manner, then you had better get in line with all the other "groups" as well. Every single one of them turns political and will start making decisions based on just that.

    It's exactly why the only people that should be allowed to donate campaign funds in any way are the individuals, I'd prefer it be the voters but someone would say that discriminates, and I'm not suggesting individuals that band together either.

  14. #14
    Regular Member rodbender's Avatar
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    I was too late to see the bumper sticker in question. Probably a good thing because the reactions of the members here show it must have been pretty disgusting.

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    Regular Member gsx1138's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    I think the sticker is disgusting.

    Not because it bashes the NRA. I really don't care one way or the other.

    I think it is disgusting because it diminishes the horrors committed by the Nazis and the Judenrat who were forced by the Nazis to betray other Jews--typically resulting in the deaths of these Jews.

    I really hope you reconsider putting this sticker on your car.
    Wow, I agree with you....I feel so dirty now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    SNIP You may not mean to be, but you are. Deliberately being provocative is no excuse for being so.
    +1

    I know the sticker issue is settled. I would like to address the underlying point about being provocative.

    A rattlesnake is provocative. That does not mean it is accepted. Meaning, a provocative message will get attention, but that does not mean people will accept the idea being conveyed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    You are welcome. I hope you don't think that I was too harsh in my criticism. It was not directed at you.

    Thank you for scrapping the sticker. I understand your idea behind the analogy.

    The irony here is that some posters would say that my (and others') free speech regarding your free speech that helped change your mind was somehow a restriction on your freedom. However, I think this thread is the perfect illustration of free speech and how it is used to change the ideas of others sans force.

    Again, thank you.

    Wait a minute, are you trying to say that one could use their free speech to advocate that someone or some group not do something, while still supporting their right to do so??? You mean that just because you advised him not to use the sticker (it was removed before I saw it) you weren't saying that he didn't have the right to?
    Last edited by END_THE_FED; 09-07-2010 at 04:34 AM.
    A wise and frugal Government, which shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government.- Thomas Jefferson March 4 1801

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    Quote Originally Posted by END_THE_FED View Post
    Wait a minute, are you trying to say that one could use their free speech to advocate that someone or some group not do something, while still supporting their right to do so??? You mean that just because you advised him not to use the sticker (it was removed before I saw it) you weren't saying that he didn't have the right to?
    That is precisely what I am saying.

  19. #19
    Regular Member Ruger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruby View Post
    I made the comment about coming down off your high horse for your negative post concerning the NRA. That post of yours WAS an attack and was removed by the moderators. I was upset because you seem to think that you are so much better than the NRA and the fact that you have gun rights today is probably due to the work they have done in the past, so there was no need for you to put them down.
    I'm not going to give the NRA leadership a free pass on their actions today on the basis of their good deeds of years past. Accountability still exists, and no gun rights organization should be donating $4950 to help re-elect a senator with Harry Reid's track record.
    Carry on!

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